More MPG with Shell???

It probably due to the fact that Shell is a top tier gasoline and your engine is a bit cleaner that giving the extra mpg

 

I have noticed a 4-5 MPG decrease in MPG when i am running on non-shell gas. i drive about 16 miles at 55mph to work. i've been using my cruise control starting at the same place and writing down my MPG at the exact same place trying to figure out what the best speed for my route is. this is how i stumbled on the shell gas phenomenon. i'll be posting a graph when i get enough data.

 

I suppose its possible in some places. One NM distributor mixed up diesel with unleaded gas, just about all gas stations including Shell were pumping diesel, with predictable results. Believe what you like. I usually buy Shell (or whatever) from Costco where its less expensive!!

 

Could it be that Shell puts less Ethanol into the regular gas? Less Ethanol=more energy, right?

 

I think that's possible.

I've also heard lately that higher octane fuel lowers the Prius MPG, and conversely, lower octane (to a point) may improve MPG.

Perhaps Shell is slightly lower octane ?

Or their octane modifiers and/or other additives somehow work better with the Prius Atkinson cycle ICE ?

Is this a Prius specific phenomenon ?

 

i could be wrong, but i highly doubt Shell would be running less ethanol. they were one of the few that were pushing for it so heavily early on and (one of) the first companies to proactively advertise their use of 10% ethanol...

but i've been wrong before... :wink:

 

The amount of ethanol used is a federally mandated thing (not up to Shell) but more to the point Shell (any grade) is a few more cents per gallon in these parts, is it elsewhere ?

 

Shell has a good deal with that 5% credit card--wish I used more gas. LOL.

 

I have three Shell stations near me.
One has a sign that they have 10% ethanol. I've used that one, and got less MPG.
Number Two, I get less gas mileage, for some unknown reason (owner swears his doesn't have ethanol).
The third is where I usually fill up, and get the best MPG with. No ethanol notification sign.

 

!?!?

What is the federal mandate? I still see plenty of stations in WI and IN that rather proudly advertise they have No Ethanol.

 

Not all locals use E10 Ethanol Plant Clean Air Act Enforcement Initiative | Compliance and Enforcement | US EPA
wonder if Rae is in such an area or not (price difference ) ?

 

Sorry to be pushing the "mandate" question!

The federal mandate is not that all gasoline contain 10% ethanol, but that gasoline (auto fuels) contain increasing amounts of "renewable fuels" each year. Some states are really pushing this. Minnesota is a leader in this area. In recent years, Minnesota had been producing as much as 20% of the national production of ethanol for use in fuels. This is one reason the State of Minnesota has its own regulations concerning the use of ethanol and other renewable fuels. Good luck finding non-ethanol gasoline in Minnesota!!

 

All Shell ordinary (i.e. non-E85) gas has at least 8% ethanol and no more than 10%, across the USA.

The reason is that Shell is one of the Top Tier gas makers which is an initiative by some automobile makers and some gasoline makers to insure cars are getting gas *above* the EPA mandated LAC (lowest additive concentrate) for engine deposit control. Deposits on the intake valves and combustion chamber can reduce power and gas mileage and increase pollutions (hence EPA involvement) and increase the engines need for Octane rating.

This EPA LAC is viwed by some car manufacturers as too little so they got together with some gas makers and started the "Top Tier" gas program which has a stricter deposit control level than the EPA minimum. Sell gas is one of the participants. Part of the requirements is that top tier gas have between 8% and 10% ethanol. See here .

Rumple

 

What I wrote above is WRONG, WRONG, WRONG! Upon further research it turns out that the ethanol specified in the base gasoline, along with the other attributes of the base gasoline is to insure that the additives can work even with a non-ideal base. Ethanol can increase some types of deposits so in order to be a tier one gas, the additives must work with 8% to 10% ethanol - a tougher job than without it, apparently.

So, Shell gas, and any other tier one maker may or may not be E10, but the additive package will be shown to work in either case. Sorry for the confusion.

Rumple

 

Most interesting thread.

Back in the late 60s, I was driving a BMW 2002, and IIRC, the car got better
mileage with Shell "with Platformate."

It turns out that the Shell advertising campaign for Platformate is now
considered a classic for it subtle misrepresentations, see these sites:

Oil and Petroleum Commercials: Super Shell

Crossfire Forums, Galleries - CrossfireCommunity.net

Say Anything: North Dakota's Most Popular Political Blog

Any way, I dont know if Shell still uses "Platformate" -- by this I mean
it's current additive package -- but after reading the posts here, I'm going to
try Shell again. Thanks

 

If you live more than about 50 miles from a refinery, then it's unlikely that you or the gas station owner knows who actually refined the gasoline. Except in their immediate local market, refineries deliver gasoline to pipelines for transportation. It's much cheaper and more practical than trucking. But, pipelines are expensive, so there tend to be only one or two serving any particular area. Because of that they're heavily regulated (by FERC). The bottom line is that once the gasoline is delivered to the pipeline, in almost all cases (there are a few exceptions), it gets blended with everyone else's gasoline. It comes out the other end at a bulk tank farm, where it is segregated by grade, but not by refiner. Since refiners deliver to the pipeline by tankload, the tank at the other end may end up with all Texaco gas this week. But the pipeline companies don't specify, and next week that same tank could be filled with stuff refined by Shell. It's all just plain gasoline that meets the appropriate standard.

What about additives? The refiners deliver plain (called "base") gasoline to the pipelines, their proprietary additives make up far less than one percent by volume. The additives are generally trucked to the sales location. At the tank farm truck rack a Chevron truck may pull up right next to a Shell truck and fill from the same tank. The Chevron truck driver adds a couple of containers of Techron additive, the Shell guy adds a couple of containers of their additive. Until that little bit of additive gets put in, it's all the same base gasoline. Afterwards, it's brand specific. Where ethanol is used that can make a difference between brands, as ethanol is also frequently blended at the delivery end rather than at the refinery end. So, Shell may specify that the pipeline operator blend in 10% ethanol before delivery, while Tesoro may blend in a different manner. But, for the 80% of us or so who are not served directly from the refinery, it's almost impossible to know who refined the gas, and, in any given week it is very likely that the base gasoline at all the stations in your neighborhood came from the same place.

One theory on changing brands has it that different additives do a better job at different kinds of engine deposits. So, if you normally run Chevron gas (with Techron) there are some deposits that it just doesn't get. When you switch brands you clean up some of those deposits (while leaving new ones behind) and that improves your gas mileage temporarily. I've seen recommendations to change brands on a regular basis to get this variation in cleaning ability. I don't know about that, I've only heard the theory. But I worked in pipeline controls for 12 years, and I do know how they handle product. Except for the additives, what you see on the station sign has nothing to do with who refined the gas, the marketing and the refining are completely separate operations.

 

Thanks Popeye for the education on gasoline transportation and delivery. Interesting read for sure!

Rumpe

 

I get the same results with Shell also. I had used Speedway for years, but got Shell for the first time about a month and a half ago because I was below E and it was the only station near where I was. I was surprised to see that when I filled up the next time and calculated my mileage, it was 2 MPG more than normal. Shell is usually a little more expensive than Speedway, but I'll pay to have a tank last a little longer!

 

Anyone use Conoco? The Jag absolutely loved it and would get excelent mileage. Too bad there's none out here in the west, just a southeastern thing I guess.

 

What Popeye wrote. People seeing MPG differences are actually seeing differences in pump metering or random correlations in small samples of noisy data (affected by ambient temperatures, variations in driving technique, route, traffic conditions, signal timing...).