New Ford Focus commercial targets Prius

and no one has mentioned that with the Focus that it comes with an air pump instead of a spare tire standard. The spare is an option.

 

New base model Prius here costs $37,400 RRP and has since the 2004 came out. I paid $24,900 for my 2004 about a year ago with 61,000 kilometres on the odometer. My 2004 Prius gets as good or better fuel economy as a 2007 or 2008 model and it cost $12,500 less and my price includes on road costs but the new price I quoted does not so add another $1,500ish to that.

 

There are just too many subjective factors to make it strictly a financial decision. However, as noted, to be most accurate all costs should be brought forward to determine a "net present value". I think the Prius is "The best midsize car" sold, by a long shot. BUT it doesn't handle like an Audi A4 Quatro in the snow, I cant park it as easily as a SMART car, it's initial cost is much higher than a Focus (especially in the current market), and on and on. The financials and TCO is only one part of the equation. Getting an accurate TCO requires a lot of assumptions, and everyone can argue about every assumption.

 

It's a FORD ... "Fix Or Repair Daily"

I have owned many in the past... they lost me as customer years ago - until they meet or reach Toyota's reputation.

Proud Prius owner... they forgot to also mention the time the Focus will be off the road with maintenance and repairs..vs the Prius.

Hands down Prius wins... as for the $ 7,000.00 difference.. let's see who's car in 5 years is worth more a Ford or a Toyota...

I rest my case... "In Toyota we trust"

 

I remember my dad's old Lincoln Continental (basically a luxury Ford): he bought it in 1990 when Lexus was new and it was all the rage, so everybody who had luxury cars were selling them to buy Lexus. My dad bought the used 1989 Lincoln for 50% of the price of a brand one at a Lexus dealership. The car had a 5 year warranty, and my dad did all the required maintenance, but it was like a time bomb: in 1994, one or two months after the warranty expired EVERYTHING started going bad the Continental: transmission, engine, power steering, the electronic suspension, the power seats, etc. Talk about planned obsolescence, Ford has it down to a science! My dad ended up taking it to a Toyota dealership and traded it for a Toyota Avalon, and kept that car until 2004, no major problems. That was the worst experience we had with American cars, but others came close. By the way, the Toyota dealership gave him $4000 for his 5 year old Lincoln. He got over $6000 when he traded his 10-year old Avalon.

 

I thought Ford reliability issues had been resolved. I remember a commercial not too long ago by Ford saying "Our quality is now equal with Toyota's." I'm assuming quality meant reliability. Well, I'm glad people are choosing small cars over SUVs that they won't fully utilize most of the time.

 

I'd think quality = fewer build defects (doors, hoods aligned correctly, etc) more than it means long-term reliability.

 

Ford's initial quality may = Toyota but give um time ... (FORD = driver returns on foot ((backwards)))

 

Initial or apparent quality is only important when you're renting a car.

 

Hi All,

I basically like Ford cars. But, they just let the purchasing people get out of hand. The crap parts they are putting in these cars is going to be their downfall. They need better specifications on everything. Which is why a Ford hybrid might break with the past. No more who can make the cheapest alternator, lets buy that one! It ll be a custom MG1 that does that job, and there will be no wheelin dealin to see who has the least service life part to put in the car.

My Tempo had the alternators going every 9 months. And the steering rack was mounted on a part that slotted (too think sheet metal) due to the back and forth action of the steering loads. The trans needed work at 75 K miles, and that cost 2K back in the 1990's.

 

No matter what the stats say, all you have to do to see the REAL quality of a car is work on it. Having worked on many, many cars I can say without a doubt that Ford is no where near Toyota. It's not even close. The quality of design is not there in just about every component in the vehicle, major and minor. There is no contest, and it is easy to see why the older a car gets, the more reliable a Toyota becomes compared to other cars.

And this goes back many, many years. Even in the early 70's, looking at the fit and finish of a Toyota vs. Ford, GM and Chrysler. The fit of the body panels, the gaps between the body and the doors, trunk lid etc. The american cars very often had shims and spacers, and absolutely horrific variations in gaps between body panels. The Toyota's had very very good tolerances, comparatively. Same goes for the engine, the tolerances on the Toyota engines were far, far exceeding the american cars. Not to mention the use of semi exotic materials at the time, forged pistons, crank and rods. The downfall was the poor quality steel Toyota used, it was not refined correctly and rusted like mad as a result.

Granted, technology has improved tremendously in American cars in many respects, but quality runs in the DNA of a car maker. Ford and others are still no Toyota. And the sure way you can tell which vehicle is #1 is how many times the competitor puts their name in advertising. The Prius has to be the most obvious target, all you hear is, better than the Prius, when it comes out it will better than The Prius. Only problem is the Prius is a moving target, by the time you get close the new model will be out and the cycle will start all over again.

 

One of the family's other car is a Ford Focus hatchback, manual transmission absolutely equipped with NOTHING (the way to go to get full efficiency in a vehicle imo). I mean it doesn't have cruise control, power windows, its baseline baseline. The new Focus comes with some nice touches like the Bluetooth etc.

I can't even remember what we paid for it $8,000? Maybe closer to $9 after taxes/warranty brand spanking new. BESIDES the 08 Prius (what we do not have yet) the focus is my favorite car. I like it more than the 05' Prius we also have. I like the zippy feeling that comes from an incredibly light, small, manny. Driving the way I *like* to drive - they get relatively the same FE.

I've never had a problem with cars/breakdowns/need for replacement parts in the long line of Fords, Chryslers and Pontiacs we've owned. It really is how well you take care of a vehicle, even the typically crappier American cars. I've driven a Chrysler New Yorker (typically crappy cars) into the ground and at over 200,000 miles it's made the initial cost well worth it.

If the current focus was a hybrid hands down would have gotten it. But as of now the Prius is the most interesting car on the market! Just waiting for American car companies to catch up and make the race more interesting!

 

CA Focus have a PZEV engine which as you know is very clean burning

 

Euro versions always look better. Take the Puma and the Cougar for instance. Puma MUCH nicer.

 

Yep...Jim Skinner Ford, another reason for never owning a Ford.

 

All one has to do is read consumer reports car issue.

 

Yes, in general I would have to agree... but remember - advertisers sometimes get favorable reviews even in Consumer Reports.
Editors and writers can be bought.

It is best to do your own research and talk to fellow owners and threads on the item on the Internet.

"History can be created, but it can never be re-created." John Stiles 1947

 

As far as I recall Consumer Reports does not accept advertising. They are funded solely on subscriptions, the intent being to keep the reviews as fair as possible.

FWIW here are the CR/EPA numbers:

Combined Interior Volume (cuft, highest to lowest):
Prius:- 112
Fit:--- 111
Focus:- 107
Aveo:-- 103
Cobalt: 100

Base MSRP (lowest to highest):
Aveo:-- $12,020
Fit:--- $13,950
Cobalt: $14,225
Focus:- $14,395
Prius:- $21,500

Cost to Own over 5 years (lowest to highest):
Fit:--- $26,750
Aveo:-- $26,750
Prius:- $28,500
Focus:- $31,750
Cobalt: $31,750

CR Overall Score: (highest to lowest):
Prius:- 68
Fit:--- 65
Focus:- 65
Cobalt: 50
Aveo:-- 33

Owner Satisfaction (highest to lowest):
Prius:- 92
Fit:--- 81
Focus:- 55
Cobalt: 45
Aveo:-- 44

CO2 Output (tons, lowest to highest):
Prius:- 4.0
Fit:--- 6.3
Focus:- 6.6
Cobalt: 7.1
Aveo:-- 7.1

Annual Fuel Costs (lowest to highest):
Prius:- $1328
Fit:--- $2111
Focus:- $2185
Cobalt: $2356
Aveo:-- $2356

CO output US/CA (g/mi, lowest to highest):
Prius:- 0.1/0.1
Fit:--- 0.3/0.3
Aveo:-- 0.54/0.54
Focus:- 0.8/0.3
Cobalt: 1.2/0.6

Nox Output US/CA (g/mi, lowest to highest):
Focus:- 0.00/0.00
Prius:- 0.01/0.01
Cobalt: 0.02/0.00
Aveo:-- 0.039/0.039
Fit:--- 0.04/0.04

NMOG Output US/CA (g/mi, lowest to highest):
Prius:- 0.009/0.009
Focus:- 0.021/0.007
Cobalt: 0.032/0.006
Fit:--- 0.044/0.044
Aveo:-- 0.052/0.052

IMHO the focus is not a bad car. If I had to buy a small American car, that would probably be it. Other than that, I can't see it as any real choice compared to a Prius.

Rob

 

Of course its probably more fair to compare the Prius against mid-sized vehicles:

Combined Interior Volume (cuft, highest to lowest):
Fusion: 117
Matrix: 116
Prius:- 112
Malibu: 111
Avenger:110
Jetta:- 107

Base MSRP (lowest to highest):
Matrix: $16,190
Jetta:- $16,990 ($21,990 '09 TDI)
Fusion: $18,135
Avenger:$18,910
Malibu: $19,345
Prius:- $21,500

Cost to Own over 5 years (lowest to highest):
Prius:- $28,500
Matrix: $32,500
Malibu: $33,500
Fusion: $33,750
Jetta:- $36,250
Avenger:$43,500

CR Overall Score: (highest to lowest):
Malibu: 77
Matrix: 72
Jetta:- 72
Fusion: 69
Prius:- 68
Avenger:46

Owner Satisfaction (highest to lowest):
Prius:- 92
Malibu: 81 (Aura)
Fusion: 69
Jetta:- 65
Matrix: NR
Avenger:NR

CO2 Output (tons, lowest to highest):
Prius:- 4.0
Matrix: 6.8
Jetta:- 7.3 (6.4 '09 TDI)
Malibu: 7.3
Avenger:7.7
Fusion: 8.0

Annual Fuel Costs (lowest to highest):
Prius:- $1,328
Matrix: $2,264
Malibu: $2,448
Avenger:$2,552
Jetta:- $2,586 ($2,132 '09 TDI)
Fusion: $2,662

CO output US/CA (g/mi, lowest to highest):
Prius:- 0.1/0.1
Matrix: 0.3/0.3
Jetta:- 0.37/0.37
Fusion: 1.0/0.2
Avenger:1.4/0.3
Malibu: 2.5/2.5

Nox Output US/CA (g/mi, lowest to highest):
Prius:- 0.01/0.01
Avenger:0.01/0.00
Malibu: 0.01/0.01
Jetta:- 0.029/0.029
Matrix: 0.03/0.03
Fusion: 0.06/0.01

NMOG Output US/CA (g/mi, US lowest to highest):
Prius:- 0.009/0.009
Fusion: 0.014/0.007
Matrix: 0.023/0.023
Jetta:- 0.029/0.029
Malibu: 0.036/0.036
Avenger:0.044/0.006

Rob