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First Breakdown

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by bradnunn, Nov 5, 2004.

  1. inventor00

    inventor00 Active Member

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    Battery issues discussed at this thread- reprogramming ECU- software upgrade for battery issues:

    "http://priuschat.com/forums/2-vt4069.html?start=20

    This TSB applies to all 2004 Prii and states, "The information contained in this TSB supercedes TSB No. EG027–04. TSB No. EG027–04 is now obsolete and should be discarded.
     
  2. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

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    Well, can you even buy a new car that doesn't have some sort of computer control? I'm referring to a motor with "up integrated" ignition or coil-per-cylinder, temp sensors, MAP and barometric pressure sensors, O2 sensors, TPS, mass air, knock, crank angle, cam angle, etc etc. The automatic transmission has shift solenoids and reluctor rings to determine shaft speed, and pressure sensors to determine line pressure. Most automatic 4WD systems, such as the AutoTrac in the 2000 GMC Sierra I used to own, have additional reluctor rings to determine front shaft speed and front/rear shaft speed difference (About every 4 months my display would flash SERVICE 4WD in scary amber letters). True, the Prius carries system integration to a new level. A neighbor of mine in the condo I live in has a 2004 BMW 745iL with that insane IDrive system, his is ALWAYS broken. Another guy I know is in the construction business and he purchased a new 2003 GMC Sierra 2500HD with the Vortec 8.1 V8. Among other things, this motor has a drive-by-wire throttle, same as our Prius. Things worked fine until he installed one of those high-power shortwave radios in the truck to talk to drivers at remote sites beyond cell service. The first time he keyed the mic, the motor misfired then died in city traffic and refused to restart. Whenever my GM AutoTrac went insane, it defaulted into 2WD and I could never drive out of my vacation property in winter, as I would helplessly spin trying to make the steep hills. I just wish the engineers would prototype these systems a lot better, God knows you can easily buy test software to do this, or just write your own. Cripes!
     
  3. bradnunn

    bradnunn Junior Member

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    Re: First Breakdown/ More odd prius behavior

    On my way to work this morning (11/12/04) I stopped for gas. I filled up about a mile from work and was able to start normally and drive on to work without incident. I pulled into a parking space stopped and pressed the power button. It seemed to power down normally. However, when I took my foot off the brake to get out of the car, the normal dash lights came back on (they had just turned off) and the vehicle began to roll backward (the parking spot was very slightly uphill). I stepped back on the brake. The transmission was now in neutral and when I tried to put it back into drive to pull back forward it would not come out of neutral. I pressed Park and it did go into park and operated normally thereafter. These continued oddities concern me. Anybody else had this happen? :?
     
  4. TonyPSchaefer

    TonyPSchaefer Your Friendly Moderator
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    Never happened to me.
    But it sounds like just punching the (Power) button isn't engaging the Park function. I hope that when you got home this evening you hit [Park] before (Power) to force it into Park. Try doing that for a little while before you go back to just punching (Power).
     
  5. finman

    finman Senior Member

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    I found the page that states to shift to "N" when the aux. 12 V battery is disconnected, then reconnected. Page 138, section 'i'. Not sure what to make of it.

    The short version is after reconnecting the aux battery, shift to N and confirm it's in N when the IG-ON mode is enabled.

    So I think I did that. I reconnected the aux. battery, then pressed power with my foot on the brake, shifted to N, then pressed park. How are you supposed to shift to N BEFORE you press power?

    Anyway, I have had no reoccurence of any red triangles of doom or VSC lights, nothing. Could have been a computer gremlin. I get those in my home machine, and work, and everywhere in between!
     
  6. TonyPSchaefer

    TonyPSchaefer Your Friendly Moderator
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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(finman\";p=\"50546)</div>
    Did you forget to wash your hands after touching a Windows machine? You know that's how computer viruses are spread, right? Especially this year with a shortage of vaccines.

    Always wash your hands between computers!
     
  7. tag

    tag Senior Member

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    [sniff]..........hmmmm......I smell a Mac user. :p
     
  8. HTMLSpinnr

    HTMLSpinnr Super Moderator
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    My wife's '02 had the Triangle of doom today along w/ the red car/! mark on the screen. She reported that it was sputtering and running quite rough.

    Gas tank was at 1 bar, and it ran rough for me when I had moved it from the driveway to the street.

    Funny though, I started it tonight and it ran much better - and then a few more starts after that, the screen msg said "problem solved", and the icons disappeared. 3 more restarts and the CEL on the dash disappeared as well.

    I'm thinking it was a bad bit of gas, almost running out, or the recent wet weather here in the PHX area contributed somehow. I could smell somewhat unburned fuel in the exhaust as if it were an ignition miss at the time.

    For now I'll consider it a fluke, but if it happens again, I'll have it checked. Not exactly looking forward to a post-warranty repair, though I have a feeling this would be covered under the 5/60k powertrain warranty.
     
  9. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

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    By law, OBD2 compliant vehicles like your older Prius must keep track of "Misfire History." If you think it was due to bad/low fuel, and the problem cleared after a few ignition cycles, you should be fine. Although the system will keep the codes in memory, it should drive normally. My local Toyota dealer offers a free scan of Toyota cars that have the MIL on or reported MIL on. Otherwise, it's up to you to determine if it makes sense to pay somebody to retrieve the codes. Although any scan tool offers basic OBD2, the car makers have a lot of unique functions and codes that can only be interrogated by a specific manufacturer-approved scan tool. Remember the 2004 and up also use CANbus (Controller Area Network). I shudder, I've encountered enough CAN problems in Process Automation.
     
  10. bradnunn

    bradnunn Junior Member

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    Re: First Breakdown Resolved! (I hope)+Nav DVD+Brake switch

    After emailing info to my dealer about the nature of the ongoing small glitches, I was asked to bring my car back in for a check. This time I was provided with a rental (a large black Tahoe that averaged 14.7 mpgs but the dealer covered the gas too). The dealer had been in touch with Toyota about my issues and they suspected a problem with the 12v battery. When they went to check it out, they discovered that the positive connector was loose. They claim that this would account for all of my symptoms. They tightened the connector and kept it overnight to try it. They believe that the problem is resolved. I picked it up this morning and so far, I have no reason to doubt them. I have never tampered with the battery connections. I picked up my car new from the Nashville auto show Feb 1, 04. The battery had been disconnected for the show. I drove it directly off the show floor. My theory is that they never tightened it adequately after the auto show.
    Even though I haven't yet gotten any letter from Toyota, I asked about the nav DVD update and they went ahead and ordered it for me. In addition they informed me of a brake light switch campaign (SSC 40L) and ordered the part for it as well. I am pleased with the dealer. (Beaman Toyota Nashville).
     
  11. bbangert

    bbangert New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(htmlspinnr\";p=\"50788)</div>
    I had the same exact thing happen to me tonight (2004 Prius). Unlike your post however, I had over half a tank of gas. I was sitting in stop-and-go traffic when those two lights came on and the MFD had the car with the ! on it. As the manual says to stop driving it immediately and contact the dealer, I (gasp!) did just that. Moved off to the side of the road first of course.

    My dealer had no idea what to do, apparently no one had told them Prius owners that decided to follow the manual might actually call them. No one at the service center as it was after their service center had closed. This presented me with a very troubling situation.

    What the hell do you do if one of those lights come on ordering you to stop immediately, and you're nowhere near a dealer? I realize maybe if this particular set is a engine burp or something, you can restart it a few times. But some of the other icons are downright scary (brake system failure, etc.)

    How can you take the car on a road trip if you always have to watch your distance to the closest dealership? What happens if your car breaks down in the middle of the night?

    I realize that in the future all cars will be loaded with electronics, and probably only specialized places will be able to deal with them. I'm not sure I want to be on the bleeding edge anymore though. If you're on a road trip and this happens, say 300 miles from the nearest dealer, it's going to suck.... A LOT. Wheras most little gas shop service centers can handle things like brake problems, etc. that require trained service people with lots o computers for a Prius.

    Heck, now that I remember it, even the Toyota dealership service center can't handle the issues. They told me whenever a system goes weird, they upload it to some experts somewhere else, and typically just replace every computer chip related to what failed.

    Given the amount of money I sunk into this, I'm rather disappointed that the dealer was clueless. I'll see what they say after looking at it tomorrow.
     
  12. Elars

    Elars New Member

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    This looks like the proper place to post my sad story. I have an 03 Prius. Last year I had the Triangle light come on with the !car light on the MFD. I was able to reset the light using a Davis Carchip and the lights reset and I didn't see the problem again ...... until a few weeks ago. I reset the lights again and all was well. Last week the lights again came on. I drove to work. After work, the car started fine and all warning lights were off. The last attack was today. Drove around the block, shut down engine, restarted engine and all lights except the check engine light had reset. In all cases, engine seemed to run normally and gas mileage was normal.

    The only common denominator I could come up with was that the outside air temps were cold (Michigan Winter has Arrived). Have any others had these symptoms? Any theories on the cause?

    Any help will be appreciated.

    Also, I am trying to order the mini-scanner from Ecrostech. Has anyone had experience with this? Apparently they won't make another "batch" until enough orders are placed.

    The Davis Carchip reads out a code that is not a Toyota recognized code.
     
  13. jayman

    jayman Senior Member

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    Why are you resetting the codes yourself on a 2003? Isn't the warranty still in effect? By resetting the codes yourself, you may very well void the warranty.

    Every car and pickup truck I've ever had, while on warranty I've only done routine servicing IOW oil changes. I let the dealer handle any issues, which are then documented so I can Cover My A** if something DOES break.

    If I still have my Prius off warranty, I may be tempted to look at the software, maybe reverse engineer some of it. In the meantime, there is no way I'd do anything more than a routine oil change to it.
     
  14. richard schumacher

    richard schumacher shortbus driver

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    You want help? Take it to a Toyota dealer. A Prius service tech at least has a chance of reading the codes correctly, diagnosing the problem, and fixing it.

    Sheesh.
     
  15. mbp

    mbp New Member

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    I had the doom lights come on at 10:30 at night on my way home last night, December 25, 2004. My prius up til now has been fantastic, with no hints of this kind of a problem. In fact I have never had a car do this on me before. I was also expecting to leave on a trip today so all my plans are now cancelled and I guess I contact the dealer about this tomorrow morning. What a bummer!!!!!

    I do appreciate all the posts on "Priuschat", the fact that I am not alone is informative.
     
  16. richard schumacher

    richard schumacher shortbus driver

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    Please let us know how it turns out.
     
  17. mongo

    mongo Junior Member

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    We had the doom lights and the rapidly draining battery issue back in the summer when it was still nice and warm here in Michigan. It was trailered to the dealer where it started up just fine, thanks, with no sign of a problem whatsoever. The dealer reloaded the software, just to be sure. No problems until now, but we just haven't trusted it the way we did before.

    Now we're having a "sleepy display" issue (started another post) where the display doesn't come on or act normal for the first few minutes of driving. We love our car, but this isn't helping our confidence in it.