Hydrogen Highway? Truth be told.

Soon hydrogen will join zeppelins, moving sidewalks, monorails, flying cars, and jet belts on the ash heap of transportation history.

 

The article seems to indicate the failure is a supply and demand thing - who's gonna buy the cars if there's nowhere to fill them up, and who's gonna build 'gas' stations without any customers. The hydrogen highway should fail, but there are better reasons. Even if hydrogen is still being considered as a long term solution, at least the suggestion's been made that electricity is the way to go.

 

The key thing to realize is that the money was turned away ....if the article is correct. Companies only do that because they think the liability risk is not worth the reward.

 

We need to acknowledge our present transportation "system" is broken. We should invest in robust and sustainable transportation based on renewables (wind, solar, hydro, conservation) not individual vehicles. These need to be human-centered convenient vehicles (bicycles, walking, light and high speed rail, etc.).

As discussed by others, hydrogen is a hoax, and at best 30 years off. If hydrogen is true, I can split water at my house via photovoltaics and store and compress hydrogen to be used residentially or for transportation.

 

Not only that, but I think companies are realizing that people are waking up to and liking the idea of 'fueling up' in your garage while you sleep beats driving down to the station at 6:30am on a rainy Monday morning on your way to work because you forgot to fill up over the weekend.

 

I doubt I'll see a "hydrogen highway" in my lifetime.

 

The sad thing is Norway is actually going to have a hydrogen highway soon. The company called Hydro over there specializes in hydrogen production and they are going to line a stretch of highway with hyrdogen filling stations and call it the HyNor. They have hydrogen pumps that can be stand alone and are about the size of a refreidgerator with a solar panel on top to provide the required electricity to seperate the water into oxygen and hydrogen. I wish the US would get with it and at least attempt something like this, but it seems that the oil companies have their hands too deep into politics.

 

Even governments make mistakes. The math between electric efficiency and H2 efficiency is clear.....and the difference is big.

In the summer you can stop, get your three grams of H2 and go a kilometer down to the next HyNor station.

 

True, but I just wish our government would be more aggressive with the whole oil dependancy issue. It seems quite clear that the automobile companies are having issues with the lithium batteries and even with them EV cars like the Volt look to have a max distance around 40 miles. That isn't enough for some people that and our grid is powered by facilities that use fossil fuels to make the electricity, so we are still oil dependent. There is no perfect solution it seems, but I really like the idea of having the stand alone hydrogen producing units that can be solar powered, it is thinking like that that may help solve our problem but our government sure doesn't seem willing to help. They already retracted the Toyota Hybrid tax credits because they sold too many, so instead of rewarding those who choose a Prius( as we all know with the best fuel economy) they take the credit away because it was too popular. I know money makes the world go around, but unless our government actually takes the issue seriously we could be in trouble, I mean fossil fuels go into everything from gas, electrivity, to the plastics we use everyday and we should be doing everything we can to cut down on consumption but alas we still see the huge SUVs rolled out, no MPG marks to meet, retraction of tax incentives to buy the best hybrids on the markets, and of course not even a glimpse of hydrogen fueling centers. Like I said there isn't a perfect solution but I just wish our governemt would give it a glance but it seems that crude money runs too deep in their veins. On a side note, have any of you seen the Air Car? It is rather interesting little car that runs on compressed air and they are putting a electric motor on board that will recompress air as you drive, it is a good thought.

 

The sad thing is that Norway has wasted money on a scheme which un-necessarily worsens global warming. They will shut it down within a few years. Oh well, better them than us.

 

Government rarely leads so place your trust on youself to do the right thing. Focus on what you can do and vote with your wallet at every chance. The Prius and Tesla are wildly successful and have kicked GM to start working the Volt. Government did not do this. Smart Car buyers did this. You are a buyer.

Actually, get out and rent "Who Killed the Electric Car". It should become clear that when GM wanted an electric car, they made a good one.

The electric car is very close to perfect since once the solar/renewable energy electric infrastructure is in place, both You and I can solve the problem directly. One of the reasons that H2 as a "Green" technology is so despised by many on Priuschat (like me) is that it is very wasteful of our resources. H2 in reality would come from Natural Gas for a long time. (This little detail is hidden very well.) By the time Solar plants could make H2 directly, electric cars or PHEVs will be available.

 

Don't believe everything you read LiquidDonut.

Well, FL_Prius_Driver, apparently this "little detail" is soooooo very well hidden . . . they hid it at the Sacramento Municipal District campus and within view of Highway 50 . . . about a mile from where I live. I went and took a picture of it for you tonight.

And what logo is that on that solar/hydrogen fueling station? Yep. It belongs to big, bad, 'hands too deep into politics' BP.

SMUD.org | Community & Environment | Hydrogen Q&A
http://www.smud.org/news/releases/07archive/10_29_07_solarporthydrogen.pdf

 

Thanks for the picture. I did notice this little piece of info on the web link:
"The station will not be open to the public and will be limited to use by SMUD and State of California fuel cell vehicles. Approximately two to three vehicles a day are expected to refuel at the facility, causing no impacts to local traffic." I will not deny that H2 is a favorite of governments and auto companies. Apparently this is all bought and financed by our tax dollars, but not for our use. (Two vehicles a day????-That'll scare the bejesus out of the oil companies.) Were you supporting or opposing the original point?

 

Supporting? . . . Neither, both.

For safety reasons, the project is limiting the amount of hydrogen stored on site will be the equivalent of 50 gallons of gasoline - so yes, only two or three vehicles per day.

Don't be so quick to rule out solar/hydrogen as a viable option in the future.

1) It's producing new energy, not just converting natural gas or other forms of existing energy.

2) Solar panels are getting, and will become, vastly cheaper and more efficient.

3) Unless a battery powered car is hooked to the solar panels during daylight hours, charging an electric vehicle will still require the electricity produced at the solar panels to first be converted into another form prior to charging the car batteries - most likely on-site batteries or indirectly via charging later from a non-solar sourced, net metering payback, grid connection. So, battery power won't necessarily be THE most efficient form of totally non-polluting automobile.

Me personally, I feel all forms of non-polluting energy production and utilization need to be investigated. So no, I'm not going to badmouth hydrogen . . . especially when we STILL don't have the technology needed to make battery powered cars the best option for all circumstances.

 

I'm a 100% supporter of solar. In fact it is the only path ultimately. It is the continuing waste of time and money on H2 for cars that is irritating. It just does not make technical, financial, or safety sense to use H2 as intermediate energy carrier.

Sure we have the technology. Tesla is selling them now. We do have a bunch of auto makers who are not using the technology. For example, is the reason GM does not have a 50mpg hybrid because they do not want to have one or that the technology is unavailable to them?

 

Certainly have been on the Tesla web site a lot. I think it emphasises the point that even before the first delivery, the wait list is now at three years!! It's the transmission which has been the major delaying item, not the battery....but they have decided to delay no longer and get it out with a viable, but not perfect transmission. When asked about H2, Telsa laughs at the stupidity. They sincerely hope that the major manufacturers continue to waste effort on a dead end while they capture market share.