Mileage figures go downhill for 2008

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(poleikleng @ Nov 29 2007, 07:35 AM) [snapback]545602[/snapback]</div>

I believe this to be a good thing. I purchased my prius less than a month ago. I expected to get about 45-46mpg. I have only filled the tank once but calculating that tank I got 50mpg. My second tank should be about the same. So I am really happy I'm getting better mileage then expected. Now I might not be so happy if I had purchased the car expecting 55mpg and only got 50..

 

If the underlying design hasn't changed, once it breaks in, high
50s should still be easily achieved.
.
_H*

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hobbit @ Nov 29 2007, 08:36 AM) [snapback]545610[/snapback]</div>

H if that is true I can't wait. I've had the car 29 days 800 miles and I've only had to pump gas in it once, 8.9 gallons $27.00. With my old truck I would have gone through around 80 gallons of diesel $280.00..WHOO WOOO

 

File this one under old news.

My 2008 package 6 gets 48-51 under current operating conditions (90% hiway. Autumn in MidAtlantic US). I expect it to drop as the weather gets colder and increase during Spring/Summer.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Brian Baldridge @ Nov 29 2007, 06:49 AM) [snapback]545618[/snapback]</div>

That's about where I am (in my '08 with 2,500 miles) overall since when I get on the Freeway I'm usually doing about 85-90... although I'm on the freeway probably only 15% of the time. Because of this amount of time, and the fact that I'm getting mid fifties on surface streets brings me to about 49-50 overall. Last night I had to run into work which is 20 miles each way. I decided to drive reasonable and set the cruise at 65 on the freeway. On the way home I took surface streets. I got 53.5 on the way to work and by the time I got home I got 59.3 overall I filled up right before going to work which is why my average is only over 39 miles so this isn't that great of a sample. The reason why I took a pic was while I was at work I was in a Jeep forum talking about Prius mileage...so snapped a pic when I got home to post on that forum:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hobbit @ Nov 29 2007, 09:36 AM) [snapback]545610[/snapback]</div>

At what mile count do you believe the Prius should be broken in?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mingoglia @ Nov 29 2007, 09:58 AM) [snapback]545638[/snapback]</div>

Way to go! A picture or a video really quiet the non-informed.

 

I can certainly relate. I'm in a 300+hp sedan with an average around town of about 13-16mpg and the price of gas is a pain to deal with.

However, what I'm in process of considering is the purchase price and gas costs of two smaller cars.

I can pick up a very nice Honda Civic EX for about $19k vs Say $23k for a Prius. That $4k delta buys a lot of gas and has to be considered.

Using the new 2008 calculations on my driving habits, The costs per year for gas are only $50mo. more to drive the Honda. That means I won't see a break even for 6.6 years or at 15,000 miles a year, at just about 100,000 miles!

Also, based on the cost of money at say $20 per thousand, my monthly payment on the Prius would be upwards of $80mo. more than the Honda just to own and drive it. So while I'm saving on gas, it's going to take me 6.6 years to see a break even on the gas savings, but it's going to cost me $80 month more to own the prius. That's an extra $800 in interest that then needs to get offset too.

Overall, I love the Prius and am considering one to replace my current daily driver, but the cost of ownership and purchase is something I'm still working through.

Your thoughts and insight appreciated.




<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ezbngrn @ Nov 29 2007, 08:43 AM) [snapback]545615[/snapback]</div>

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(pdqgp @ Nov 29 2007, 09:14 AM) [snapback]545674[/snapback]</div>

I think many assume the difference in price is what the hybrid option is costing you. I believe drive systems aside, let's just say the 23k Prius was a gas version (which of course doesn't exist) to compare apples to apples. IMHO, the Prius is almost $4k more car than the Honda you're looking at, drive system aside. So when comparing the break even point for the hybrid I wouldn't only take in to account how much gas you have to buy for it to make sense. Not only are you getting better fuel economy but you're getting a better (IMHO) car with more leg room in the back.

Mike

 

Thanks for your feedback. I know the car has a bit more legroom, but between the two, $4k is still $4k. The things that lean me towards the Civic aside from price are:

- Interior layout and look
- Ride, especially handling and highway ride
- Long term resale. The Prius seems to hold its value well, but a Hybrid with 90k on the ODO will be a tough sell, more so when by then, newer models will be out with likely longer battery life/warranty. A 90k Civic still seems to command a good dollar and with little worry by the next owner, which is key.

I'm sure there are more in my brain, but those are the initial ones.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(mingoglia @ Nov 29 2007, 01:26 PM) [snapback]545735[/snapback]</div>

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(pdqgp @ Nov 29 2007, 02:11 PM) [snapback]545763[/snapback]</div>

Civic is pretty good. But those cross-type winshield wiper arms would drive me batty. When they go up in two different directions my head spins. Much prefer the Prius normal wiper arms going in the same direction. And I don't think the Civic will have a higher resale value all things considered over a Prius.

I never drove a 2007 Civic Hybrid, so I don't know for sure, but I know the 2003 Civic Hybrid I rented wouldn't run the A/C when the engine was off, a major pain. Another reason the Prius is a better bet if you need A/C.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(DaveLeePrius @ Nov 29 2007, 02:28 PM) [snapback]545772[/snapback]</div>

I do most of my driving in the 70mph range.... I get mpg in the low to sometimes mid 40's is that normal or should it be higher?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(pdqgp @ Nov 29 2007, 08:14 AM) [snapback]545674[/snapback]</div>

sounds like you have really thought it out soooo

if money is all that matters, i think you have your answer

if money is not all that matters, to me the choice is obvious....

just one parting shot.... estimating the cost of ownership by using todays price of gas i think is a huge mistake. i see $5 a gallon gas in less than two years


*edit*

other thoughts, in 2005 the Prius with side air bags ranked #1 in European tests for child restraints, that was not #1 in its price class, it was #1 overall...it beat out $100,000 cars... after that, it was not much of a decision for me

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(a priori @ Nov 29 2007, 11:06 AM) [snapback]545643[/snapback]</div>

The Prius is broken in at about 600 miles. For fuel economy, it's really more a matter of when the driver is broken in, that is, how long it takes the driver to learn good technique.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(richard schumacher @ Nov 29 2007, 06:18 PM) [snapback]545858[/snapback]</div>

Thanks, Richard.

This is why I was asking: I thought I had read in some early (unremembered) thread that most people saw an increase in MPG at 3,500 to 5,000 miles. Also, some said it could be even later, depending on the wear of the tires.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(pdqgp @ Nov 29 2007, 11:11 AM) [snapback]545763[/snapback]</div>

By then? Because newer models will have longer battery lives and warranties?

By then, as DaveinOlyWA said, gas prices will probably be much more expensive. ANY used car that gets great gas mileage will be highly sought after in comparison to any other used car.

Used Prius buyers will probably be doing the same math . . . NEW PRIUS at $$$$$$ . . . USED PRIUS at $$$$ . . . . gee, I wonder how long the payback will take with the new Prius when I can save thousands of dollars by purchasing a used Prius and use that money toward 50MPG gas. I certainly wouldn't be considering a used Mustang. :lol:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(a priori @ Nov 29 2007, 04:40 PM) [snapback]545865[/snapback]</div>

There are several stages of break-in. The initial 600 or so does indeed make a difference. At about 7,500 miles, the engine smoothness in my 2004 began to resemble that in my 2001. Then somewhere later in the 20,000 to 30,000 mile range the MPG seems to increase a little.

 

What makes you think that "newer models" will have a longer battery warranty? For CARB states, the warranty on the HCH and Prius battery is already 10 years/150K miles.

Warranties are a liability and cost manufacturers money. How many parts of a non-hybrid car are warranted for that long, esp. if you're not in a CARB state?

BTW, the Fact Sheets for all the vehicles they tested at http://avt.inl.gov/hev.shtml are rather interesting. Not that these are statistically significant sample sizes, but it's interesting to see that more than 1 Insight and previous gen HCH seemed to have transmission and/or catalytic converter failures at 90K miles. Some had the transmission fail again later at ~150K miles.

Maybe Honda didn't care much about transmission longevity back then? Back in ~MY 2002, Honda (regular) powertrain warranties were only the same as the basic warranty: 3 years/36K miles. They extended to it to 5 years/60K miles to be inline w/Nissan and Toyota some point after that.