What ICE would you pick(or wish) in '09 Prius?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Graz @ Nov 4 2007, 03:13 PM) [snapback]534701[/snapback]</div>

I just read this which makes me think E85 is evil...
"The apparent motivation is the nature of U.S. Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) standards, which give an effective 54% fuel efficiency bonus to vehicles capable of running on 85% alcohol blends over vehicles not adapted to run on 85% alcohol blends." from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethanol#Controversy.

A free 54% CAFE standard boost being able to run E85 sounds like complete BS. You get less mileage per gallon w/ E85, ethanol production is not efficient, and E85 isn't widely available.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Husker4theSpurs @ Nov 6 2007, 02:42 PM) [snapback]535728[/snapback]</div>

But it requires tropical/subtropical climate, of which there isn't a whole lot of in the U.S.

 

I would pick the same 1.5L ICE with higher 6,000 RPM making about 90hp. The Camry hybrid's 2.4L also goes up to 6,000 RPM so why not?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(holycow99 @ Nov 7 2007, 10:23 AM) [snapback]536106[/snapback]</div>

The number of wheel turns per drop of fuel is much higher than any other car, that is more performance.

I can't think of a situation where if you get the rpms up to 3500-4000 that the car won't perform within the limits of what anyone would need in terms of emergency speeding up or merging onto the highway. If you want more responsive handling there are modifications you can make.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(holycow99 @ Nov 7 2007, 07:23 AM) [snapback]536106[/snapback]</div>

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(holycow99 @ Nov 7 2007, 02:19 PM) [snapback]536342[/snapback]</div>

Your have got to be kidding. I could out drive 95% of the cars on the road in a my old car, a 1992 Ford Tempo. And both the classic and current Prius is so much more powerful than my old car. The lack of power is a delusion. Only a few people really use it and the Prius does not need to bother to satisfy that small segment of the market. Performance measured as horsepower is a marketing delusion. What matters is torque and the Prius delivers plenty as it is. Market the torque as the measure of acceleration/performance!

Look at other vehicles which focused on performance rather than fuel economy. The Accord Hybrid is or already has been discontinued. The RX400H doesn't sell particularly well. The Prius does great because it does fulfill most people's needs well and with great fuel economy. Most people just don't realize it yet. The entire point of the hybrid is fuel economy. Increasing the fuel economy will make the Prius an even more appealing choice.

Now if you want to do something like add a turbocharger which improves fuel economy and performance, that makes sense. But the fuel economy is what should drive it. The performance is just bonus.

What people think they want and what they actually want can often be two different things. You have something like the Accord Hybrid where people buy it b/c it's a hybrid that has great performance, but then they have buyer's remorse when the fuel economy stinks. You have Prius buyers who buy the car despite some nagging concerns about performance and after driving it a bit, they love it for the fuel economy and try to get great mileage out of it. Everyone I know who has been in a Prius is surprised by how well it performs. You want to take care of those performance concerns of the mainstream market? Have them test drive a Prius.

 

How about an HCCI engine with the EV motor?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(holycow99 @ Nov 7 2007, 05:19 PM) [snapback]536342[/snapback]</div>

Well the torque of the electric motor is sitting there relatively unused, if you could get all of that torque to the ground you'd have some fun next to a lot of cars launching from stop lights.. but I don't think the computer is programmed to let you use it.

We're all wanting standard EV mode available, sounds like you'd like a SPEED EV switch.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dipper @ Nov 7 2007, 04:38 PM) [snapback]536405[/snapback]</div>

I'm no automobile expert, but from reading the Wikipedia article (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HCCI), it looks like HCCI isn't ready for commercial use yet. The easiest thing to get it working on initially would be a series hybrid where the engine could run at a very limited range of RPM to make the controls problem easier. In a parallel (in addition to series) hybrid like the Prius, I think the controls would be very difficult to work out and that is much further down the line. It does sound cool, tho'.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(douglas001001 @ Nov 7 2007, 06:59 PM) [snapback]536476[/snapback]</div>

I don't think that's correct. I spin my tires if I accelerate from a stop too quickly and I have Goodyear Assurance TripleTreds which have pretty good traction (it's even easier to lose traction with the factory Goodyear Integrity tires). I think torque is available, just limited by the traction to the ground.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(douglas001001 @ Nov 7 2007, 05:59 PM) [snapback]536476[/snapback]</div>

I think the problem is not the EV switch. The battery needs to perform better (and way better capacity). If more energy is able to be sent to the EV motor, the HP numbers would have been better.

Try driving up the 11k feet slope on I40 West of Denver, and you will see why when carrying full load. The battery will drain in a few minutes, and you will be running on ICE at full throttle at 50mph.

But of course, coming down is the real fun part. B)

Until Toyota will/can do that, getting a better performing ICE is the only solution.

 

Re: What ICE would you pick(or wish) in '09 Prius?

MOOT point Gents.

Nothing is more expensive than sending our petrol $$$ to terrorists. I think a $1.00 a gallon federal tax used to reduce our dependence on foreign oil, is more reasonable than providing Detroit more opportunities to sell us what they want instead of what we need.

Unless you think the oil companies haven't made enough money yet.

 

Re: What ICE would you pick(or wish) in '09 Prius?

I would really like to be able to tow a small trailer maybe 400kg. This would allow me to tow my motorbike on a trailer and take some junk to the recyclers. Sometimes I just want to take bottles and cans to the recycling depot and although they would fit in my car I don't want the stains on the carpets if the bags of bottles leak a little.

It isn't legal here to tow a trailer here if the manufacturer specifies 0kg towing capacity.

 

Re: What ICE would you pick(or wish) in '09 Prius?

For all the people that say the prius has no acceleration better drive a big truck for a while. It makes you think twice about cutting into traffic. When you have 10 gears to get threw and 0-60 i after about 3 minutes You don't care so much about the difference in 5 - 13 seconds. And that is if the dangf truck can even hit sixty. And some of these are like that even with out extra loads.