replace seats for comfort

I loved the seats in my '95 Thunderbird SC, the SC models came standard with a 6-way powered driver seat with electronic adjustable lumbar and bolster. I also am about 6' tall and slim so I love the side support of the bolsters, but I noticed my Prius offers no support but it doesn't bother me too much as I don't spend too much time driving. I did get the leather pkg #8 on an '06 Prius, I've driven a rental Prius with cloth seats as well. I love having leather seats though, I wouldn't have it any other way. Cloth is just more difficult to clean and stains much easier, it's more clingy with clothes, and I just like the feel. I also like that the leather package includes the door and center console arm rests as well as the steering wheel. Here's a picture of my Thunderbird's seats:

http://hometown.aol.com/ilusnforc/images/dscf0257.jpg

 

I found an excellent seat cushion from Brookstone. It is called a Comfort Gel Cushion and it is really comfortable and seems to solve the seat problem for me.The catalogue number is C345785 $59.95
Check it out at www.Brookstone.com
jgillas

 

Check this out:

http://www.brookstone.com/store/product.as...amp;prodtemp=t2

I'm thinking of getting the back support, hoping that it won't push me too far forward...

 

Thanks for all the posts and information!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Venturer @ Jul 1 2005, 04:23 PM) [snapback]103087[/snapback]</div>

I think that could be a solution for me, too. I am 181 cm tall and a little higher seat (on the front side) would be ok.
The problem shoud be finding a longer bolt to replace the orig. ones.
Could you post more details of the operation or pictures?
Thanks in advance.

 

I put 2 washers under hte front of my seats, that was all i did to raise it, and i used the same bolts, still worked.

Hopefully getting my lumbar this week, so onto the next modification!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(BethlehemPrius @ Jul 17 2007, 07:46 PM) [snapback]480337[/snapback]</div>

I was thinking at such a mod. - very simple, but i think the max height/thickness of washers should not be more than ~ 1 cm or so or risk the bolt to not fasten correctly the seat in emergency... (very bad!!)
Which thickness did you add ?

p.s. btw - anybody knows what are the 2 sets of cables that are under the sear, one yellow one black ??

 

ya know, i honestly am not sure how thick they are, they don't really add a whole lot to the seat, but for me it was enough to get some leg support.

Sorry I couldn't be more specific.

 

Well I'm 5'6" tall and I find the seats in my 2007 Prius very comfortable with very good lower back support. I wouldn't change a thing. I guess it matters how tall you are.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(wiiprii @ Jul 17 2007, 06:31 PM) [snapback]480530[/snapback]</div>

The fixed height Prius driver's seat is probably perfect for someone that's 5'6". If you're shorter, in the 5' range, or taller, 6' +, you'll have to suffer. Probably nearly everyone would adjust the seat height if we were given the option. Japan and Europe have manual driver's seat height adjustment.

But US Toyota chose not give us height adjustment. The Corolla gets it. But I guess they thought the Prius was lower end than a Corolla. It's an unbelievably stupid decision from an otherwise great company.

It's hard to imagine that Toyota wouldn't fix the problem in the 3rd generation Prius. But if only a few people complain, they might leave it off again. Perhaps the sales focused instead of customer satisfaction focused US Toyota management felt that making the Prius too fancy would canibalize Camry and other sales.

But height adjustment isn't fancy. it should be mandatory. It's a big safety issue since it restricts vision our of both windshields when people can't adjust seat height. It's hard to imagine a feature that would have a greater benefit/cost ratio.

 

I, too, just got my Prius on the weekend and that night took a little jaunt, about 100 miles away. I could really feel the difference from my Passat. The Prius seats are fine for a regular day's commute or running around town, but I'm dreading road trips now.

My Passat seats are so comfortable I can make a day's long road trip and stay completely refreshed. These Prius seats suck so badly. Just a good lumbar support alone would make a huge difference, but still the seat construction is not suppportive--and the fabric feels stuffy and hot to boot. And I agree: height adjustment left off? Wth?? I was planning on taking the Prius to Oregon (a day's drive away) in a couple weeks, instead of the Passat, especially for the gas mileage and otherwise great features, but the seats are scaring me off. Not that there are any solutions for my trip at hand, but I want to find a longer term solution that isn't just putting a pad or something on the seat. I want an attractive, permanent solution.

I'll give up my side air bags if that's what it takes. The dealer today was no help. Does anyone have any suggestions? I want a supportive, attractive option without having to go to the mismatched looks of a racing seat (though that would certainly be comfortable). There's so much I like about this car, but the seats could force me to sell it--and if I did I certainly wouldn't trade it in for another Toyota, but would rather refresh my search for a quality VW TDI wagon.

 

Are the leather seats any better?

 

I put inflatable lumbar into my factory seats, while it isn't a fix all solution I think it does help to make them tolerable. I looked into the recaro seats and they are just way to much money, might as well sell the car if I went that route. They ran over $1k per seat with all the hardware you will need.

The lumbar kit only cost $63 per side and was really quite simple to install. I am planning on posting some pics of my installation and how I did it in about a week.

http://www.pdaroadgear.com/heaters/heaters.asp

My biggest issue was where to place the inflators, I think I may end up moving them higher than the current location.

At least this keeps the airbags and keeps the factory look. I just did my first 300 mi road trip with them last weekend and it did seem to make a difference. I know a couple other folks on here have done this also.

Hit me up if you have any questions.

good luck

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(quixotequest @ Jul 24 2007, 02:18 AM) [snapback]484013[/snapback]</div>

When I got my Prius, my legs felt cramped, even with the seat all the way back. There was a huge amount of rear leg room. I didn't understand why Toyota seemed to have artificially restricted the rearward movement of the front seats. They must know there are tall people in the US. I'm 6'1", only a little above average. I feel sorry for someone taller than me trying to drive the Prius.

I thought they should have allowed the front seats to travel back more. If someone is in the back seat with long legs, you can always slide the seat forward. But there's no one in my back seat usually. So it seemed my car was designed to be unnecessarily less comfortable for front seat passengers, so that Casper, the long-legged ghost, could be comfortable in the back seat.

Bottom line: I did something about it. I took the car to New England Wheels in Billerica MA. They regularly move seats back for Boston Celtics players. By welding on some metal, they adjusted my seats so that the range of travel moved back three inches. It took three hours and cost about $300. They did a perfect, professional, nice looking job.

The car feels much more comfortable now. And with the seats all the way back, there's still plenty of leg room for a tall person in the back seat! Also, with the seats all the way forward, my 5'3" girlfriend has no trouble driving the car.

So as you said, Wth happened with the Prius seats. I hope Toyota reads these posts and gets input from other US drivers. It would be unbelievable if they didn't fix these seat problems in the next generation Prius.

 

Bethlehem Prius: Yes, if you could do any photo documentation that would be wonderful. I am quite willing to explore doing what you did. While I'm not the most handy with fixing stuff, or rather I'm not frequently tinkering with tools, I'm not completely unfamiliar either. I did once fix the lumbar on my Passat with help from my buddies on the VWVortex forum.

nyprius: Thanks for your input. I'm also just shy of 6'1 but have found the rear travel fine. Maybe it is the proportions of my torso to legs. Maybe is that, due to my Passat, I've become accustomed to not havig my legs stretched all the way out like when I once drove a full size Sable years ago. I like feeling more cozy, tight and active in my driving position now rather than stretched back and "relaxed." If the seat is supportive I find an active position more refreshing for the long haul, and more rewarding driving experience. Nonetheless I completely concur with you and others on this thread that Toyota dropped the ball big time to not make these seats adjustable for different driving tastes. It's not like 4- or 5-way manually adjustable seating is a luxury option these days. I'm not even asking for memory seats here.

But I do like with the Prius that when I am adjusted for comfort in forward-backward movement that adults can have a little more legroom behind me than with my Passat. And certainly way more than my former Audi A4. So some props to Toyota for the cabin space they squeezed out of a smaller midsize.

Therefore, for giving feedback to Toyota, does anyone know who is best to contact? I talked extensively with the dealer yesterday, but I'm quite certain they will not elevate my complaint beyond the sales manager with whom I spoke. You know the routine: listen, let me rant, give me a Coke, shake my hand and send me on the way. End of problem.

 

I'm looking into getting the driver's seat modified:

http://www.newenglandwheels.com/index.html

I see they have dealers, and located one closer to me:

http://www.boulevardvancity.com/

I've contacted them by email, and I hope they can do the same work as New England Wheels, without the long drive over there.

Harry

PS: I'm 6'4", and I have contacted Toyota, to let them know their driver's seat is bad. Like others have stated, I also need more rearward movement and I need the whole seat tipped back to give me support under my legs. Wish me luck.

 

I will definately post pics and description once I am back home from being on the road for work. It really was an easy job, just time consuming.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyprius @ Apr 6 2006, 09:19 PM) [snapback]236172[/snapback]</div>

This idea intrigued me, so I pulled the driver's seat out this weekend to take a look:


[attachmentid=10100]

You can see the triangular bracket in the front in the picture, its harder to see the rear one. One of the problems is that the brackets are not flat, but are stamped and have a 3 dimensional shape. Also, the rear bracket is close to the seat back pivot and I don't think it can move very far without interfering with the folding of the seat back.

I am primarily interested in dropping the rear of the seat for more headroom/better visibility. I have also considered making new "feet" to drop the rails by an inch or so, but the feet are not as simple as they appear on first glance; they have a locating pin in the front and the inside rear is stamped at an angle > 90°. However, this still may be the easiest way to drop the rear of the seat.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(RRB @ Jul 17 2007, 03:15 PM) [snapback]480519[/snapback]</div>

Actually there are 3 connectors under the drivers seat; the yellow one is for the side air bag, one is for the seat belt buzzer (the buckle is attached to the inside pivot of the seat) the other is for the seat position sensor on the outer seat track. The seat position sensor gives the SRS ECU info about how close you are sitting to the front air bag.


[attachmentid=10102]

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(quixotequest @ Jul 24 2007, 11:36 AM) [snapback]484141[/snapback]</div>

I've sent emails through the Toyota website and they've always been answered. I've asked them several times to make the height adjustable seat available in the US. It's available in Europe and Japan. So they're around. But I just get a brief note saying they can't alter the spec. It felt like a big company that didn't care about one customer. I know Toyota is great. But on this issue, they were being incredibly unhelpful.

Lack of height adjustment is more a safety than comfort issue because the sloping Prius roof in the front and rear obstructs vision if you're tall.

It seems to me they could make the seat available from dealers. I don't mind paying for it. As I've said before, the problem isn't Toyota headquarters. I heard US Toyota made the decision to leave off seat height adjustment. It's unfathomable why a car with so many features normally associated with high end cars doesn't have simple height adjustment. US Toyota probably was concerned about canabalizing Camry sales. Whatever the reason was, it was a mistake. And it was a departure from the apparent Toyota philosophy of put the customer first, then the company will do well. Apparently less sophisticated US management said put sales first, and ___ the customer.


<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Earthling @ Jul 24 2007, 09:11 PM) [snapback]484434[/snapback]</div>

I think the companies shown on newenglandwheels.com is simply a network of firms that mostly do handicap retrofits to cars and vans. I called several retrofitters. Most said they couldn't do it. It's not their regular work. But one place said they could do it. They moved my front seats back, but also raised it and changed the angle. So I had them put the seats back.

If you find someone in the network that hasn't done the work, perhaps you could ask them to call New England Wheels and speak with the tech who does the work there.

Good luck!

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dogfriend @ Jul 25 2007, 02:50 AM) [snapback]484566[/snapback]</div>

Great photos!

I think the shape of the floor under the seats restricts how much the seat rails could be lowered. However, if you figure out a way to lower the seats, by either doing mods at the rails/pedastals or in the seat structure, please let me know!!!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(nyprius @ Jul 29 2007, 10:00 PM) [snapback]487309[/snapback]</div>

Yes, the outboard rear mount prevents the outboard rail from dropping very much, but I think it may be possible to drop by about 1/2 inch and still clear the seat bolt. I can reach in between the inner rail and the seat bolt with my finger when the seat is all the way back. There is about 1/2 inch or so.

Here is a picture, but unfortunately a little out of focus (damn auto focus). The shiny surface is the bottom of the inner seat rail.


[attachmentid=10255]

So, my idea would be to cut off the rear brackets (feet) from the rail, make a new bracket without the offset, bolt the new bracket(s) to the rails and shim the rails upwards with washer shims if necessary to allow clearance between the inner rail and the seat bolt. The inboard bracket would be made to match the height of the outer bracket.

To replace the rivet that holds the "feet" to the rail, I would use a Class 8.8 Half Height Socket Head Cap screw. You can buy these at McMasterCarr (mcmaster.com) p/n 93070A144 for example (I think these will work but need to double check head size to make sure of clearance). You would need at least one for the outboard rail and two for the inboard rail.

You could also replace the seat bolt with a larger half height cap screw to gain a little more clearance. The disadvantage is that they are relatively expensive bolts and you usually have to buy a box unless you can find an industrial fastener store that will sell small quantities.

I would leave the front brackets alone; the inboard bracket is riveted and welded to the seat track. The front brackets also have locating pins which fit into the body structure.