2007 with 4K miles on it--lost it's fricking mind

The OP's problem sounds like normal Prius behavior while travelling at very low (5mph) speeds with the ICE running. Happens every time I crawl out of my parking space at work and make my way out the security gate while it's trying to warm up.

Last time I checked with my ScanGauge, the ICE idles at ~0.3 gallons per hour once it's warmed up. At 5mph that works out to about 17mpg. Warmup increases fuel flow dramatically, as would running the A/C even if the engine is already warm. So, to the OP, I strongly recommend that you don't bother with the dealer. Instead, listen to see if the engine is running. If it is then that's the problem. Just the Prius doing its thing, as there are many normal reasons that the engine wouldn't be shut down. (We can discuss that if you like but it's kinda complicated.)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rae Vynn @ Jul 12 2007, 04:07 PM) [snapback]477671[/snapback]</div>

What's up is the exact same mob mindset that created the Salem witch trials, and which caused the 9/11 terrorism.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jeffgb @ Jul 12 2007, 11:56 AM) [snapback]477620[/snapback]</div>

just to possibly put your mind at ease, i checked the consumption when i started my car tonite in the parking garage and i was under 5mpg while i drove slow speeds on flat surface.

obviously, if this is diff behavior than you are used to...take it in, but i've actually never watched my consumption at slow speeds on startup like that, so perhaps, just perhaps this is normal behavior you hadn't had the opportunity to observe before.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusmaybe @ Jul 12 2007, 02:59 PM) [snapback]477751[/snapback]</div>

Very sorry Priusmaybe. I actually did not intend to quote you, but someone else. Sorry I didn't catch the error and edit it out. I realize you were in support of the OP, as I was. When our moderator stepped in and asked eveyone to please stop, I remembered how easy it is for text messages to be missunderstood, and I should have just let them do their job.

I really didn't intend to police anyone, but it is just hard not to come to the defense of a brand new poster like I was, not long ago. I just cannot understand how one person can post a question and get a real nice warm Prius Chat Welcome, and then another poster can say almost the same thing and get blasted for no apparent reason. From now on, I will not try to play moderator.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Saxman @ Jul 12 2007, 09:01 PM) [snapback]477926[/snapback]</div>

I too can confirm that an instantaneous reading of 6 MPG soon after the ICE starts and while driving slow with your foot on the brake is actually a normal condition.
Under those conditions, I'd be surprised if the Prius actually could get 6 MPH.

jeffgb is not a troll.
Trolls don't tend to school the supposed "experts" on the nuances of operating their cars. <_<

Yes, as a nOOb, jeffgb should be pardoned for being scared by what he was seeing.
He came here for guidance, yet he was met with ridicule.

All of you calling him a troll should apologize and declare to him that you don't know everything Prii. :mellow:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jeffgb @ Jul 13 2007, 08:23 AM) [snapback]478112[/snapback]</div>

Oh, does she do this as she is flying in the door, too?
DH and I have lived through 6 teenagers, and assorted friends (often all in our livingroom at the same time), and for awhile, this was a daily occurance!

 

It sounds to me like your ICE hasn't warmed up - you always get comparably crappy mileage until the ICE gets up to temperature. I'd keep driving it for a tank or two, maybe do a little research on P&G (pulse and glide), and then see where you are. If you're getting below 45mpg over the course af a tank of fuel, that's a sign that either you drive way too fast or there is something wrong. I wouldn't assume there was a problem - the instantaneous MPG will fluctuate a lot - from 4 or 5 mpg to "99.9"mpg. It's the long term average that counts.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusmaybe @ Jul 12 2007, 02:59 PM) [snapback]477751[/snapback]</div>

If you don't like being policed, don't jump in as a bunch of people pick on someone relativelty new to the forum for a reasonable question. Tony, for an admin and self admitted Hitler Nazi (hey, shouldn't that auotmatically lock this topic? ), is about as reasonable as they come. Policing on Priuschat is rare, and usually appropriate and even handed.

 

Ah, is it Godwin's Law? My first glimpse!

I too, get ultra-low instantaneous MPG values, first thing out in the morning, when (more often than not) I hit the first red light on my street, and am slowing down for that---I can watch it drop down to the single digits as I slowly come to a stop. Of course, the ICE is in operation (no block heater here) during that segment of my morning drive. Later in the drive, after warmup, I'm often gliding when I need to decel, and either brake or jump into B sometimes... so I see 99.9 then.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jeffgb @ Jul 12 2007, 01:56 PM) [snapback]477620[/snapback]</div>

How long have you owned the car? How many miles have you put on it? *All* cars, including our beauties, get crappy fuel economy when cold; the Prius just makes it really obvious with the continuous display. If you burn an entire tank and get less than 40 MPG or so, then start wondering.

What's the pressure in the tires first thing tomorrow morning, before you drive anywhere?

 

I consider myself pretty well versed in the operation and intricacies of this fine piece of engineering, so read on only if you can tolerate a bit of pontification.

1. VERY low mpg during low-speed engine warm-up is 100% normal. Remember, MPG is a simple equation... distance/fuel ... if you are moving slowly, but the engine is sucking down fuel (as it does during it's special CC warmup cycle) you will see very low MPG numbers. Don't accelerate quickly to make these numbers go away... the long term effect will be negative.

2. The arrows LIE. While they do generally provide a decent view of the ENGERGY FLOW in the vehicle, they do not accurately display the status of the ICE. Some users have hacked in ICE monitors, or RPM guages into thier vehicle to get an accurate picture of what the engine is doing. I found that after paying attention to the engine vibration for about two days with the stereo and air off I could learn to tell if the ICE was running about 90% of the time. It can be very quiet... and still fools me sometimes. (I will think it's off, then later feel the distinct vibration of the ICE shutdown)

3. B-Mode is ONLY FOR LONG STEEP GRADES that would otherwise overcharge your battery and wear out your hydaulic brakes. IT OFFERS NO INCREASED EFFICIENCY. You will ALWAYS have more effective regeneration by pressing the brake pedal in regular drive mode than by driving or braking in B-Mode. THIS DISINFORMATION MUST DIE. Anyone who dares challenge this will be met with FOOTnotes in thier ASSumptions.

B) That is all.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Greenkeeper @ Aug 23 2007, 05:39 PM) [snapback]501221[/snapback]</div>

CAN I CHALLENGE YOUR SPELLING...THIER=THEIR

 

As the other users have mentioned [after much name calling], it sounds like you are driving at slow speeds while ICE is running. In your example of the parking lot you said you drove around again and it showed a higher number. That is consistent with ICE not being warmed up on your first trip, and being warmed up on the second trip. It typically takes about 5min or so for your car to warmup before you would expect your fuel economy to increase.

When I first got my Prius I noticed the same thing and thought something was broken. Then I quickly learned the nuances of ICE and learned how to optimize the situations where it isn't running.

Do some tests in your driveway. When the car first starts up drive around. You'll see it with low MPG. Then drive down the street for a bit and then go back to your driveway and drive the same speed. Notice anything? Higher MPG I am guessing. That would conclude this as being an ICE issue.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jeffgb @ Jul 15 2007, 04:44 PM) [snapback]479196[/snapback]</div>

Hi Jeff,

From one engineer to another, you do seem to be overanalyzing something you do not have the science to understand yet.

Remember from freshman physics - Force is Mass times Accelleration. And conservation of energy. A car coverts gasoline chemical energy into vehicle kineteic energy. In the process of creating force, the car uses gas. Thus for that time, the mpg HAS to be low. Then once your up the speed, an ideal car should have infinate mpg, sorry the Prius is just not quite that ideal yet. From these two rules you could have .1 mpg during accellelration, and still get 60 mpg average, as long the desired maximum speed is a finite number (and less than about 40 in a Prius). But you might break your neck during the accelleration in a car that gets .1 mpg, and a Prius cannot do suck gas that fast anyway.

Let me guess, your company has a car stipend, and they pressured you into buying a Prius ?

The car is always changing. It has warmup stuff, it has steady running stuff, it has hot battery stuff, it has low state of charge stuff, it has high state of charge stuff, it does. This is the breakthrough that Toyota made to bring the car to reliabilty, so that it could be mass marketed.

Trust it for now, and carry a cell phone for your peace of mind! There are other things to look at on the MFD (the multi function screen). Or you can just turn it off. It has a button for that too.




Hi Again Jeff,

On the oil, just do what you have done on every other car. Pull the dipstick out and be sure its between the max and min marks (those little dimples). If its over the max mark, get the some of the oil taken out.

BTW what mileage (on average, from the MFD) are you getting ?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(jeffgb @ Jul 12 2007, 02:56 PM) [snapback]477620[/snapback]</div>

Jeff, allow me to apologize for the tone of many of the replies. Are you calculating your own mpg? If it is relatively stable, IMO that confirms normal operation. Even with the blocked grill my 1st 5 minutes is around 25mpg which means there is some part of that bar where the economy is really crappy. Circumstancial evidence points to normal operation which you may not have noticed earlier. You'll need an EBH to improve the situation. Blocking the grill and increasing your tp will help has well.

Have you checked your tp lately? If it is low that will whack your mpg.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Greenkeeper @ Aug 23 2007, 05:39 PM) [snapback]501221[/snapback]</div>

It is clear from your posting that you know this car thoroughly!

Me Grasshopper. You Master. You teach. I learn!

I have found that sometimes I am fooled into thinking the ICE has turned on because under certain circumstances -- e.g., when I'm babying the throttle trying to keep it in EV mode -- the car shudders as it transitions from either discharging or charging to "freewheeling" (my term for that ephemeral bliss we all seek which is neither charging nor discharging). Sometimes, not always, that shudder feels just like the ICE kicking in, but according to the MFD, it's not. Now I realize that indeed the engine may be on but the car's not fessing up.

Thanks for your illumination!

CheepCheep

 

I hope we hear from the OP final conclusions.

Although I entirely agree that low instantaneous mpg readings at slow speeds before the engine warms up is normal operation, I got the impression that OP is seeing this after the car engine is warmed up, as well. If a warm engine is doing this, a couple of possibllities come to mind:

1. The battery is discharged, or the system *thinks* it is discharged
2. The instant MPG can lag a few seconds behind real time, and our new owner/engineer is paying too much attention
3. For whatever reason the ICE is running, when correct normal operation would have it off.

I say put the car in the hands of an experienced Prius owner for 20 minutes.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(priusmaybe @ Jul 12 2007, 04:59 PM) [snapback]477751[/snapback]</div>

I visited this board to do some research on several aspects of the 2007 Prius for probable purchase. Must say that the snobbish attitude of fellow members is disconcerting. Isn't the purpose of such a board to share information and be supportive, rather than to inflate oneself by bashing less knowledgeable folk? This is the first time I've witnessed such attitudes on an auto boards, which are traditionally very supportive. Anyway, at least some members seem to have a good sense of humor about it.