Conservative = "me"

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(formerVWdriver @ Jun 7 2007, 07:22 AM) [snapback]457262[/snapback]</div>

Yeah. The same people who think that the second coming is coming in 2007.

http://www.christianpost.com/article/20070103/24761.htm

And it's not 6 people its more like 1 in 4 christians believe this bullsh!t.

Do you believe in the second coming in 2007 or even in your lifetime?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Jun 7 2007, 03:18 PM) [snapback]457516[/snapback]</div>

I never heard of the website or magazine you refer to. I am sure you can find some Christian somewhere who will say/is saying whatever thing it is you want to hear to prove whatever point you want to make. We've got everything from snakehandlers to Quakers and everything in between. We don't even agree on when Easter is.

I've noticed that dbermann agrees with me, and I don't think he's one in four Christians :>).

Jesus said that no one would know the time or place when he would return, so that means I don't know and that it's a waste of time to try to guess. He did, however, tell us how to live in the meantime.

We are in WWIII. The proof is in the events of our time. It's got nothing to do with anybody's religious beliefs (well, except the Islamofascists who think they are supposed to kill us all). I could be an atheist, agnostic, Buddhist or Hindu and still see what's going on and realize that we are at war. Not everything is about Christians trying to shape world events into some Apocalyptic agenda that haunts you and is unknown to me. (And the Book of Revelation is not a coded message about the end of time, either.)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(formerVWdriver @ Jun 7 2007, 02:56 PM) [snapback]457544[/snapback]</div>

That's funny you would state that you can get anyone to say anything to prove your point and then cite dbermann agreeing with you as a reference to prove your point.

Anyways, I always thought that a world war would include the world(or at least a double digit percentage of the total nations), not just barely a handful of nations. What was vietnam to you, WW 2.5?

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Jun 7 2007, 06:31 AM) [snapback]457279[/snapback]</div>

Trying to force gay marriage on you? Seriously, liberals are trying to make everyone in America be in a gay marriage?

And that whole "God does not exist" thing... well, you might be a little surprised at how many liberals actually DO believe that there is a God, of some sort, and that it behooves people to LOVE ONE ANOTHER, and NOT JUDGE each other.

And, when you get that whole heterosexual marriage thing perfected, and not have so many "good, godly people" divorcing, cheating, and being pedophiles, THEN you can tell the rest of the world whom to love.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hycamguy07 @ Jun 7 2007, 08:54 AM) [snapback]457376[/snapback]</div>

I'm not actually gay... just really not narrow minded...

 

*deleted by user*

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Jun 6 2007, 05:58 PM) [snapback]456992[/snapback]</div>

No, we would be Marxist. Quite a difference one is about labor and oppression for the good of a few and the other is about a utopian society where all are equal and there is true socialism. Like the society done on Star Trek where there is no money, religion, hunger or want and people are actually free to pursue their own individual happiness without worry about material goods and do everything to help all of society.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(daronspicher @ Jun 7 2007, 02:48 PM) [snapback]457499[/snapback]</div>

Yep, I'm an idiot. I just want to hand al Qaeda fresh daisies and hope for the best. Get real. Turn off FOX long enough to read a few good books. I recommend that you start with Terror in the Name of God by Jessica Stern, formerly on the National Security Council and lecturer at the Kennedy School of Government at Harvard, and terrorism consultant to the Bush administration. The REASONS I referred to above were lack of education and poverty. The demographic that falls for al Qaeda's and the Taliban's bulls*%# is young, uneducated, poor and disenfranchised. Teach them only what you want them to know, over and over and you've got a terrorist. Put them into an environment where their families can make a living, educate them and you've got a much better chance that they'll be productive members of a more open society.

It wouldn't happen overnight. It would take decades and cost billions. Then again, so will our current methods.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dbermanmd @ Jun 7 2007, 06:31 AM) [snapback]457279[/snapback]</div>

Wow, can't believe I missed this one the first time through the thread. Addressing them point by point:

Global Warming

It's real and something needs to be done about it. Pseudo-scientific wishing it isn't largely our fault and ignoring it because it cuts into the bottom line doesn't cut it. When a conservative suggests environmental legislation that's remotely plausable it passes. Take the Governator for example.

Giving Terrorists rights conferred upon American citizens via our Constitution

Liberals don't advocate this as a matter of course. They DO advocate giving AMERICAN CITIZENS the rights conferred upon them by the constitution regardless of weather someone suspects them of terrorist activities.

Preventing our governemnt from protecting us via electroninc or other means

What exactly are we talking about with this one? I object to a great deal of the electronic survelliance currently being used by US government agencies upon its citizens because much of it is supported by either no legislation or legislation that completely ignores all prior precident. The NSA doing the FBI's job is BS unless they are merged or jurisdiction is officially transferred.

Blaming America for all of some of the worlds ills

All of some... can we be more vague?

Blaming 9/11 on us for whatever reason

9/11 was a symptom of a greater problem. Like it or not we're part of it.

Trying to force gay marriage on 300,000,000 Americans

Who says you have to get married to someone of the same gender? I never saw that in the manifesto?!! It'd do wonders for population control though!

Telling us God does not exist

Who cares when you're talking politics? Last I checked we were supposed to have seperation of church and state. You are free to believe in any diety you wish and formulate your opinions based on the dogma of whichever religion you wish (freedom of religion, right?). You must then defend these opinions in a secular manner if you want to institute them as national policy.

and on and on and on...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Jun 7 2007, 03:18 PM) [snapback]457516[/snapback]</div>

Does that mean I can stop paying my mortgage??

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(burritos @ Jun 7 2007, 12:18 PM) [snapback]457516[/snapback]</div>

Burritos, that last line is painful. Just painful. If you're going to make up statistics to buoy your angst, surely you can do better than that, or at least leave it to the pros (like dbermann).

Now try again. Try something that includes the words "gay" and some large number, and "marriage."

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(formerVWdriver @ Jun 7 2007, 03:56 PM) [snapback]457544[/snapback]</div>

Nicely said, However FVW, you may have noticed the anti-conservative / anti-religion / anti-goverment / anti-rule abiding slant of several FHOP posters they will make them selves known to you...

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hycamguy07 @ Jun 8 2007, 01:16 PM) [snapback]458120[/snapback]</div>

Thank you, hycamguy07. Yes, I have noticed. It's hard to believe we live in the same country/hemisphere/earth.

I can see being anti-conservative. I can see being anti-opposing governing party. I can see flouting traditional social structures and behaviors. But what I can't see is being anti-Christian, anti-God.

If somebody believes in something another person doesn't think exists, what possible source of irritation or affrontery can that be?

There are people who don't believe the moon landing was real. I look at them in wonder, but I don't waste my time or emotions getting worked up over it.

If God's not real, what's to get upset about?

If you don't like or want Godiva cake, why should it bother you that I do (can I have your slice since you don't want it)?

I can't follow the thinking (if thinking it is). It must be like Nietzsche said: The atheist is passionately in love with God.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Pinto Girl @ Jun 8 2007, 02:51 PM) [snapback]458187[/snapback]</div>

I think "anti-government" here was meant as "anti-administration," and "anti-rules" is more along the lines of legalizing marijuana and gay marriage.

That's different from being pro-government and pro-more regulations, especially for businesses.

 

Well, Pinto Girl, I'm glad I could help you out. I've deleted my post and I apologize for slamming you that way. I'm sorry for labeling you and I promise to keep out of these discussions.

Oh, and on a side note, the reason I said what I said concerning leaving the country: I made that statement because I get upset when the death of a Sailor, Marine, Soldier, or Airman for our freedom is trivialized by the fact that someone doesn't like how much freedom we actually do have. Your posts are beginning to sound a lot like you take their sacrifice - and our freedom - for granted; almost as if there's no apreciation for the vast differences in this country.

Then again, I'm guilty of the same.

More so to the point, though, if you don't want the freedom that you do have, then there are other places more in line to your political standards.

Didn't I say: Either I'm backwards in my understanding or there's a mixed message here.

You make absolutely no sense to me because I've listened to you in other threads. You've stated you'd rather deal with suicide bombers than law-abiding, gun carrying citizens.

There's also no sense to be made when you decline to respond to my statement and then turn it against me, ignoring the core behind the message I was trying to say. What I was really saying is this: Will you please stop taking the sacrifices that we in the military continually make for the rest of the country for granted? I hear no gratitude here for the sacrifices people have made so that you can be free.

Instead, I hear that I can't be different from you, either. I hear that I must not only listen to you, but see myself as being all hosed up and change to see your point of view.

Then again, my post said the same thing.

So, you know what? Stick to your beliefs and ideals, I'll stick to mine, and we'll get along just fine. And I'll still go march on to the submarine, go underway, and go on patrol to keep America safe so that you can continue to sleep soundly at night - and that's not cynicism. I'll do it because that's what I really believe in. Just don't expect me to appreciate you taking that little thing for granted.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(formerVWdriver @ Jun 8 2007, 03:31 PM) [snapback]458266[/snapback]</div>

This is a two-way issue, not a problem with atheists. There are just as many (from my point of view, more) Christians that get adamantly upset and irritated if you express a non-Christian view. Sometimes it comes as "you're going to Hell", or something along those lines.

On a different note, lets talk about the gay-marriage issue, that the cons here love to bring up but never respond to the basic questions:
1. Does allowing gay marriage mean everyone must be gay? (obvious answer here, NO, agreed on by all).
2. How does my friend getting into a commited, homosexual relationship affect my marriage, or anyone elses? This answer is just as obvious (it doesn't affect it at all), and I've never seen anyone against gay marriage take it on. I'd love to hear the opposing point of view. If there is no rationale, then what you're left with, I'm afraid to say, is fear or bigotry.

 

If someone is truly secure in their faith, beliefs, and religion they are generally far less likely to disrespect the faith, belief, and religion of someone else. I remind myself of this when someone lashes out and bashes Christians, Atheists, Jews, or someone else because of their beliefs. Last time I checked, my personl beliefs have not caused any wars, killed any civilians, or caused anyone to make up their minds about anything. They are my beliefs and all I ask is to be treated with the same respect as anyone else.

As far as gay marriage. Marriage predates any modern religion. Marriage was originally a public admission of intent to raise children. It is really that simple. Marriage was deemed valid whether children were born or not so the ability to create life is not a prerequisite for marriage. marriage is in its truest sense an announcement to the community that two people have now become a family.

This is exactly why gay marriage should be legal.

What happens in my neighbors house between concenting adults has absolutely zero impact on my life choices. People who are gay should have every right to be married, divorced, pay taxes and utilize deductions, deal with inheritance issues and everything else that comes with marriage.

Regardless of what organized religion may think, ultimately the legality of marriage is contained within the state/town/ county issued license. Clergy, Cleric, Judge, Justice of the peace, Notary, Ship Captain, Lawyer, or whatever stature is deemed legal by the state may conduct the ceremony and authorize the license, but without issuance by a state/town/county official no marriage would be legal to be conducted in the US.

I perform marriages "on the side". I am quite busy this time of year. I can think of no reason other than someone elses ego/beliefs that prevents gay people from experiencing the same joy and sorrow that everyone else is entitled to simply by the design of their private parts.

To me the gay marriage opposition is as abhorrent as not allowing black people equal rights, or not allowing women to vote. I do not understand what a person's private parts have to do with their ability to be loving, kind, intelligent, an asset to a community, be spiritual, or any other human trait.

I am not gay but I am human and the ONLY problem I have with the various movements to provide equality for gay people is the general desire to add the quality of being gay to the list of minorities. That is wrong in my opinion. If people who are gay want to be equal then be equal, and do not seek to stand out as a minority group as I can't think of a single reason why your choice of sexual partners, biologically driven or not, has anything to do with the balance of your life choices and therefore none of a person's gayness has anything to do with me.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Stev0 @ Jun 6 2007, 08:45 PM) [snapback]456986[/snapback]</div>

Yep, ever since we brought our adopted son home from Guatemala, we've been trying to get him in to see Michael Jackson's dermatologist.

Just us crazy conservatives, wanting to whiten everyone up... :blink:

Can you cite ANY source as supporting the notion of a movement to dictate "what color you should be?" :huh: