Calculating the wait

I guess the most important question is how is your dealer handling their wait list. You're #7 - but what are numbers 1-6 interested in? If they all want BC cars, you should be in pretty good shape (unless they only get BC cars in).

Are they offering every car to each person on the list in order? Or when they get a BC, are they offering it to each BC customer, regardless of color or matching it to the BC Salsa customer first?

I would recommend sticking to the package you want (and perhaps those that have added features). Don't compromise and take a car that doesn't have the additional airbags if that's what you really want.

What are the terms for your deposit? Is it non-refundable or will they give you your money back if they can't find your car in a reasonable length of time?

You might want to have a frank discussion with your dealer and tell them that you're thinking about looking outside the area and want to know if you can get your deposit back if you find the car elsewhere. Some dealers are actually okay with this (hard to believe) because they realize that they will have more customers than cars for quite some time.

 

As I understand it, you have no place on the list. The dealer will offer the car to any customer willing to pay a surcharge for it; you have no claim on any specific car or specific option package. The dealers get cars pre-configured by Toyota with various option packages, which is why being flexible in your preferences helps.
Yesteday, when I was in the second dealer placing my second order, he checked into the status of two Prii on the lot, either of which I would have taken. They were accounted for, however. I asked him why he would sell one to me on the spot, assuming it had not been claimed, when there were probably 50 people ahead of me on his list. "You're here, they aren't" was his reply. What this tells me is that you do not have a particular car with your name on it coming into your dealership. The dealer seems perfectly able to manipulate the orders to sell cars at the highest profit.
Unethical? Probably. Bad form? Definitely. Thing is, kids, this is market capitalism and until Toyota gets off their butts and makes more Prii, we have little or no clout. Not like we could go somewhere else; Honda's Civic is not nearly as significant a car.
Bob

 

In general, I'm no fan of car dealers. I think that when they drew up that list of the seven most stressful events of a person's life, they should have included buying a car.

But, I must say that some dealer's have a point when it comes to getting the cars off the lot. The Prius allocations are based on how many cars a dealership moves - they look at how many they got and how many they have in inventory. If a person on the list has their deposit in and they get the call, but don't come down to the dealership to pay for the car, that car remains in inventory until the title is transfered to the new owner.

In the short term, I can see why a dealer would want to move that car off the lot that minute. It means that they're getting it off the books (not paying the interest on the financing that got that car into their inventory) and then "earning" another car for the next allocation.

When I got the call from Dianne at Carson that my car was ready, I arranged my delivery to match up to within hours of when the car would be prepared for delivery! She worked hard to get me that car and it was my duty to go and get it out of her inventory as soon as possible. These dealers that sell with huge markups are ultimately doing themselves a disservice when you start crunching the numbers - it's about volume and speed. Sure, eventually someone will pay that extra $2K, but how long will the car sit in inventory to do it?

That said, there are too many dealers without the organizational skills to match their lists to their allocations in a neat and orderly way - a way that minimizes their management of the list (and therefor labor) and minimizes the amount of time any given car sits on the lot which will maximize their profit and hopefully please the customers. I'd definitely recommend dealing with the manager or a senior salesperson when it comes to this car - it's too easy to get lost in the shuffle, as we've all seen examples of on these boards.

 

I was under the impression that the manufacturer pays for financing, up to around 90 days, in the form of holdbacks. I believe Toyota's holdback is 2%. So, theoretically, a dealer could choose to forego the 400-500 bucks and keep the car on the lot for up to 90 days hoping someone will cough up an extra 2 or 3 grand over MSRP. To the extent the dealer could sell the car for just 400-500 bucks over MSRP within 90 days, they would break even on losing the holdback.

Someone please correct me if I misapprehended something here.

 

Ah, you're probably right. I just hoped it was true - that selling good product at a fair price is more profitable than jacked up prices for the same or possibly shoddy product (let's face it, who wants leather that you didn't order that probably voids the warranty on the side airbags).

 

It is true, in the long run at least.

I don't know why some dealers don't seem to be willing to "settle" for a profit of circa $2200 on a BC package plus another $500 for the holdback; a total profit of $2700 on a vehicle with an MSRP of $25.8k. I mean, do they get anywhere near that on comparably priced Camry's?

 

Bob, you keep mentioning "The Dealer" does this, implying that ALL dealers do this. That's probably not true. Some, yes, but not all. Now, maybe all of them in Washington state do. :mrgreen: But, I'd have to believe there are some decent dealers out there.

 

I'd like to think "decent dealers" are the rule rather than the exception. The problem is when they break bad, they seem to break real bad. Perhaps Bob intended some of his comments to be applied only to the latter.

 

Hi: Some confusion about which dealers I am painting darkly with a broad brush. I got my ideas from a woman who operates a car finder service and has years of experience dealing with dealers of all makes of cars; she is a dealer herself (I've posted info on her elsewhere). She told me point blank that I shouldn't put too much trust in what dealers tell me about availability, etc. She's had this happen with the PT Cruiser, the Beetle and the Toyota Sienna, all very hot cars when first out: dealers take orders, then sell the incoming cars for higher than MSRP because they can get it and because people are willing to pay the premium in order to be the first kid on the block with one (whatever).
Simple capitalism. It doesn't make the dealers inherently evil, just profit motivated like everyone else in consumer America. Eventually, she says, the production numbers come up and those who spent huge premiums will realize they have just wasted a lot of money. That extra money adds nothing to the value of the car; it's money out of your pocket with nothing to show for it.
She told me that she does know some dealers who are very ethical and she tries to steer her business to them whenever possible, depending on whether they have the particular car a client is searching for. I'm trying not to trash all dealers, just ones like the guy in Tacoma who wanted 3k above MSRP and openly admitted to me that it was because he could get it and that I would get nothing for the extra money. I'll continue using individual dealer names, positively and negatively, as my adventure continues because this web site has some advertising power. According to Danny, Toyota is monitoring this and other Prii web sites. I don't think they are as clueless as it might appear about customer sentiment.
B

 

To determine the wait time at your dealer, you may want to ask them a few questions. Such as, are they pretty much getting random cars? If they are, are you willing to take a random car?

My dealer (NJ) told me in early December, that Toyota had started allocating them cars according to what had been ordered, instead of Random cars. It sounds like this may be regional, and it was the regional offices that were trying to match cars to send to specific dealers. I was told in mid december (early 20s) that my car would be available in 2-3 weeks later. It was actually 4.5 weeks, but I did get the car in January. However, my sales guy, who was just ahead of me on the wait list wasn't scheduled to get his car until mid-Feb (I don't know if he has gotten it yet). So in the case of this specific dealer, they roughly got ordered cars in the order of deposits (and they are now telling customers it may be a 9-12 month wait). I don't know if this is NJ specific, or if it is specific to cars coming into the port of Newark or what. Check with your dealer to see if this is happening with them, or if they are just getting random cars.

Also, how much do you feel you can trust your dealer? Can they tell you that they have not sold to anyone off the list before offering it to someone on the list? Our dealer was very good about this. We had the opportunity in early November to accept a car that had a different package than we ordered (it was a fluke - a package that wasn't even scheduled to go to NJ). We turned it down, as did everyone else on the list, except the very last person. She had walked in and was quoted a 6-8 month wait, and three days later was offered this car that nobody else wanted. But, we were all given the option. If you feel you cannot trust your dealer - nag, nag, nag, nag. Be on the phone every day so they know you actively want the car.

Good luck.

-Katie

p.s. We love our car. My husband prefers driving it in situations where he can maximize stealth mode - and he swears whenver the gas engine comes on!

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