Grrrrr, dealer put Toyota Oil in my synthetic Oil Prius

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(TomorrowMatters @ Feb 26 2007, 02:08 AM) [snapback]396590[/snapback]</div>

Just for fun I went to the link for Valvoline and selected 'no' on both the questions about heavy towing and high performance. Their recommendation is conventional oil for the prius inder these conditions. Is it really worth the $$ if one changes every 5000 miles??

 

Jayman,
You are better versed than me in the oils, no doubt about that. I haven't touched anything related to the petroleum industry since I moved on to pharmacy. But is it really misleading to explain synthetic oil as being uniform and the same. Your explaination will be understood only by someone who studied oil. How would you explain in simple terms to the common man what the difference between synthetic and conventional oil is and I will use that explaination myself.

If synthetic oil really does protect your car better in cold weather by all means use it. I live in Los Angeles so I guess I don't take into account -40 weather. Does that mean all the people that don't use synthetic in your area are damaging their cars? That's not a fair statement either, you use synthetic because you want to use the best for your car and you want to baby it. Nothing wrong with that.

If you consistently change your oil at 5K will you see any real difference. Consumer Reports says no and they did a test where they took apart the engines to look at the wear. I can't link the article because of copyright laws but the engines where they changed at every 5K with both syn and regular showed the same amount of wear, if at all. They also had a engine where they rarely changed the oil and that engine had wear on it.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(moolman @ Mar 4 2007, 01:30 AM) [snapback]399774[/snapback]</div>

Yes, actually cars here especially operated at -40, parked outside, and driven within Winnipeg at speeds no higher than 60 km/h will experience massive sludge buildup and short life. It's quite common to be stuck behind a car less than 4 years old that is already burning oil, due to massive sludge deposits in the piston ring lands.

When we had our consistent -35 to -40 overnight lows, with "highs" of -25 F, many cars parked outside refused to even crank. Remember that the SAE J300 has allowed a 5W-xx to "pass" if it hits the 600 Poise yield at around -30 C. Older cars with a common shaft driving the distributor and oil pump will often shear the drive pin right at the oil pump.

Another malady in sudden cold snaps is a rash of blown front seals from using a too-thick conventional oil. Sadly, many folks believe it's "too expensive" to run a 0W-30 synthetic, but will happily fork over +$800 in towing bills and repair bills to repair a fried starter, blown front seal, or sheared off oil pump drive. Go figure, sucks to be them.

Consider the synthetic 0W-20 oil I run in winter, in my Prius. According to my used oil analysis of the oil run over 6,500 miles, my wear results were much better than most oil analysis run at 5,000 miles. Keep in mind that at -40, the 0W-20 will have a MRV of around 120 Poise, and a conventional 5W-30 will either be off scale, or around 800 Poise, far beyond the maximum 600 Poise yield stress.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(moolman @ Mar 4 2007, 01:30 AM) [snapback]399774[/snapback]</div>

I have issues with the CR taxi cab oil/wear test, primarily in that most taxi cabs are left running their entire shift. The motors rarely see cold starts, or frequent start/stop cycles. The average city dweller here will perform frequent cold starts in temps down to -40, and due to the shocking high incidence of car theft that the weeny NDP government has down SFA about, they never leave the car idling but shut it off again.

In extremely cold temperatures, a car motor will experience a lot of “dry†wear and also sludge from the massive moisture involved in such operation. Since most conventional motor oils start out with reserve TBN’s one half of a good synthetic, the additive package in a conventional oil is quickly used up.

I also have issues with Toyota lowering the oil change interval from 7,500 miles to 5,000 miles. They really got burned on a handful of sludged motors. I find it borderline hypocritical that a car company that purports to be “green,†with a flagship green product, has a normal oil/filter change interval of 6 months or 5,000 miles.

Rather than insist on a better quality oil, especially at the dealership level, they performed a CYA for the dealerships and have in place an oil/filter change interval precisely ONE HALF the normal EU interval. A person would have to be naïve to believe there is 100% custody of the used oil and used filter waste stream.

If you take a peek at some of my threads on this issue, you’ll notice that after spending a few months chasing down weird used oil lab results, I was getting very frustrated. Both the dealership and Toyota Canada blamed my use of Mobil 1, even suggesting that alone was going to void my engine warranty and my motor would die an early death.

I then managed to grab a virgin sample of the bulk oil they use.

The oil my dealership is using, probably the same as every other dealership in Winnipeg, was absolutely minimum API spec *contaminated* garbage. I believe I mentioned my industrial background.

It was very easy for me to find the source of the contamination in their tote bin lube tank: the tank breather was a simple inverted pipe with a screen to keep bugs/mice out. I sent a letter to the dealer owner and to Toyota Canada strongly urging them to put in a desiccant breather filter system. Over a year later, nothing. I suppose their attitude is that once the motor is off warranty “TFB you’re SOL so HAHAHAA!â€

As far as work, approximately one fifth of my contract work is in pharmaceuticals. I really like PEEK fittings especially in a CIP environment. You too?? I must admit the FDA title 21 CFR part 11 compliance and cGMP is much easier running DeltaV, especially if you have to worry about PAT compliance. I really do not know of any other system that makes VCAT so easy, especially for me, the commissioning engineer.

Oh, do you need a hint for that glaring false statement I inserted into the other reply? In the interest of Fair Disclosure and to avoid moderator charges of Entrapment, I will state that my replies here are all factual. It may even receive the Dr Fusco Stamp Of Approval …

 

FYI, you can buy oil filler caps at certain stores that say "Mobil 1" on the tops of them.

I use Royal Purple 5W-30 in my car, and it has never failed