Car affordability in 2022 and beyond

My best tank was 42.8mpg, calculated. Lifetime average was 37mpg. I liked that car better than the Camry.

58mpg was the Metro's old highway rating; 52 the adjusted. Fueleconomy.gov goes back to 1984 model year. It, and all the rest would never pass emissions today.

 

Um, please, just don't, no, Ah! UM!

Please stop with the comparison. Dual clutch transmissions are automatically controlled. The driver's experience has very little in common with a true manual transmission ("manual" means "hand operated").

I did 30,000 miles the first year I bought my Avalon and have averaged over 20,000 miles since I bought even though I was basically home-bound for the first couple of years during the pandemic.

At that rate, a 30 mpg vehicle would cost me some 1,000 gallons per year if I keep up with the 30k miles per year. Or at the current $3.25 per gallon, $3,250 per year, or $271 per month. While getting better emissions is important to me, just because the Chevy Trax, Kia Soul and Hyudai Venue are going to be the cheapest vehicles in 2025 in the USA, that doesn't mean they're economical, at least for me. I've averaged nearly $200 for fuel per month in my Avalon, more than the insurance for it and more than the monthly payments for a $10,000 loan for 5 years. Good thing it gets 40 mpg!

 

The various automatic types have gotten better in efficiency over time. Then most of the manuals that are still available are geared for performance. The manual Fit would pull higher rpms cruising on the highway than my auto Sonic.

 

I also wouldn't buy a car with a manual transmission to get better fuel economy. This is why I bought an Avalon hybrid, and why I'm considering another Toyota hybrid or some sort of EV as my next vehicle.

To me, driving a manual is fun. I'm the weird one since I don't have the same tastes as everyone else. For me, I actually dislike being thrown back into my seat as a car takes off from 0 to 60 in just a few seconds. My Avalon has way too much power for my tastes, and I don't think I've ever put the pedal to the metal ever. To me, the Avalon is quite boring to drive. But put me in a little old car with 50 hp or less, non-powered steering or brakes, and a manual transmission without synchromesh and I'd be happy as a lark (at least until it broke down ).

Now, is getting a manual transmission these days worth the extra price, both in terms of fuel mileage and since on most models it actually costs more to get the manual? Personally I'm not sure. A car is a tool to get oneself from point A to point B, so who cares if it's boring. On the other hand, if cars are boring, then it starts to make one question vehicle dependency and wonder if there's a suitable alternative.

 

Neither me too.

Manuals usually have 5 cogs, while most of the two-pedal cars have more.
My dumb old-school full-sized pickup truck has an 8-speed auto.
People in America usually buy three-pedal cars for one of two reasons:
They're on a tight budget or they LIKE to drive three pedal cars....or ANY car.

There are people in the world that view cars as soulless, bland transportation appliances and many of these just do not understand why someone would want to be bothered with the third pedal. (*)
Opinion: The long overdue death of the stick shift car | CNN

Me?
I would buy one because I KNOW how to replace a clutch, and several models I know are having problems with CVTs and ATs....

The only trouble in America in 2024 is FINDING a new three-pedal car with an OTD price below $25k

(*) I actually drove a '92 Geo Metro XFi for 1500 miles (and several weeks) without using the third pedal when the clutch grenaded after 150,000 miles. It was tricky either push starting, or gravity starting the car, and more than once in traffic I was forced to use the starter.
When I finally had time to down the car for the clutch replacement I also replaced the starter motor proactively.
I always practiced 'speed shifting' in all of my manual vehicles....and it paid off.

 

Interesting article, and one that I agree with to a degree.

There is pretty much zero need for manual transmissions anymore. But no manual transmission is like taking the peanut butter and jelly out of a peanut butter and jelly sandwich.

I bought and will continue to use the Avalon until it dies and is no longer feasible to repair. After that I will likely get another non-manual-transmission car, maybe an EV. But that doesn't mean I'm going to find joy in having to drive the thing around, regardless of it's 0 to 60 times or number and position of drive wheels. If you haven't noticed from my comments I dislike the way modern cars look and feel. I guess for me cars have gone from being fun and cool to being a boring necessity that I wish I could replace with something else.

 

My first car had three pedals, I was driving it during high school, and it was a useful after-hours extension of physics class.

 

The Googles say that the cheapest new car in America is a Nissan Versa.
They list a base price of $18,400.

So...I checked around and the cheapest I can get one locally is $20,436 (so-called MSRP of 21,240)
That's the cheapest new car with a real-world price of under $21,000 within 100 miles of me.
The cheapest Toyota in '25 is a Corolla - and GOOD FREEKIN LUCK finding one of THOSE puppies for less than $25,000!
(base price is $22,175 plus delivery and non-optional options)

I'm kinda hard on Toyota because they have a VERY cringe-worthy corporate culture, and their local dealer network does not even meet THOSE low standards.

A Yaris?
HECK YES.
But for how much?
Who would build such a car?
Who would sell it for less than $20,000?

How about this mythical $20,000 base model, three pedal, no options sub-compact pickup that MANY people would buy in a HEARTBEAT?

 

...

 

... when's the last time anyone in the automotive industry asked us, what it is we want?

Automakers shoving these soul-less contemporary vehicles down our throats, aren't building them for us, per se. The only thing automakers care about, delivering on expectations; pleasing Wall Street analysts; knuckling under to the insurance conglomerates and tire-makers, with grotesque, overweight, oversized SUV wheels, saddling every new offering in sight, with high reciprocating mass, and artificially elevating ride heights.

No engineer worth his salt, given a clean sheet of paper, would ever design and engineer cars like what we're seeing these days, on dealership lots.

Everything's butt ugly. Things are so bad in the automotive industry, even Porsche's, Ferrari's and Lamborghini's look obnoxious.

Lukewarm across the entire horizon of current offerings, the automobile oligopoly is wholly devoid anything I could ever want, or hope to aspire. For guys like me? Form follows function kind of guy, nothing compelling under 3,000 lb. curb-weight, I'll have to be content keeping what I've got.


Samuel, '04 Ruthiemobile

 

somewhere must have frozen over, i almost agree with the above.
i will say that people start companies for a variety of reasons, but in the end, money is the main objective.
who are we to complain, have we done differently?

 

There is a lot of government intervention in the car market right now. Its making it where car makers are having a hard time staying afloat. Don't want to point any fingers yet, but engineers know hybrid is the answer right now. Any company that went all in on EV or diesels in the last 15 years is a tough spot or already on the verge of bankruptcy.
But we are nearing the EV thing being almost mandatory with mpg/emissions standards now. A good example of it is:

Hoping the new government will reverse the laws making cars worse and more expensive. Similar to how the 55mpg CAFE standard a long time ago was impossible.

 

Cars are safer and more efficient than ever, why would anyone want to go backward?
The 20th century wasn’t as wonderful as some seem to remember

 

New cars are supposed to be safer. So why are fatalities on the rise?

 

There are many reasons, aside from the safety of the vehicle .
It’s often hard to overcome Darwin