Is Electricity Really More Cost Efficient Than Gas?

Quite a complex question !
For where I live, where electricity is 97% clean and gas prices are quite high , it is 3.75 times cheaper to run on electricity than gas

 

Like everything in life; It's complicated!! The question can't be boiled down to a simple apples to bananas comparison, like above or you can make real world calculations.
For the most part, running electricity is a lot cheaper than running gasoline, especially in a Prius. Now if you try to make the same comparison with a CyberTruck or Rivian, well the answer becomes unclear. Where you charge, what you pay for electricity, and how much your paying for the car, insurance, and maintenance, will also factor into the overall CTO (cost to ownership) vs an equivalent gas car.
In my circumstance, I've calculated that if/when electricity cost hits $0.42/KwH, it would be the same as running on gasoline in my area and commute. There's also time it takes to charge the car. In my case it's zero, I charge at home, while I'm sleeping - so no wasted time there. These factors vary by individual and how the car is used; as stated earlier - it's complicated. BTW, trying to factor in fossil fuels that generate electricity is really hitting below the belt, because the underlying assumption is that the electricity plant was built solely to charge electric cars - again an apples to banana comparison.

Hope this helps......

 

It takes a very economical gas car to equal electric in cost, and only if the electric rate is high, like 30-40 cents per kilowatt hour.
I have a Prime so only drive short trips all in ev. I notice though the larger battery seems to help on trips by allowing the engine to turn off more. It compensates for the extra weight of the Prime battery.
Another option for the naysayers to look at on electric vehicles is free charging. I get mine almost all free. The full ev cars and trucks are loading up on it all the time. I just need to find a wall plug if the level 2 spots are taken.
This thing about it takes gas or coal or whatever to make electricity is misleading. The power generation is in central locations and inspected. Cars are burning gas everywhere.
Do people luxuriating in their a/c on a hot day feel like they are consuming oil or coal and complaining about it? Never heard one person claim their a/c is polluting.

 

2023 Prius Prime XSE First Total Year Ownership:
- 7587 total miles
- 5020 miles EV (66% of total) $0.049 per mile - Average indicated Rate: 4.4 mi/kWh Actual Rate: 3.35 mi/kWh
- 2567 miles HV 46MPG $0.077 per mile
- $235 for electricity
- $176 for gas
- Estimated savings over prior 2009 HV Prius: $140 in 12 months of ownership
- 74% of trips are EV
- Average EV trip is 28 miles and concludes with battery remaining of 31-35%
- My electric rate is $0.161 per kWH
- Florida Power And Light reports 14% of generated power from solar
- Car A/C is operational year round set on 75, outside air is usually 80-95 degF

Does $140 savings justify my purchase of the 2023 Prius Prime XSE? Not even close.
Do I regret purchasing the coolest looking Prius Prime ever? Not for a moment.
Do I cringe when the battery runs out at 40-42 miles of EV driving, and the engine starts? Every time.
Do I regret not buying a full battery electric car? Not in the slightest - (I need a gas drinker to escape Florida before cat 4 or 5 hurricanes.)
Do I wish for a larger battery? No

 

These are one of the few cars that's ROI will zero itself out in 8-10 years vs a gasoline only car.
YMMV....
Those initial model 3 Tesla going for over $100K, not so much..... They do still have lifetime free charging, so if you hold onto it long enough, there's still a chance you can break even. I know a guy that has one. He spent $15K replacing the traction pack a couple of years ago, but he still gets free charging at any Tesla charging station and free software updates as an early adopter.
BTW: Those benefits will disappear if the car is sold to someone else; Just like Kia & Hyundai 10 year or 100K mile power-train warranties. Only good for the original owner.

 

'electric cars are cheaper to fuel than gas cars' has been a slick marketing campaign done by the government, tesla and other entities who came to the realization that people would not switch for environmental reasons, and needed to be convinced that electric cars were cheaper to run and maintain.
the stumbling block is still initial cost which even government subsidies haven't overcome because subsidies to the fossil fuel industry are substantially higher, more complex and mostly invisible to the average car buyer.

 

The government can fix that problem - allow Chinese EV's into the country tariff free. My understanding is that their cars that are up to our consumers' standards start around $18,000; a lot cheaper if we move back to 1980 standards. No power window, cruise control, safety equipment and AC to name a few...

But that opens up another can of worms.....

Just playing devils advocate......

 

This varies sharply by local. In my community, for my RAV4 PHEV, electric miles are about half the cost gasoline miles ... if I were buying the electricity. But since much (not all) of my electric charging is at home, it is powered by my roof-top solar system, which is rapidly approaching 'pay-off', at which time EV miles become 'free'. My solar system would already be paid off if I could have placed it in a full sunlight location without tree shading. I built it in spite of the shading impairments of a non-ideal location.

Modern combined-cycle natural gas powerplants are much more efficient than any motor vehicle ICE. Though the U.S. has been lagging in deployment of the best systems. Coal plants have been fading away rapidly.

But my electric utility has a negligible amount of fossil fuel source. The great majority is from hydroelectric, with most of the remainder from wind.

What is your electric utility's "fuel source mix"?

 

My take on the OPs question is, there are arguments on both sides of the issue. Neither is right, they are simply arguments using generalizations. Both arguments can easily fall apart under specific conditions.

Using one of my favorite song (2) lines here "I can get ya any results you like, what's it worth to ya" as a simile of sorts. (3) artist
It's clear to me presently that the subject is purely argumentative. And here are some synonyms that might fit well as substitutive for argumentative.

• contentious
• controversial
• disputatious
• polemical
• polemic
• quarrelsome
• scrappy

hope this helps somebody ....
(2) The Garden Of Allah
(3) Don Henley
(4) soliloquy starts at timestamp 3:54 in the official release version of the song.

 

I think it was Model S, and only lose it if buy at a dealer. If bought from a private party the free charging continues.

 

Interesting. So your total cost for 7587 miles was $411. That's $0.054 fuel cost per mile.

My (non-Prime) LE just turned a year old. Total miles were 4773 and total gas cost was $259. So for the first year my fuel cost per mile was $0.054. Exactly the same.

 

It really depends on where you live, and what you're replacing as your previous vehicle.

For us, our previous primary commuter car was around $250 to $300 CAD a month in gas.

We've driven just under 8000KM since February, or 5,000 miles.

Our gas (until very recently) hovered around $1.50 a litre (4.21/gallon). So far I've used roughly 60L of gas, so 90$ over 8 months. The same driving at 4.5L/100km average, would have been 360L of gas, or $540 over 8 months.

At roughly 8c/kwh to charge, and rounding up to 20$ on average increase on our electricity bill charging exclusively at home (a bit of an overestimate), we've spent 160$ over 8 months on electricity.

So maybe $250 total to run the car, vs $540 over 8 months for us vs the regular prius HEV. And vs at least $1500 in gas for the previous main commuter (driving less with hybrid work schedule).

The Prius Prime, vs the Prius HEV, thanks to government incentives was less than $1000 more.

We also get a carbon tax rebate every quarter of about $200, which more than zeroes out the gas cost for the year, leaving us a net positive with our reduced gas consumption.

The price difference, for our energy costs, adds up quickly in terms of long term ownership benefit. Mostly on the back of a significantly cheaper electricity cost compared to gas cost where I live.

 

At least in germany (and most parts of Europe), the Prius is quite expensive. Then you have insurrance going wild given how complex cars are getting (I really dont get why this would be cheaper in the states as parts are the same?), yearly inspection costs + tires.

The actual fuel costs (despite 2-3 times higher in Europe) are not that significant anymore - even less though potential savings. This is more relevant if you have an old cheap gasoline car you maintain yourself.

 

Very good analysis , thanks ......just one observation that I don't understand is about the eminent federal election and the conservative and neo democrats pesting against the carbon tax ....and promissing to abolish it

 

Well if its gone then gas probably won't get cheaper since it is a commodity, and with inelastic demand most of the time, we'd probably just see the willingness to pay result in the same gas prices after a short honeymoon period.

In the end, people are annoyed at cost of living and the carbon tax is an easy boogeyman to point to. Ignoring the fact that gas prices are actually at nearly 2 year lows now, what with the pumps here in Ottawa being 1.35/L the past week.

It would suck to lose the carbon tax rebate though. That thing covers 2 car payments a year and I put the full amount straight to my car loan when the quarterly cheque comes in. Nat gas is probably where the carbon tax hurts the most because of how much more nat gas I use for heating than gas i use for driving. But even then, it has still gone up less than the incentive cheque we get. I think it does the job of providing a material benefit to those of us who are reducing our reliance on carbon fuels, and creating a small incentive for others to do the same.

 

If you are asking about economy of electricity vs. gasoline, then it depends on where you live and how you charge. In our local areas, the home charging from the grid ($0.32/kWh) is more expensive than running on gasoline (currently ~$3/gal mark). Yet, I prefer EV charging more than fueling gas for most part. When I have the solar panel up and running, things will be different for me. EV will likely be more economical than gas. This is different for everyone depending on how you drive, where you drive, how you charge, and what the cost of gas locally.

But if you are talking only about physics of efficiency for the energy conversion, then YES, electric motor driving is far more efficient than internal combustion engine burning gasoline. No question about it.

 

Bottom line; You need to do your own homework and run the numbers yourself - to see if it's worth it and not rely on anecdotal and hearsay evidence. Everyone's circumstances are different and I told my sister not to buy a hybrid; even though she loves driving my Prime when she visits. 1. She lives in the part of the US with the cheapest gas prices in the USA. 2. Neither her or her husband wrenches on cars or knows anything about them. For them, a simple reliable, fuel efficient ICE car would be more affordable, easier to maintain, and more cost effective in the long run. In their circumstances, they would never recover the price differential for an ICE vs hybrid or BEV. Now a solar array with a battery bank backup is another story. BTW: their electricity cost ($/kwH) is higher than mine.

Just my 2-cents....

 

Most of my car insurance cost is the liability portion. How much damage you can do to others based on your driving record, the accident frequency ratings of various car models, and very much the address where the car is the most.

 

Exactly. The situation in Canada is far different. In most of the U.S. there is no government subsidy that applies to a Prius Prime. There is in California and perhaps a couple of other states but there is no federal subsidy anywhere because the Prius in not manufactured in the U.S. And, as far as I know, nobody gets a carbon rebate check from the government, state or federal, anywhere in the U.S.

So, in most of the U.S., the cost difference between a Prius Prime and a Prius Hybrid is a major factor as is the cost difference between local gas prices and electricity rates. I assume that insurance costs are significantly more for a Prime too, mostly because it's more likely to be considered a total loss in an accident because it's more expensive to replace the traction battery.

I suspect that in most cases it will take a many years and many miles of driving to reach a break even point if the initial purchase price of the car is significantly more.

The comparison I made earlier certainly isn't universally applicable. But we both live in Florida so I thought the comparison might be slightly more meaningful.

In addition to the obvious factors that have been mentioned, an economist might also throw in the notion of opportunity cost. If you took the difference between the cost of a Prius Hybrid and a Prime and invested those funds I suspect that, from a purely financial standpoint, you would come out far ahead of any fuel savings.