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HELP! 155ma Parasitic Draw on 12v battery isolated to OBD2

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by BJJ, Mar 26, 2024.

  1. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    image.jpg image.jpg I have a 2009 Prius Gen 2.

    I have had a parasitic current draw for 155ma and tired of fighting 12v battery issues.
    I get this draw with the key cancel switch in but read on.

    I have disassembled my dash and unplugged most everything searching for the cause AND:
    The 155 ma parasitic current goes away when the 7.5a OBD fuse is removed OR I unplug two of the middle lower connectors on the back of the inside J/R #1 with the ECU Body is on the back side.

    With the two connectors plugged in and the fuse removed I can measure continuity from the fuse output side to the OBD2 battery pin as well as the Center Connector No. 2 Inner Circuit wires 12(5M) and 13(5H) to the right of the radio.

    With both connectors and fuse unplugged the 12v battery wire to the OBD2 pin should be isolated as far as I can see in my 2006 diagram. However, it measures about 200K to ground, which tells me it goes somewhere else or there is a short.

    The 2006 wiring diagram suggest that this OBD 7.5 a fuse also powers “Engine Control” and “TOYOTA Hybrid System”. I can’t find what and where those circuits are located. I tried looking on the pages referenced and nearby pages - 128 & 92.

    I have not found a 2009 Prius wiring diagram, just the 2004 and 2006 wiring diagrams.

    Please help! Where else can I look?
     

    Attached Files:

    #1 BJJ, Mar 26, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2024
  2. pasadena_commut

    pasadena_commut Senior Member

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    Does the car have an SKS fob? Was it in your pocket or nearby at the time? I believe SKS enabled cars have a button on the dash below the steering wheel somewhere which disables it (check your manual). Or put the fob(s) in a metal can with a metal lid so they cannot talk to the car. Does the parasitic current go away?
     
  3. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Have you tried the wiring diagram online?

    Toyota Service Information and Where To Find It | PriusChat

    The online diagram viewer lets you click on a thing, and the entire circuit involving that thing gets highlighted and you can follow it around.

    Unless the gen 2 diagrams were too old for that, and were only added to the site as PDFs or something.

    Still, you'll find your proper year there, which saves having to wonder if something is different when looking in a diagram for some other year.

    Looking in a 2004 diagram, it really isn't shown supplying anything at all other than the diagnostic connector pin 16.

    It's listed as appearing in the Engine Control section and in the TOYOTA Hybrid System section, but in both places (the linked page numbers in that version are off, by 6 pages going by the numbers in the page corners, or 3 pages going by the PDF page numbering) the same thing is shown: just the fuse, a circuit that goes through Center Connector #2, and ending up at the diagnostic connector pin 16.

    You might try disconnecting that center connector also, to see if you can isolate the conductivity to ground to one side of it or the other (or, how weird would that be, the connector itself?).

    The center connector is a thing of many many pins and has internal connections between them, shown in its "inner circuit" drawing. It effectively takes the place of a whole bunch of splices in the wire harness; instead, the harness just brings a bunch of individual wires to the right connector pins and plugs into this thing, and that's how the wires are joined.

    In the 2004 diagram, the two pins that participate in the OBD circuit are 5H pin 13 and 5M pin 12, and the inner circuit shows only those two being joined.

    On the other hand, if I had to guess where changes would be most likely between different years' wiring diagrams, I would bet these big multi-junction connectors are things you'd really want to look up in the correct year.
     
    #3 ChapmanF, Mar 27, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2024
  4. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    All parasitic draw from the battery should not go away, 15-30 ma is normal. Is this lower ma what you see with the 7.5 OBD fuse removed?

    Those are just the names of the systems where this fuse is shown in the color diagrams. As stated above, it shows the same simple circuit feeding the obd2 connector.

    Often aftermarket accessories or trackers are tapped into this constant on power line.

    It may seem obvious, but I assume no OBD2 device is routinely left in the connector?

    What happens if you just leave the fuse out? Does anything fail to function?

    IMG_4588.jpeg
     
    #4 rjparker, Mar 27, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2024
  5. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    Regarding a 200k “short” to ground, if that is accurate, 200k ohms to ground is less than 1 ma at 14vdc.

    If it is a wire to wire or connector pin to pin “short” then you could be partially powering something. Likely suspects would be adjacent pins on connectors 5H or 5M.
    IMG_4591.jpeg

    In a similar manner, a fuse box “short” from connector 1L could conceivably power up something.

    I would careful separate the segments and power them with a power probe / test light while monitoring milliamps through the probe.
     
    #5 rjparker, Mar 27, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2024
  6. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    Good questions. The car does have an SKS FOB, but the key is far away indoors AND the proximity key dection is turned off with the key cancel switch. In addition, the 7.5 A OBD fuse being inserted or removed should not affect the proximity key detection.
     
  7. mr_guy_mann

    mr_guy_mann Senior Member

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    Are you sure that your DVOM is reading correctly? I never use the low amp internal shunt on mine because it's to easy to pop the fuse. (Yours shows 0.2A - 200mA max - that's less than a 12V test light with a "peanut" incandescent bulb).

    I have seen some meters given wonky readings in amps mode when the fuse was popped. I always test that the meter reads what I expect when I use a suitable "test load". Example, I use the 20A range to complete the circuit on my test light to a battery - the light should illuminate and draw about 250mA.

    The 20A range will typically also read milliamps - not as accurate as the low range but good enough.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
    #7 mr_guy_mann, Mar 28, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2024
  8. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    Appreciate your thoughts. If I buy a 2009 wiring manual, I will likely buy a paper manual such as is found on eBay. I DO like that Toyota’s diagram is interactive as you described.

    i agree with your thoughts. I thought about removing one of the two wires from the J/B to determine which side had the “shunt” parasitic draw, and I also thought to just replace the whole length of wire with a separate wire and see what stops working. Remember though, both middle connectors on the rear side bottom of the ECU body/JB #1 have to be removed, or the fuse, to get rid of the parasitic draw. I don’t understand why this occurs, perhaps that is a clue to the problem or the additional circuits alluded to drawing current from the OBD fuse.

    I did replace the ECU body/JB#1 with another, no change.
     
  9. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    You must be an electrical engineer, as I am. I had thought about the 200K measurement, and decided it was likely an active circuit not a pure resistance. As the voltage rises above what my meter is supplying, the current rises much faster.

    I carefully inspected and cleaned (with CRC circuit cleaner) the OBD connector and the middle junction box pins. I also measured no shorts to adjacent pins in that junction box.

    I will go look up which connector is 1L (after taxes are complete) and think about that.
     
  10. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    i understand precisely what you mean. I used three different meters, and yes, I have blown the fuse or current shunt in meters before.
    I make my measurement between the negative battery post wire and the chassis ground. To make a precise measurement, I parallel a jumper between the two and my current meter, wait for the current to step down to its lowest value, and then remove the jumper. The meter showed the 155ma. I also used a cheap HF 10a scale meter without the jumper in parallel, and wait for the current to drop to its lowest value of 0.15 a. When I pull the OBD fuse, the current drops to 0.001 or 0.000.

    I should mention that I have ALL the fuses and relays removed from the fuse tray in the engine compartment, and all the ECUs on the passenger side, and all the displays, and the radio/DVD. I have at times pulled the brake box next to the 12 volt battery, the connector to the key ECU and the passenger side air bag, and also all the relays and connectors on the drivers side inside fuse block. So when I say the current drops to nothing, It is awfully close to nothing! I do have to plug in those 2 lower middle connectors on the back side below the body eco to have the parasitic current draw.
     
  11. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    Because I have so many plugs, relays, fuses removed my current is close to zero when I pull the OBD fuse.
    There is nothing plugged into the OBD connector.
    I have no aftermarket devices, I bought this car used and believe it to be stock.
    We think alike about seeing what stops working with the OBD fuse removed. I have everthing torn apart and hesitate reassembling all to try this now, but eventually will if nothing else surfaces. Now that I think more about it, I could just reassemble just the electrical stuff and try it. (After taxes)
     
  12. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    The fuse boxes can get “green crusties” - corrosion which is conductive.

    As an EE you should know that injecting power on a segmented circuit will tell the story. This is the technique most mechanics use and works because of its simplicity.

    Some dealers of used cars hide trackers which are typically connected to this circuit. As do insurance companies with drive loggers. I could get a discount if I allowed my insurance to monitor my driving.
     
    #12 rjparker, Mar 28, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2024
  13. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    CORRECTION: It was not both plugs, it was only the larger of the two middle connectors (1L) and pin 5, just as in the Toyota wiring diagram.

    So, I am thinking to cut the wire at 1L and at the OBD connector and replace that entire run with my own wire. I finished my taxes so back focused on my Prius. I also think I will follow the wire as much as I can looking for any overheated or chaffed wiring first (but not taking much of the black electrical tape loose) Stay tune!
     
    #13 BJJ, Mar 28, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 28, 2024
  14. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    i know about corrosion (aka green crusties) which can be conductive. I have looked for it as I disconnected fuses and connectors or wiring, and not found any. It is not surprising, as this Prius has been in Colorado and New Mexico which are dryer climates.

    I think I will segment the wire at the central junction box as I have nothing to lose by doing so. Who knows, the “short” could be inside that box.

    As for trackers, I haven’t seen any but it could have had one that was removed, and left a bare wire that could short to something else. When I do a close inspection after segmenting, I will be on the lookout for such.
     
  15. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    I found this device, which is strange because all but two of the wires (red and black) to it are cut,

    upload_2024-3-29_8-30-46.jpeg

    upload_2024-3-29_8-31-13.jpeg

    I did a search using the part number (see picture) and I believe it is a GPS tracker. Here are some links with the FCC data including a user manual and a picture that looks the same. The user manual shows the current can run as high a 1 amp to power the GPS receiver and cell phone connection.

    OET List Exhibits Report

    https://apps.fcc.gov/eas/GetApplicationAttachment.html?id=2717937

    Red&Black wires appear to be power connection, so I will track them down and see where they connect. Stay tuned!

    Update: found this searching for the FCC id:

    TALONCV001 CDMA vehicle tracking device User Manual TALONCV001 _Rev 2 Montage Systems, .
     
    #15 BJJ, Mar 29, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2024
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  16. BJJ

    BJJ Junior Member

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    It was connected to the 12v pin on the OBD connector. This picture shows the ground connection after electrical tape was removed. The +12 v connection was similar. I removed both connections and then measured the parasitic draw……GONE! (I taped the stripped wires well)

    Now to reinstall everything and hope I haven’t caused any new problems. Stay tuned…

    upload_2024-3-29_9-2-53.jpeg
     
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  17. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    Poor li'l thing ... there hasn't even been a CDMA network for it to connect to for the last couple years. Must've been lonely.
     
  18. rjparker

    rjparker Tu Humilde Sirviente

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    Another thing they did not teach you in school.

    My degree simply proved I was capable of learning and was able to achieve goals.
     
    #18 rjparker, Mar 29, 2024
    Last edited: Mar 29, 2024
  19. RandyPete

    RandyPete Member

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    Excellent !
     
  20. pasadena_commut

    pasadena_commut Senior Member

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    Presumably you didn't buy this car new. Where did it come from?

    (Wondering if this was a rental and they didn't remove their tracker when they sold it.)