Featured The ‘greenest’ car in America might surprise you

I'll see your stinky tailpipe - & raise it .... a drive-by of nearby refineries.
I love the smell of a benzene flare in the morning. Smells like victory.

 

Yeah, the price points are crazy right now.
If I didn’t like the 3 so much I’d be getting a Y right now as well.

 

The information appears to be from the US government's fueleconomy.gov web site. The data there is presented based on the law that provided the funding for that project.

I found that it was odd that the 2017 Prius Prime had a higher MPGe (133 , if I recall correctly) than any of the EVs but that it never showed near the top of the sort when you looked for the most efficient car models. The response to my query to the team who maintained the web site directed me to the section of the law that specified how the models would be ranked. The rules were such that the PHEVs were only measured by one part of the mileage tests. From that site:
( Fueleconomy.gov Top Ten )

"Fueleconomy.gov Top Ten

Vehicle types considered: All years; all vehicles
Vehicles are ranked by their EPA combined city/highway rating. All-Electric vehicle (EV) fuel economy is given in Miles Per Gallon equivalent (MPGe), where 33.7 kWh = 1 gallon of gasoline. Plug-in hybrid Vehicles (PHEV) are ranked by their combined gas/electricity rating."

And yet they are not really done that way. The Prius is rated only on the gas city/highway rating and comes out with an MPG(e) rating of 57/56 city/highway. The electric rating is ignored. It's spelled out in the bill that provided funding for fueleconomy.gov .

Rank
Vehicle MPG(e) Comb. City/Hwy 1
2024 Hyundai Ioniq 6 Long range RWD (18 inch Wheels)
Automatic (A1)
140 153/127 2
2024 Lucid Air Pure RWD with 19 inch wheels
Automatic (A1)
137 140/134 3
2024 Hyundai Ioniq 6 Standard Range RWD
Automatic (A1)
135 151/120 4
2024 Lucid Air Pure RWD with 20 inch wheels
Automatic (A1)
130 134/126 5
2024 Hyundai Ioniq 6 Long range AWD (18 inch Wheels)
Automatic (A1)
121 130/111 6
2024 BMW i4 eDrive35 Gran Coupe (18 inch Wheels)
Automatic (A1)
120 122/119 7
2024 Hyundai Ioniq 6 Long range RWD (20 inch Wheels)
Automatic (A1)
117 129/105

2024 Kia EV6 Long Range RWD
Automatic (A1)
117 134/101

2024 Kia EV6 Standard Range RWD
Automatic (A1)
117 136/100 8
2024 Hyundai Kona Electric Long Range
Automatic (A1)
116 129/103 9
2024 Polestar 2 Single Motor (19 Inch Wheels)
Automatic (A1)
115 124/106 10
2024 Hyundai Ioniq 5 Long range RWD
Automatic (A1)
114 132/98

 

Not sure if that speaks for the RAV4 or more against the Camry - a very specifc car barely availabe outside of the NA market.
My point was just that it seems odd to have an SUV as a top 10 efficient car when the general consensus is more like smalle/ligher -> more efficient.
Might send the wrong signals but probably a signal that lets automotive companies (especially German luxury brands) open the champagne bottles. After all no one wants to make smaller cars due to margins - unless they really have to.

 

I saw this news article today and loved it!

It does make sense when you factor in all the manufacturing and weight and other factors that go into making the cars.

 

No problem with using that data, but yes phevs have different assumptions based on use cases. The epa in sorting phevs combines electric and gasoline based on assumptions about how they will be used based on aer. So the 2024 prius prime will rank higher despite electric and hybrid figures being slightly lower because the longer electric range will translate to fewer gasoline miles. YMMV and fuel economy.gov does allow you to plug in your own numbers and location. Bigger problem is the tests are off from real world.

But this is not the problem with green cars methodology. It uses bad numbers for usefull life, recycling, and greeness of materials. It makes the numbers completely useless. In 2012 maybe their poor assumptions made sense but its 2024 and there are a lot of real world numbers out there.

 

The authors were overly ambitious, trying to boil down several irreducibly complex things into a simple top 10 list.

We would be good to remind ourselves that the whole point was gathering clicks, not settling debate.

 

Doing it for the clicks. Good analysis. It's like a bubble gum music fan making a top 10 Rock list leading with Karen Carpenter, the monkeys, & Barry Manilow.

 

That could never happen!

 

They reduce everything to a cost value, which could be explained in the methodology. Then they converted that to a green score. I don't think we ever figured out that process in past discussions. Kind of like CR and others' scoring system.

Its the modded compact cars here.

Half the cars on the list are SUVs. They are all in the compact SUV sales segment. While model bloat means they are no longer true compacts, they aren't the large tall wagon people picture on hearing SUV. The tallness gives an illusion of being big. These are what replaced the once very common midsize sedan here. The Camry being almost a foot longer than the Rav4 would actually be more difficult to live with in areas of cramped roads.

Typical North American models are large compared to what Europe sees, but NA is one the largest car markets in the world, and this is an US organization.

 

Comparing the top models of four manufactures:



These are the best of each manufacturer and followed with lower trim models.

Bob Wilson

 

Ahhh!

Seems like everybody has a 10 ten list. Like this one:
https://www.caranddriver.com/news/g46933140/plug-in-hybrids-longest-range/
PHEVs only and they drive them at 75 mph in which I found the results surprising. Like the NX 450h+ beating the RAV4 Prime in both mileage, EV range, total range and they have the same power train. Yep per their test the Prius Prime beat the RAV4 Prime.

 

Mostly compact cars and diesel pickups here. Still can’t wrap my head around my neighbor’s Gremlin rambling back and forth. Not sure if has the 199 or 236 I6 heavily modified of course.

 

They want to make money. If people aren't buying smaller cars, then they don't want to make them. If people are buying smaller cars, then they want to make them. The idea that car manufacturers are greedy corporations willing to destroy the planet in the name of pursuing profit is logically inconsistent with the belief that car manufacturers are forgoing profits in an effort to destroy the planet.

The distinction between "they aren't willing to make" and "the public aren't willing to buy" is critical. In the former case it might make sense to use regulatory means to compel them to manufacture smaller, more efficient cars, but in the latter case that strategy will do nothing except create additional pollution and waste by forcing the use of resources to manufacture products people don't want to buy. If forcing the adoption of smaller, more efficient vehicles is the aim, in the latter case only compelling consumer decisions has the possibility to achieve the desired outcome. However, most people would agree that having a government dictating what you will purchase and for how much is not compatible with the tenets of a free society.

 

Not wrong, but doesn't account for the distortion dealers bring into the system.

Automakers aren't building directly to what the buyers want.

They're building what the dealers are ordering.

Dealers are doubling and tripling down on the bet that they can sell you (and me, and everyone) a big plush SUV, so that's what they order.

Demand for smaller and simpler cars isn't being faithfully represented by the middleman.

 

How to Buy a Factory-Ordered New Car | Edmunds
"A build-to-order vehicle from the manufacturer ensures you get the exact car, color and option combination that you want, and it's a method that can save time tracking down a vehicle that fits your needs. This special-order vehicle, as it is sometimes called, is usually arranged at the dealership, but for some brands, ordering online is the only way to buy. It is also a way to circumvent "market adjustments," aka dealer markups, which have become all too common these days. While you may not necessarily get a discount with a custom order, you could very well get a better deal than if you bought off the lot."

How to Factory Order a Car (For 2023) Step-By-Step - CarEdge

Ordering a Car from the Factory: Everything You Need to Know - Kelley Blue Book (kbb.com)

How to Factory Order a Hyundai (9 Easy Steps) | Find The Best Car Price

Order Your New Kia Online Or In Person At Gunther Kia

Build Your Own Toyota | Toyota Configurator

 

The full list of vehicles tested includes Teslas. Those just didn't make it to the top (or the bottom), just middling.

 

Yep. It looks at the full lifecycle, including manufacturing of the gigantic batteries in BEVs, which are major sources of pollution.

Another reason why a PHEV can win is because the vast majority of people drive less than 40 miles per day (27 or so in fact think). This means a PHEV (with a much smaller battery and) with the EV range of a Prius Prime can effectively have no emissions when used daily since EV mode will easily take care of that.

 

Excellent point:

I prefer a larger jury pool, those who buy their car.

Bob Wilson

 

Yep, I spotted that after someone else mentioned it upthread.

I am very skeptical of that list.
How do they conclude that a heavier, less efficient Model Y is greener than a smaller, more efficient Model 3?

The Prime at number 1 isn’t a surprise. But the methodology is … suspect.