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Walmart changes my oil I change my head gaskets. Follow along! (HALP)

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by LazarusSyndrome, Sep 18, 2023.

  1. LazarusSyndrome

    LazarusSyndrome Junior Member

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    Long story short engine go boom, Toyota wants 4500$, I want a million dollars, to escape the rental market, and to quit work forever.

    So basically I'm creating this post to document my progress and so people who know better can scream at me when I mis-step.

    I did a lot of research and acquired a Haynes manual. This research essentially told me the price Toyota quoted is fair. The price is fair because if the engine was hydro locked and bent a connecting rod you may have to have your short block assembly replaced which costs 2300$. It's probably going to cost you 500$ in parts and tools and take a good mechanic about 8 hours. I am not a mechanic and certainly not a good one so this is probably going to take a month or two and I'd laugh at you if you offered me 1700$ to do this for you because it's back breaking leaning over an engine bay and I can't feel my fingers after 8 hours of messing with stuck clips and connectors.

    That said I am still determined to do this because I don't have 4500$ I'm REALLY hoping I don't have to replace that short block plus I'm hoping to get some use out of the tools.

    But also I've had several garages tell me they weren't interested in repair or hang up on me when I tell them:
    • I have a hybrid.
    • I need a blown head gasket repaired.
    • My car odometer reads 250 summin k ...
    A few more comments:

    The Haynes manual doesn't talk about checking the warpage on the head gasket surface I am aware of this and will be adding this step. I saw someone use a straight edge and feeler gauges to check. I know that a machine shop will have to fix this if it's out of spec.

    I know that I can check if the connecting rod is bent by comparing the elevation of the cylinders relative to each other and making sure they all come all the way up.

    Lets color code this for fun:
    Completed tasks
    Impossible tasks
    In Progress.

    Where we are so far:
    • I pulled the service plug.
    • I depressurized the fuel system / unplugged the fuel pump. This step told me to start the engine by depressing the brake and putting the ac on cold but the car would not start with the fuel pump disconnected it only went to accessory and turned back off when i tried to start it.
    • Next I removed my bumper to access the heat storage tank. There was no heat storage tank.
    • All right smooth sailing... Next step is to drain the coolant in the non-existent heat storage tank, the radiator, and the transaxle.


    I
     
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  2. LazarusSyndrome

    LazarusSyndrome Junior Member

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    HOLD UP OP You probably didn't depressurize the fuel system right... "To depressurize the fuel system, find the wiring harness to the fuel pump under the rear seat cushion. Make the Prius READY and put it in inspection mode so the engine will continuously run. Disconnect the fuel pump and wait for the engine to stall." - Patrick Wong

    You might wanna buy the Prius manual from Toyota and cross check it with the manual you understand.

    Also do this before you remove the coolant so your engine doesn't overheat.
     
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  3. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    This is all on the road to getting the engine out of the car wow you're doing a lot of I don't even know what for seemingly nothing 8 hours My guy that changes my engines locally in North Carolina who yeah it's 8 hours to take out the old engine with or without the transmission many times I'm changing the engine and the transmission so there are match set similar and mileage like 65,000 I'm taking out stuff that's 250 plus k. So he rips out the engine and transmission in an afternoon after work then the next day after work he takes the transmission and the engine from the JDM supplier basically bolts them together and drops them in the car and then plugs everything up this takes about 8 hours and he charges me $800 for the engine and transmissions swap. I pay 1200 for the engine $250 for the transmission or very similar It might have gone up since the last one I did 10 months ago and then all we had is CVT fluid engine oil coolant and I do believe that's it The air conditioning compressor is left in the car and never discharged and it's just hung back on the side of the engine plugged up and off we go I wouldn't read too much into a lot of this stuff depressurizing the fuel system seriously yeah okay just put your safety glasses on and crack the fitting hold the towel over it your fuel pressure is like 40 PSI or something like that it'll squirt enough maybe that maybe that you'll feel it through the rag maybe then there's no pressure. Don't let it run away with you buying a center section from Toyota for I don't even know what it is now $1,800 or something on an open deck design not a very good choice in my opinion. Good luck with your project
     
  4. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    search

    following, all the best!
     
  5. Mr. F

    Mr. F Active Member

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    Replacing a bent rod is not difficult, and you can very well do it with the short block in place.

    I would also consider getting access to the Toyota manual for its accurate instructions.
     
  6. LazarusSyndrome

    LazarusSyndrome Junior Member

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    Bigggggg Update! Soooo it's been a while I've been slowly collecting parts and tools and I just restarted this past week but I've made a ton of progress.

    • Reconnected the fuel pump, battery, and service plug put the car in maintenance mode and disconnected the fuel pump.
    • Jacked the car up and removed the passenger tire and some panels to access the bottom of the engine on this side.
    • Drained the oil and the coolant from the radiator.
    • Removed the windshield wiper assembly and cowl
    • Unhooked all the wiring harnesses.
    • Removed the throttle body.
    • Removed the intake manifold.
    • Removed the EGR uhhh stuff need to do more work on identifying that (BTW gonna clean this)

    Sooooo questions

    Under the throttle body there was a small pool of oil in the bottom of the intake manifold is this normal? (Picture)

    When I attempted to depressurize the fuel system by putting the car in maintenance mode the engine turned on ran for a few seconds and then died but it sounded a lot like it normally does when the hybrid system decides to turn it off. So I did it again with the same result. I'm not sure if I did this properly.

    What's left:
    • Cleaning the EGR
    • Replacing the PCV valve
    • Replacing the timing chain (I was told to do this should I buy a kit with sprockets to?)
    • Replacing the rotors (After the car is drivable again) (They are horrifically rusted)
    • The head gasket which I came to do before I got carried away.
    Unfortunately it looks like I'm gonna be taking another break I have a lot of parts I need to order (head bolts, pcv, timing chain, brake fluid for the EGR) not to mention winter is coming or not it's hard to tell here.
     

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  7. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    Pretty normal look under the throttle body You do realize these engines have really poor oil control rings and this is what's helping you get to blow by and all the nonsense It's not the same as my 1zz 0r early 2zz. I think this is a Prius only thing along with this regurgitating Atkinson cycle I think the combination of these things is the engine killer which is no matter to Toyota was looking for maximum MPG extraction and if they could get the car to run close to 200k that was okay to them I truly believe that. The most folks 200k with almost no maintenance You're usually doing your first brake job on a Prius at close to 200k 180 whatever it is been up to that point you've done nothing basically hopefully anyway and now the oil control ring start allowing blow by the Atkins and cycle is been regurgitating for a long time things are getting dirty carbon and build up is stacking up behind the valves so on and so forth you really want to fix all that seriously well good on you buddy . And then after you do all that the rest of the car starts to implode if you will The plastic the thin sheet metal trim all of that and you've got this newly rebuilt motor ready to go near another 200k but everything else is starting to dwindle away. Just like Teslas and electric cars they say they'll go a million miles right or lots of miles they're going to need three interiors to do it those seats in the Tesla aren't going to hold up no million miles impossible that car will look like pure h a l e at 250k or you've put the 250K on in 2 years.
     
  8. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    The complete engine section of Toyota Repair Manual can be opened/downloaded in last link of my signature (on phone turn it landscape to see signature). To avoid a repeat, see top two links in my signature.
     
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  9. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

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    That will depressurize the fuel system, but so will doing anything else that lets the pressure out.

    The "wait for engine to stall" way sounds nice, but what'll often happen is it'll run for a bit, then misfire for a while, then finally stall. During the misfiring part, just like it does when misfiring for any other reason, it will beat the daylights out of the transmission damper and sound like the transmission is going to fall out of the car. Then it finally stalls and you know it's gone to a better place.

    Applying a nine-volt battery to one of the injectors will squirt some fuel into the intake port until the pressure is used up. Easy and quick and no bashing stuff up.
     
  10. LazarusSyndrome

    LazarusSyndrome Junior Member

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    Update: Finally got the expected funds sorted I'm going to try and finish up disassembly this week before my paycheck Thursday.
    • Removed water pump
    • Removed thermostat housing
    • Removed cam cover
    When I reached the cams I noticed the whole compartment was uhh painted in oil. I'm not sure how to clean this or if I should...

    I have to remove the engine mount on the left side soon for better access to the timing cover. When the engine drops down does it rest on anything? Is it designed to do this? If I have to delay again how long would it be okay to leave it like this? Should I do anything to support it like a jack stand?
     
  11. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk EGR Fanatic

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    Oil is normal.
    It'll be ok.

    Again, if you haven't noticed, last link in my signature is the full engine section from the Repair Manual. There's a couple of other links in there that are relevant, the head gasket replacement ones.

    Also again, do a full clean of the intake manifold and EGR components, to avoid another head gasket failure in short order. See the top two links in my signature.

    (If viewing on a phone, turn it landscape to see signatures)
     
  12. Tombukt2

    Tombukt2 Senior Member

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    I usually put one of my three jacks the smallest one under the engine if it's going to be at the oil pan or that little plate then I put a piece of foam or something between the jack and the pan just going to let it sit on there or not doing a lot of jacking and whatnot then you can move the engine up and down a little bit with that mount undone to get things at various angles throughout the business.
     
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  13. LazarusSyndrome

    LazarusSyndrome Junior Member

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    Update!!
    • Pulled out the head gasket! (A lot happened so I'll just summarize it here.)
    • Inspected connecting rods all good!
    • Measured block (This didn't go to well)
    So I think my straight edge is bad. The feeler gauges tests were mostly fine except in the middle where sometimes it slipped through and sometimes it got caught up.

    I'm thinking I'm probably going to just have the head machined and stick the new gasket on and hope for the best. Otherwise I'd have to buy a new straight edge to confirm the block is bad, buy all the tools I need to remove the block, have the block and the head machined, etc...

    As others have said I might be better off with a new engine at that point but I have a gasket and an engine I don't need anyways so why not give it a good cleaning slap it back together and see how many mileage paychecks I can squeeze out of it...

    For curiosity sake how much trouble would it be at this point to pull the engine block as well?
     
  14. LazarusSyndrome

    LazarusSyndrome Junior Member

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    Woops! I think I messed up the timing :p

    I found a good timing video that makes me fairly confident I can put it back together right just one thing I'm fuzzy on and I'm not sure if it matters or not... I rotated the engine after the head was off to check if the connecting rods were bent and lost my place. I'm not sure if the engine is on the compression or the exhaust stroke anymore... Does it matter if all the timing marks are in the right place? How do I tell what stroke it's on without the head cams and timing chain installed?
     
  15. Mr. F

    Mr. F Active Member

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    The only difference between the compression and the exhaust strokes are the positions of the intake and exhaust valves. Valve positions are controlled only by the camshafts, and the camshaft positions directly correspond to timing marks on the timing gear (intake) and timing sprocket (exhaust).

    As long as the timing marks are in place, the valves positions will be correct, so there won't be a need to worry about what stroke the engine is in.
     
    #15 Mr. F, Feb 27, 2024
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2024
  16. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    Where you checking the head, or block? It's doubtful the block would
    be warped, it's cast iron.
    Was it burning oil? Did you look into the cylinders and see abnormal wear?

    If you take the head to the machine shop they can use their straight edge and see
    if it's warped.

     
  17. LazarusSyndrome

    LazarusSyndrome Junior Member

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    So I got the head back from the shop but there are these two male pipes that three hours of fiddling tell me they definitely don't fit together in any way (See bottom left of block picture)

    Both of these terminate in a shiny end they aren't holes can I just saw the one off the head to make life easier or would that be a dumb mistake?

    Should I take it back to the shop? Is it possible they added it? I don't have any before pictures of the underside of the head unfortunately.
     

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  18. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    They are the guide pins, they align the head on the block.
    If you hold the head over the block, you'll see where they line up...

     
  19. LazarusSyndrome

    LazarusSyndrome Junior Member

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    That's what I assumed but as I said I tried for a long time to get them to slot together even broke out a mirror and had help. If they ever did align they don't anymore can these be safely removed?
     
  20. ASRDogman

    ASRDogman Senior Member

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    Okay, I guess I missunderstood.
    They may be out of round. It's best to get under them to "pull" them out.
    Maybe file them down a little bit. But you need them to align the head correctly
    on the block.

     
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