Uneven break pad wear

Discussion in 'Gen 3 Prius Care, Maintenance & Troubleshooting' started by PixelRogue, Jul 21, 2023.

  1. PixelRogue

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    453
    82
    0
    Location:
    US
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    N/A
    Hello everyone,

    Replaced my own brakes and rotors in January. Today the car is inspected and a flag surfaced on brake wearing. Tech stated not major, guessing ceasing of the caliper (lack of grease.) During the job I removed older grease, added new grease and ensured the calipers were moving smoothly. Apx. 4,000 miles since brake job.

    Reading:
    Front Left: 8/32
    Front Right: 6/32
    Rear Left: 6/32
    Rear Right: 6/32

    Thoughts?
     
    Montgomery likes this.
  2. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    25,665
    16,765
    0
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    Those reported thicknesses seem awfully low for new pads 4,000 miles old. Also, the tech has only given one reading for each corner of the car, not the inboard and outboard pad measurements at each.

    Since you clearly have the skills to inspect your brakes yourself, I would do that and see what you find.
     
  3. PixelRogue

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    453
    82
    0
    Location:
    US
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    N/A
    The tech states 'uneven' wear, pointing out the 8/32 anomaly w/the others being 6/32...didn't mention brakes as running thin.

    6/32, 8/32 has no meaning atm other than the anomaly and when looking up brake pad measurements get a variety of references yet none mapping to x/32. I'm enclosing the relevant piece from the report.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    4,000 is a guesstimate as I didn't actually capture the milage when I changed the pads - lesson learned.
    HA! I did capture milage which was 71k and just turned 75k so 4k on the dot.
     

    Attached Files:

  4. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    57,961
    39,991
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    “6/32” and “8/32” seems an odd way to be reporting brake pad thickness, which is specd by Toyota (and most everyone if I’m not mistaken) in millimeters. New pad thickness for both front and rear is roughly 10 mm (9.5 mm for rears IIRC), and “service limit” (bare minimum) is 1.0 mm.

    If I’d made the effort to remove the pads for a check and they were even at 3~4 mm I’d probably replace.

    As @ChapmanF says, 6/32, presumably inches, is oddly low for near-new pads, less than 5 mm. And yeah, check them yourself will clear things up.
     

    Attached Files:

  5. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    25,665
    16,765
    0
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    I was too lazy to do an actual conversion between mm and inch/32, rather I just went "hmm, mm is inch/25.4, so inch/32 is smaller than a mm, so 10 mm oughtta be (more than 10)/32, so 6/32 or even 8/32 sounds mighty thin for 4,000 miles of use".
     
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  6. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    57,961
    39,991
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    What is "state inspection", just a local garage authorized to inspections? It rankles a little to have someone, presumably paid well, spec pad thickness in such an off-hand, unorthodox and incomplete way. On the state goverment's payroll?

    Too, have to ask: were you careful with the rear brake caliper piston orientation? Good to verify too, after a drive: raise the rear and see that the wheels spin semi-freely. There's something in my signature on the subject. (on a phone turn it landscape to see signature).
     
  7. PixelRogue

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    453
    82
    0
    Location:
    US
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    N/A
    Thank you for the responses. I'll be calling the shop for details on the numbers.

    Yes, state inspection (state + emissions.)
    Yes, rear spun w/an ever so slight drag where I posted a video or two for a pulse check on how freely, or the drag. Everything from the driving experience has been normal, same as before the work.
     
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  8. PixelRogue

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    453
    82
    0
    Location:
    US
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    N/A
    UPDATE

    • 10/32 would be considered brand new.
    • 2/32 would be considered too low, fail inspection.

    ---
    When the brakes are showing 6/32 w/only 4k miles, that is considered excessive wear (essentially worn 50% on just 4k)
    Driver side brake is 8/32, more in line w/expectations of 4k miles than 6/32.

    All calibers were regressed and operating smoothly. No adjustments were made to the brake lines themselves. Changed pads, changed rotors, flushed brake lines (could the flush have something to do w/it?)
     
  9. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    25,665
    16,765
    0
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    Who supplied you with that information? The numbers seem off.

    Toyota specs their pad thicknesses in millimeters, not in /32.

    When new, Gen 3 front pads are 10 mm (about 13/32 if somebody wanted to say it that way), and rear pads are 9.5 mm (about 12/32).

    Front left being down to 8/32 from 13/32 isn't anywhere near "in line w/expectations" for 4k miles. Unless expectations are to use up the pad completely before 10k. Many people have them last ten or twenty times that.

    Also, there should be eight measurements total: two for each corner of the car. At each wheel, there is an inboard and an outboard pad. They don't always wear equally.
     
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  10. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    57,961
    39,991
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Maybe time to switch to millimeters?

    10/32 (presumably of an inch) is equiv to 7.9375 mm. New front pad thickness is 10 mm, and "service limit" is 1 mm.

    upload_2023-7-24_13-6-52.png

    New rear pad thickness is 9.5 mm, and same minimum thickness:

    upload_2023-7-24_13-7-48.png

    Again, anything less than 4 mm, if I had them in my hands, I'd be inclined to just replace.
     

    Attached Files:

  11. PixelRogue

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    453
    82
    0
    Location:
    US
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    N/A
    The inspection shop itself, saying this is how the state records brakes. I have a relationship w/a tire company and bring in for service and will ask their take.

    I have gone years w/o replacing pads...years and years.... 20k or more.
     
  12. CR94

    CR94 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014
    2,653
    1,145
    0
    Location:
    Northwestern S.C.
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    True, but who can explain why tread depth on tires must still be expressed in 32nds of an inch? Or why standard tire size designations are a crazy jumble of metric and inch units?
     
    Mendel Leisk likes this.
  13. Mendel Leisk

    Mendel Leisk Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2010
    57,961
    39,991
    80
    Location:
    Greater Vancouver, British Columbia, Canada
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Touring
    Up here everything’s metric first, and often no imperial units, say in brackets. More often than not it’s a product (say a tub of margarine, aka “buttery spread” in the States) originally measured in imperial (ounces, cups, quarts), and the cubic centimetre conversion is some odd conversion, hopeless when you’re standing in a store, trying to cost-compare various sizes, without a spreadsheet.

    the “best” units are invariably the ones things are originally designed in.

    conversions add countless hours and frustration/complexity in my past profession, structural engineering.
     
  14. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    25,665
    16,765
    0
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    Ok, but what numbers are embossed on the sides of tires there?
     
    CR94 likes this.
  15. CR94

    CR94 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2014
    2,653
    1,145
    0
    Location:
    Northwestern S.C.
    Vehicle:
    2011 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    The same mix of inches, millimeters, pounds, kg, psi, and kPa we have?
     
  16. Paladain55

    Paladain55 Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2021
    388
    153
    0
    Location:
    The South
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    The best way to check is to squeeze all of the caliper guide pins while the brakes are fully assembled and make sure you can squeeze them in and out a bit easily with just your hand. If you can't then it was done incorrectly. I do mine once a year as I have found they effect gas mileage.
    If the caliper guide pins have lost their nickel finish and you have the original dry rotted boots i would go ahead and get new sliding pins and boot kits for all 4 corners. Then just get a drill brush and some brake clean, drill brush out all of the caliper brackets to make sure all of the old grease and corrosion has been removed. For reinsertion i use sil-glyde on the pins up to the bushing with a small amount on the bushing and nothing before that on the tip. So you can insert them without trapping air in the cavity.
    Past that i also like to use a high temp ceramic grease on the pad clips that grab the ears of the pads and a bit on the piston of the caliper to reduce corrosion to the pad backing plate. Mine are so free i can hear the pads click in and out of the clip because the pad clip fully retracts them out after a while of sitting lol. When doing the thin layer of grease on the pads clips the difference is dry you have to push the pads in and they stay in the inner position. After greasing them up correctly you have to hold them in as the clip wants to throw them out until you get the caliper back on.
    When i had the original pins and boots where the boots were broken and the pins had corroded and lost their finish, doing brake lube jobs every 3 years i noticed i was getting a lot of seizing and pads were wearing unevenly. After I swapped to new hardware and lube once a year my mpg went up around 15% back to normal.

    Also, for good measure when doing the rears i like to bend the pad retraction springs out a bit to give me a bit more springyness back there for good measure.
     
  17. Paladain55

    Paladain55 Active Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2021
    388
    153
    0
    Location:
    The South
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    Two
    The jumble of metric and standard was more or less caused by us in the usa swapping to cheap asian manufacturing and thats what they used. So we adopted a lot of their metric standards to make things easy. Now say a new Ford is pretty much all metric as thats what they used to design the car now. But the older ones were a mix of 1/4", 3/8", 10mm, 1/2", 15mm, 16mm, 17mm, and 13/16" lol
    It really makes simple jobs on say an old Ford Ranger tough when say a Sequoia pretty much just uses 8mm, 10mm,12mm,15mm, 17mm, 21mm
    The tire size thing is confusing until you realize most tire shops still tell people to repace at 2/32."
    I can't quite remember the old standard tire width sizing but it was more confusing than the metric way
     
  18. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    25,665
    16,765
    0
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    I had a Bronco II, basically a Ranger with no rain in the back, with its Canadian body, German engine, Japanese transmission, and US Borg-Warner transfer case.

    Pretty much all the bolts and nuts on it were metric, except for the bolts holding the transfer case to the transmission.
     
  19. PixelRogue

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    453
    82
    0
    Location:
    US
    Vehicle:
    2012 Prius Plug-in
    Model:
    N/A
    Update:

    Have the vehicle in a different shop which included brake inspection.
    Shop states front pads are equivalent of brand new...100%. Rear pads are at 80%.

    I am looking at the print out and and brakes state "BRAKES GOOD" but no info on uneven wear, measurements etc.

    ----
    Wouldn't a 20% wear on rear be considered heavy wear for new pads (4k miles?)
     
  20. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    25,665
    16,765
    0
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    I guess if they were marked ACME 20,000 MILE ECONOMY PADS or something, that would be considered right on track.