Project Lithium Nexcell V2

This morning very early I received the preorder availability email from them. Times like these I wish our 34k mi 11 yr old Prius needs a replacement battery, but to be completely honest battery life appears to be a function of mileage more than age…

Thank you! I do love to tinker with repairs on my own.

 

The main issue is the archaic battery chemistry from the later 80's & early 90's in Nickel Metal Hydride (NiMH) has a problem with losing its charge / self-discharge when not in use. As the battery gets older some modules will discharge faster than others, which is no big deal if you drive your car all the time. It's why taxi cabs can got more than 400K miles with no failed battery packs. Whereas people on PriusChat who own more than one Prius who don't drive them every single day, are the ones most likely to have had their packs replace under warranty.

Meanwhile in modern times, which Toyota refuses to embrace, all vehicles other than Toyota are using various types of lithium battery chemistry, which eliminates the self discharge problem, but the challenge with lithium is it loses capacity if you overcharge it. Nimh doesn't have that problem.

 

Correct, with Gen 4. Lithium Ion is used for all Prius except Toyota’s all-wheel-drive hybrids, like the 2019 Toyota Prius AWD-e. According to Prius chief engineer Shoichi Kaneko, the AWD-e models will, for the foreseeable future, use NiMH—because it can withstand extreme cold far better, and perform better in the cold temps where you’d expect an AWD vehicle to be used.

I'm curious how these batteries will perform long-term in extreme cold, such as Canada or Minnesota, for example. I'd love to beta test one, as I experience extreme temp changes (up to -10F winter and 90F+ summer) and drive 20k+ miles/year.

HOWEVER

According to Five Things to Know About the 2023 Toyota Prius and 2023 Toyota Prius Prime - Toyota USA Newsroom
it states:

I couldn't find information specifically about the AWD-e model.

 

While NiMH has a proven record for decades of operating fairly well in low temps, it's limited by the same factors as what limits other battery chemistry types in cold weather and all Prius battery ECU limits battery availability in extreme cold regardless of Lithium or NiMH.

What's more all more modern battery chemistries were an improvement on NiMH cold operating limits and all other measures as well, but Toyota gets away with their claim because these newer electrolytes have not proven themselves for decades yet.

 

I received my batteries last week. Install went very smooth. Just with the first 100 miles on it but the battery has not lowered from 1 bar from full charge. Sometimes it tops up the battery indicator which never happened with the stock battery unless going down a long hill. Temps are right around 100deg in SoCal summer weather (mid to high 70's).

 

have you tried it in ev mode?

 

Everyone getting these now should be Version 2's with better temp management and power. Would like to hear some mileage reports..they are different from Version 1.

 

Not yet. I’m breaking them in first. I’ll start playing with them more after my first full tank of gas.

 

Last winter I had my close to 3 year old prototype re-sleeved with production cases and V2.7 circuits put in... Current version is V2.8.

As always, trips around town in cold weather, the MPG isn't so good. But when I reset the mileage meter as I got on the freeway and drove for an hour I was shocked to see 52mpg in cold weather when it's usually 47-48mpg. These aren't precise measurements, but good enough to make me feel like the upgrade was worth it.

 

I recently had the honor of working on a fellow members 2007 Touring model with only 52k miles. After correcting some work done by a repair shop in Charlotte, I drove the car for about 500 miles to ensure there were no intermittent problems. Averaged over 63 mpg. When I drove the car back to her home, I filled the tank and reset the MFD. Drove from Columbia to just west of Charlotte, (was a bit over a 125 miles), rising elevation entire way and still hammered out >59 mpg. Absolutely amazing. I actually felt bad putting that many miles on it!!

 

Was that with a Nickel or Lithium pack?

 

100% original battery pack. NiMH.

 

Jack the crack replied to me that comparing mpgs bwteeen two different battery chemistry is stupid. Don’t be stupid now!

 

That is a thing you made up. Li-ion batteries just work. Do you 'break in' your new phone?

But, I'm on your side! I want to go with this upgrade when my pack dies.
I'm concerned about the weather extremes we get in the midwest, so I'm watching and learning.

 

I’m going by what Jack suggests which is to use it normally to let the packs equalize or balance the packs. He suggests 100 miles.

I think the difference between these batteries and cell phone batteries are the extreme charge discharge cycles it goes through. Also, these are run in series whereas cell batteries are not.
Either way better safe than sorry.

I’m curious about the EV range but in reality for me the EV mode is pretty useless.
If it were a plugin hybrid that would be different.
If using the EV mode in my car then when it does run down the battery the ICE has to constantly run until it’s charged up again. Which I assume (could be wrong) is the same amount of ICE use as if I didn’t run EV mode.
I haven’t really thought about much of this since I bought the car 14 years ago.

 

We were at the local shopping mall and passed by Potato Corner. My sister-in-law looked at the pricing and said what costs $7-$10 USD here costs $3-5 USD equivalent, (in Philippine Pesos), there in the Philippines.

Something’s wrong, and we’re already in trouble….

 

As valuable and relevant as this discussion of international politics is... I want to share that I've finally installed my new Nexcell pack in my 2005 Prius! Just drove about 25 miles including interstate and city driving. Averaged 45.8mpg, whereas before the replacement, my failing pack (NewPriusBatteries.com) was giving me like 40mpg.
Nick's pack served me well for 4 years, but sadly a module crapped out last October, Nick sent me a new one (new and therefore unbalanced with the rest of the pack) and then after months of troubleshooting and constant battery trouble codes, 4 weeks ago another cell crapped out even more catastrophically where I could no longer drive. A visual inspection showed visible moisture inside the module casing. Not everyone has issues with newpriusbatteries.com, but a few of us have, so it's a bit of a risk in my opinion.
The Project Lithium pack seems higher build quality in addition to its better performance. If I have any issues I'll report back, but I'm pleased so far! It was months of waiting to get it, but it was worth the wait for me. And only a few hundred dollars more than the newpriusbatteries.com pack.

 

Every battery is a risk. Every car is a risk. Some more than others.
Remember, 99% of them are made in china, but the same child slave labor.
So don't expect great quality control. They're making them "good enough" to last a few years
and the warranty expires.

And remember, the correct thing to do is to reprogram the ecu to tell it what type of hybrid battery
the car is using so it can charge it correctly.....

It would be nice if the replacements would be made as well as the original ones that last 10 years.
Mine has lasted 14 years, and still going well. With the help of Prolong.