After searching a little through the Priuschat forums, I saw a couple of posts talking about a PHEV Prius model in 2010. 2010!?!? CAN TOYOTA BE THAT SLOW TO MARKET?? I would pay a hefty premium (but not $12,000 - more like $5000) for a plug-in option. I'm sure Toyota could make money on this - why are they not including plug-in capability in the 2008? It can't be that much of a technical challenge - if you can recharge the battery by regenerating brake power, it seems like a no-brainer to get power from a wall socket! How many engineers does it take to plug in a hybrid?
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hi-Bred @ Dec 12 2006, 10:30 AM) [snapback]360950[/snapback]</div> Charging isn't the problem, it's coming up with enough battery capacity to hold a 30 to 60 mile capacity at an acceptable price, and acceptable life span, an acceptable weight, and safe. I don't think anyone can make all those parameters yet. (I'd like to see how GM is going to do it with their VUE)
Slow to market? Toyota's been a leader in Hybrid technology for what, almost 10 years? Given that there aren't any PHEV's available currently (ignoring after-market conversions), i wouldn't say they're slow to the market. as narf said, there are a lot of problems to be solved in packing that much battery power safely into the car - Toyota is working on them, and wants to make sure that whatever they come out with is as big a hit as the Prius. It wouldn't do them any good what so ever to come out with a PHEV that needs its batteries replaced after 60k miles - in fact, it would sour consumers and inhibit the adoption of future PHEV's.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hi-Bred @ Dec 12 2006, 11:30 AM) [snapback]360950[/snapback]</div> One ... who quickly learns what everyone else knew, that the problem is capacity, not the source. The HV battery has to stay mostly charged for it to last the longest. Draining it more and recharging it heavily cuts down on the number of cycles it can endure. So what you end up with is a much smaller effective storage capacity, good for a synergy effect but bad for a complete EV conversion. You could charge that from your wall socket. And you'd get a couple hundred extra feet off of it for your daily commute. Yipee? A true EV conversion where you can get miles out of a battery requires a much more serious battery. There are mods out there to do this. They add hundreds of pounds of weight, last a couple of years, and cost far more than the fuel you'll ever save from plugging in. But the technology is improving, and sooner or later it will actually become more of a reality. ("More of" meaning that you'll still have a notably limited number of miles per charge.) I think I'm happy to wait for hydrogen fuel cells for my EV. Until then, synergy hybrids are where it's at for me.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(eagle33199 @ Dec 12 2006, 09:44 AM) [snapback]360964[/snapback]</div> Fair enough. Yes, Toyota is unquestionably the (mass-market) leader in Hybrid technology. I'm happy with my '05 prius and I suspect it will last me until the Plug-in model becomes available. Though if I had $90,000 to blow, I'd buy a Tesla Roadster (or at least, get on the waiting list...) <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(narf @ Dec 12 2006, 09:36 AM) [snapback]360955[/snapback]</div> I heard somewhere that they were licensing the technology from Toyota. Hopefully we'll see the same technology in Toyota vehicles as well!
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Hi-Bred @ Dec 12 2006, 11:55 AM) [snapback]360972[/snapback]</div> Geeze. That looks cool. But I bet for 60 grand I could buy a shiny new Prius and mod it for EV to perform almost as well but also still have its gas engine for long drives, like visiting granny in Florida. :lol: And for 80 grand I could probably add solar panels to the body for recharging the EV cells if you leave it sitting outside on a sunny day. (Like when you're parked at work.)
I'm hoping to do a 7 to 10 mile range PHEV mod for about $4,000. Oh wait I want the CAN-View anyway so I can't count that, so make it a conversion for $3,200. Why would anyone spend $3,200 on a new car? You know, sound systems, seat upgrades, suspension upgrades, tinted windows, clear bra, different tires? Maybe I should stop calling it a conversion and start calling it a PHEV upgrade.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(narf @ Dec 12 2006, 09:36 AM) [snapback]360955[/snapback]</div> 2010 is a bit disappointing since I've read that the necessary battery technology already exists: http://www.altairnano.com/ also see http://priuschat.com/index.php?showtopic=2...p;hl=altairnano I wonder how Toyota is going to handle the transition from selling regular hybrids to PHEVs. The cannablization of sales in 2009 could be significant.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Silver Phoenix @ Dec 12 2006, 11:03 AM) [snapback]360974[/snapback]</div> Actually it might be simpler to add an ACP Backtracking Genset trailer to your Tesla Roadster, shoot, that's enough technology to turn any EV into a PHEV... As for the Prius, Toyota is not currently spending $3000 per battery pack, I suspect it's more in the range of $500, so if they wanted to they could sell a larger NiMH battery pack as an option. No, Wait, maybe they couldn't as they are limited to 6.5Ah modules because Texico/Ovonics keeps suing them when they build larger ones like their ?90Ah? RAV4 modules, since NiMH doesn't parallel well perhaps they are waiting for Lithium to mature. For Lithium there's a few promising names, Altair, Valence, A123, and E-Moli One are all "safe" lithium. Don't get me wrong, given the right circumstances you can pretty much blow up anything, like a tank or gas, current NiMH batteries, DietCoke and PopRocks...
