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What does a prius 2008 130k miles means if it had battery replaced 7 years ago?

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Main Forum' started by pri4u, Feb 12, 2023.

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  1. pri4u

    pri4u Member

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    Hello,

    I’m considering to buy this Toyota Prius 2008 gen 2 touring edition:

    2008 Toyota Prius-Clean - cars & trucks - by owner - vehicle...

    The seller says that he currently has 130k, he’s the second owner (first owner was private too) and claims:
    “He avgs 45mpg so battery is still healthy. I believe it was replaced maybe 7 years ago by the dealer, but he moved and does not have the records. ”

    When I asked him what kind of battery was it replaced to and if it was OEM, he says he doesn’t know if the replaced battery was OEM, but said the 12V battery that was replaced in back was for sure replaced with an aftermarket battery not OEM. Is there a way to check the health of his front battery and to know much battery left or what’s quality is it?

    Then he also mentions:

    “Just had new tires installed maybe 4k miles ago.($800). He also had a full tune up and mechanic recommended he replace full front shock assembly including top hats, and springs. He also replaced front sway bar links, air filter, cabin air filter, and windshield wipers.”

    Why such a relatively low mileage car would you need to replace the full front shock assembly including top hats? from what I understand this could be a serious issue and cost at least 1K to repair and why would he need to put the most expensive tires Costco Michelins for $800 is it to try to mask the issues or the symptoms with the full front shock assembly? Could the car been in an accident or some damage happened on it’s front portion that these issues exist?

    but later he says “title in hand, never been in an accident. Car needs nothing.“, which slightly contradicts what his mechanic says that’s needed.

    Do you think guys these are red flags about the car if the main front battery was replaced 7 years ago, so that means it had replaced around 50-60k - is it a known issue with this car that original battery goes bad for no reason? Like I owned this car from 100k to 200k miles and never had to do anything like that (my friend who had it also didn’t need to change his front battery) let alone doing any full front shock assembly repair which could imply the following issues (please correct me if I’m wrong):
    If you're wondering whether your vehicle needs to have the shocks or struts replaced, look for the following 6 signs:
    • Bumpy ride. ...
    • Steering problems. ...
    • Braking problems. ...
    • Fluid leaks. ...
    • Unusual tire tread wear. ...
    • Mileage.

    Do I understand the issues of this car correctly? Just making sure I’m not getting a lemon I see his ad been on craigslist for 30 days so maybe there is some issue if nobody bought it yet?... Does someone has Carfax to check please if I gave you his VIN?

    Thank you guys!
     
    #1 pri4u, Feb 12, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2023
  2. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Get the VIN, go visit a dealership and ask for the service records (or see if Welcome to Toyota Owners is working again)

    Next, pony up the fiver for the carfax, which is far less expensive than the asking price.

    Visually confirm the installed cat is OEM, then offer less because no one else is buying..
     
    #2 SFO, Feb 12, 2023
    jerrymildred likes this.
  3. pri4u

    pri4u Member

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    Am I allowed to go to a toyota dealer and ask for the service records by providing the VIN number only? Is it free? Is the Toyota Owners requires you to register? Is it free to check on their website? EDIT: I created an account on toyota owners, I added that VIN, ok I see it show service records available, thanks

    What is “pony up the fiver for the Carfax?” I’m seeing one report cost $50 and 5 reports cost $100 on CarFax? Is it a way to get it for less?

    Ok but what about the other issues I mentioned about original battery replaced 7 years ago and full front shock assembly that needs a repair according to his mechanic? You say just visually confirm the cat is OEM but also I think I need test drive the car... How much less to offer?
     
    #3 pri4u, Feb 12, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2023
  4. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Yes.
    At one time it may have cost 5, but 50 is a bit much.. if either is too much after doing the above, then try this : Run a Free VIN Check Instantly - No Credit Card Needed
    You could try something like Hybrid Assistant, and graph the HV battery while under load.

    Could also use torque/techstream, by watching the modules while under load (heavy braking or accelerating).

    If they don't have the paperwork to support the replacement, and the replacement work isn't recorded at a dealership, then it might be an old/used battery, at a minimum you would look at the outside case for signs, then go inside the pack and check the module serial #s.
    Could be normal wear and tear at that mileage, I wouldn't read into it too much, assuming it wasn't in an accident (carfax or similar - cough cough), and the car tracks straight. Not all accidents are recorded, best to visually inspect (paint, gaps, undercarriage) as well.
    Sure, test drive the car, but before that happens you need to know if there was an accident or if the odometer was rolled back.
    Cleaner CA gen2 with low miles, new cat, older HV battery replacement, and no accidents.. it could be worth it, but I'm not buying it :whistle:
     
    #4 SFO, Feb 12, 2023
  5. pri4u

    pri4u Member

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    Yes according to CarFax, "a single report costs $39.99. Of course, you might want to buy more than one CarFax report if you're currently shopping for a car. You can get three CarFax vehicle history reports for $59.99 or six for $99.99"

    Yes, they don't have the records as the seller mentions about the battery: "I believe it was replaced maybe 7 years ago by the dealer, but he moved and does not have the records." - How do I use Hybrid Assistant, and graph the HV battery while under load or torque/techstream, by watching the modules while under load (heavy braking or accelerating) - Any simple video or guide that shows how to do that? Is this all for diagnosing the HV battery?
    "you would look at the outside case for signs, then go inside the pack and check the module serial #s." - How do I do that, is it easy to access it by opening the hood? Any simple video or guide for that as well? Also what does that mean if the original battery was replaced by the dealer as he claims should it show under the service records history below? 7 years ago that would be 2016, but I only see there something about HV in 8/2013 “REPLACE THE HV ELECTRIC WATER PUMP” is that the same thing? And in general, what does that mean that the original battery had to be replaced so early, this is not typical for this car, is it?

    I checked on VINCheck doesn't say it was in accident, these are the Toyota services records:

    "10/2019
    SERVICE TYPE
    Dealer
    MILEAGE
    103,722
    SERVICES
    COMPLIMENTARY 4 WHEEL HUNTER ALIGNMENT CHECK,INSPECT TOYOTA DRIVERS FLOOR MAT,PERFORM REQUESTED MULTI-POINT INSPECTION AND REVIE W RESULTS WITH CUSTOMER.,NEXT SCHEDULED SERVICE VIST _____-_____-_____,BODY,

    View Details
    11/2018
    SERVICE TYPE
    Dealer
    MILEAGE
    98,265
    SERVICES
    NONE AT THIS TIME,REPLACED WATER PUMP W/ DRIVE BELTS,CUSTOMER DOES NOT WANT WORK DONE,CUSTOMER DOES NOT WANT WORK DONE,CUSTOMER DOES NOT WANT WORK DONE,INFLATED TIRES TO: LF_35______ RF__35_______ LR____33______ RR_____33__,PERFORM MULTI POINT INSPECTION, INCLUDES FLOOR MAT INSPECTION,REPLACED BULB,REPLACED BULB,

    View Details
    12/2013
    SERVICE TYPE
    Dealer
    MILEAGE
    61,197
    SERVICES
    REPLACED AUXILARY BATTERY,CABIN AIR (AC) FILTER - REPLACE,SERPENTINE / DRIVE BELT - REPLACE,INSTALL WIPER BLADES / INSERTS,HID HEADLIGHT BULB ASSEMBLY - REPLACE (PASSENGER SIDE),

    View Details
    8/2013
    SERVICE TYPE
    Dealer
    MILEAGE
    59,560
    SERVICES
    REC,DRIVE BELTS, ALL, R&R,INFLATED TIRES TO: LF_____32__ RF______32___ LR_____32_____ RR____32___,WASH CAR,REPLACE THE HV ELECTRIC WATER PUMP - PRIUS,C0T INSPECT BOLT HOLE AND RE PLACE BOLT ONLY - PRIUS,PERFORMED RECALL,

    View Details
    7/2008
    SERVICE TYPE
    Dealer
    MILEAGE
    9
    SERVICES
    PDI"

    Anything suspicious here? I see a big gap between 7/2008 and 8/2013 (5 years) that there were no service records - Is that normal?
    I also see some stuff here such: "WATER PUMP W/ DRIVE BELT", "REPLACE THE HV ELECTRIC WATER PUMP" and "REPLACED WATER PUMP W/ DRIVE BELTS".

    Looks like the second owner (current seller) bought it from the original private owner at 116k on 2022-01-21 and is now selling it one year later at 130k miles which seems reasonable. Car is originally from Visalia, CA which is the central valley of California and can get pretty hot during the summer.

    How can I tell if if the odometer was rolled back? Or based on the history I found on Toyota/VINCheck it seems to be ok?
    "older HV battery replacement" - How long can this battery last before going bad? How much to get another battery? I want it to last with this car until 300k, is it possible?

    You not buying it, because you're not interested in older cars or why?

    Thank you for your help!
     
    #5 pri4u, Feb 12, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2023
  6. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    That's not easy even when you start with a new one. I don't like using the word "impossible" but I think this might be one of those times when I can't really avoid it.

    A Prius can absorb a lot of miles, but they don't last terribly long in terms of time. That means you need to slam the miles on in a hurry if you want to finish with a score like 300k. This car is already 15+ years old, and unfortunately that's pretty old for a Toyota hybrid. I hate to say it, but most of the carefree time for racking up crazy miles has already passed.

    Granted, there is an appearance that some important parts have been replaced recently, and that does factor well into keeping such a car longer. I'm sure it has more to give, but don't kid yourself. It may not be that much more.

    So I still hesitate to say "impossible" but there have been plenty of people before you who spent a heck of a lot of money maintaining an old Prius just to save a little gas when it would have been cost less overall to drive a simpler car.

    Now, for this particular car:

    Regarding the catalyst- I don't know if a visual inspection would help. For one, somebody would have to lift the car and remove the cat shield. For two, your inspection doesn't really matter. It's when the CA smog inspection is due. That's the one that matters. Find out when this car last passed the smog test, and if it isn't current that is a huge huge red flag, possibly indicating a non-exempted catalyst.

    EDIT: I re-read the ad and it said "smog will be done for new owner" which is kind of a weird way to write it. CA law requires that the seller furnish the buyer with a valid smog certificate, but there's no requirement to get it at the moment of sale. Most sellers would just get it done and have it on hand... unless there's some reason the car couldn't pass smog. This seller had no problem getting a bunch of other work done, so why not that?

    I'm suspicious that somebody is trying to get rid of a problem.
     
    #6 Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, Feb 12, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2023
  7. TMR-JWAP

    TMR-JWAP Senior Member

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    I see no red flags AT ALL in that ad.
    That's a fully optioned touring model with relatively low miles.
    The suspension parts you're worried about have already been replaced, as stated in the ad.
    The cat was stolen, but replaced by insurance company and was stated to be OEM, with a shield also installed.
    Car is required to be smog checked and passed. by owner prior to sale.

    If you want it and you're good with the price, then buy it.
    Nowhere in the ad does it say that you can't have it inspected by your own mechanic.
     
    #7 TMR-JWAP, Feb 12, 2023
  8. pri4u

    pri4u Member

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    Maybe they don’t want to pay for the smog until someone actually buys it?
    What do you think about the original battery being replaced 7 years ago, is it a bad sign? And the fact that his mechanic said to replace full front shock assembly with top hats and springs, is that serious?

    He said he will let me come to inspect it too...

    But you might be making a good point, it is a little weird... Along with the other things like the battery and full front shock assembly repair he mentioned like why would mention that unless you need to explain some existing issues with the car?
     
    #8 pri4u, Feb 12, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2023
  9. pri4u

    pri4u Member

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    What do you think about the original battery being replaced 7 years ago, is it a bad sign? And the fact that his mechanic said to replace full front shock assembly with top hats and springs, is that serious? Where can I inspect it and how much will it cost? Where do you see in the ad that he already replaced the suspension?
     
    #9 pri4u, Feb 12, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2023
  10. SFO

    SFO Senior Member

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    Of course I would also recommend spending the $40 if you plan on spending the "thousands".
    There may be videos out there. Yes, this can give you an idea of the remaining capacity, including modules that are weak or sagging, and how close the module discharge curves are.
    The HV battery isn't located under the hood, it resides behind the back seat in the trunk/hatchback area. There may be a video, or you could use this link to guide you in finding the carpet cover that needs to be removed (step 4) to inspect the top of the HV battery case, which may indicate if the HV battery was replaced with a new OEM or not : 2004 – 2009 Toyota Prius Plug-and-Play Car Harness Installation Instructions - Hybrid Automotive

    If you make it up to "step 3", and the side of the case closest to the spare tire is colored, say green, orange, etc., or has markings other than an OEM sticker on it, then it is likely an aftermarket or used replacement. Even if the case looks normal, someone could've replaced some (or all) of the modules with a collection of used mismatched modules as a replacement. Of course it could just be the 15yo original OEM battery as well, and who knows if it was ever really replaced or worked on before.

    Sequential serial #s is something to look for inside the HV battery case, but you would have to go beyond "step 14", which isn't pictured.

    Maybe you can locate a video?
    First off, we might notice that the HV battery replacement isn't listed. Which doesn't mean it wasn't replaced, it just means that it wasn't done at a dealership, or under CA warranty (assuming it was initially sold in CA). If it was replaced, I would wager it wasn't a new OEM.

    Haven't seen a dealer that offers a free alignment check, but doesn't surprise me as a way to upsell. I see the pumps and belt replacement as a positive, as nothing lasts forever, and many parts will need to be replaced at some point in the future.
    Sounds like a reasonable amount of accrued mileage. HV battery heat soak is real, especially if it was parked in the sun and windows up.
    Yes. It would be hard to tell if someone put on 50k over the last year, then hacked/stuck in a combination meter with lower mileage.
    Too many variables; driving habits, storage habits, ambient temps, HV battery fan and AC usage or lack there of, etc. Will you recondition?
    Again, too many variables. DIY install, or will you use the dealership or someone else; lithium replacement, aftermarket, used, or OEM?
    Statistically I would say unlikely (given this thread) without monitoring the HV battery and balancing/reconditioning over time. There will be other repairs that come up as well, including the tires, brakes, AC, suspension, 12v battery, inverter/engine/thermos water pumps. The list goes on, it is hard to buy a used vehicle at 130k and expect it to last for another 170k without spending something on repairs, even a prius.
    This is your potential purchase, I'm only offering my limited help in a virtual world.
    Still trying over here.

    What are some of the intended usage patterns for this vehicle, commuter, gig vehicle, annual mileage, etc?[/QUOTE]
     
    #10 SFO, Feb 12, 2023
  11. Leadfoot J. McCoalroller

    Leadfoot J. McCoalroller Senior Member

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    If the HV battery was replaced 7 years ago, that is probably good. The things that make a battery go bad prematurely are usually within it, so replacing one resets the clock. These batteries seem to be good for 15ish years, so buying a car with one only half used up is a good thing.

    ...that assumes it was replaced with a good battery. There are good and bad ones available. I'd want to see the receipt.

    But the smog thing bugs me- if they get the certificate it's good for two years. No buyer is going to quibble if it is only good for 23 months... not really wasting anything doing it in advance.

    So I really think they need to get that smog cert done before you pay.
     
    #11 Leadfoot J. McCoalroller, Feb 12, 2023
  12. pri4u

    pri4u Member

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    I met the car/person car drives ok he showed me the receipt for the new cat.

    There is some odor inside the car which might be related to his dog, not sure how easy it is to get rid of it.
    I drove it on the fwy and on the street, noticed that in consumption the bar never shows more than 50 mpg:

    9C13DA58-8B23-4582-8223-586FC107C187.jpeg

    I remember with my previous prius it the yellow bar was reaching 75 at times, but not sure if this is right.
    We said I’ll next take to an inspection next but I’ll need to think about this and whatever I rather get something better and newer.
     
    #12 pri4u, Feb 12, 2023
  13. rogerthat

    rogerthat Active Member

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    You may want to search the forum for Prius odor - there is an infamous odor issue related to the battery vent tubes. The smell has been described as urine/hospital like! It's nauseating and forced me to replace my battery vent tubes.

    Personally, I wouldn't want to own a Prius if I lived in California - high probability your CAT will be stolen.
     
    #13 rogerthat, Feb 12, 2023
    Last edited: Feb 12, 2023
  14. ColoradoCrow

    ColoradoCrow Active Member

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    Did you end up buying this car?
     
    #14 ColoradoCrow, Apr 13, 2023
  15. pri4u

    pri4u Member

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    Nope
     
    #15 pri4u, Apr 13, 2023
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