What fuel economy can I expect?

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SodaGuy @ Nov 18 2006, 09:56 PM) [snapback]351560[/snapback]</div>

Hey Soda Guy,

We used to live in Sacramento and we maintain homes in Elk Grove (Sacramento suburb), so we go at least once/quarter, as well as visit family and vacation in Sacramento Old Town/Mid Town.

Efusco is right on target! Checking my spreadsheet there were multiple day trips to Elk Grove where i refilled in Elk Grove, and mileage was 42-44 easily. All of those trips were drive 1-2 miles stop for an hour, drive again. Elk Grove streets are pretty typical of Sacramento (Although not Fair Oaks or Carmichael).

Compare that to our SF 1-2 mile stop for an hour, drive again which yielded about 36 mpg average this past September about 55 F average over three tanks. The only way for me to see 40 under this type of drivng is to get out of town, LOL.

Hence, again Efusco's 45 mpg for Sacramento is in the ballpark from my personal real world experience. In the summer and spring you should easily be approaching 50 mpg.

 

Your mileage will improve some after about a 2000 mi brake-in period so don’t get disappointed at first. Also, like most drivers you have to learn how to drive it for the best mileage. Don’t gun it at red lights and don’t drive like an old person either, as both will kill you mileage. Set you tires for the max safe presure and soon you will get the hang of it.

 

AND, if you get that HCH thingy...you will have to go over to "that other board". We would all miss you!!!!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(SodaGuy @ Nov 19 2006, 03:48 PM) [snapback]351775[/snapback]</div>

I'd have to agree with Efusco here SodaGuy, your really conservative with 38 mpg. I know the Pocket area and Land Park very well, you could drive in your sleep and get 45 mpg! I go to your Home Depot all the time, less crowded than Elk Grove.

Yep, SF is not just hilly but we don't have the opportunity to have space to pulse and glide, but our biggest problem is that as a family we are bright green, using Muni transportation as much as possible, it isn't unusual to go a whole tank on just 2 mile trips to Safeway, OUCH, impressively greenish but ouch. It's not unusual to get to Safeway and not even register a 5 minute bar! Ouch again!

 

I've got a 2004 with only 12,500 miles... I'm not a big driver.. to the store and other short trips... my last four tanks have been over 52 mpg.. but it has taken the mileage to break into that.. I have never gotten worse than 47mpg from day one.. I live in the Denver area and it does get cold here.. cold I have found does bring the MPG down.. the Honda owners around here that I have talked to are only getting about 40 mpg..

I do notice the media has to report that the Prius only gets about 40 mpg.. they did a stort on the 'Smart' the other night saying that it scored a very bad grade.. although it only got 40 mpg.. it lacked the room of a Prius which got about the same mileage.. grrrrrr ... prompted an e-mail to the news guy..

 

I bought an 06 in August. My first 3 tankfulls I averaged 48 MPG. Now, with winter fuel, I'm averaging just over 40 MPG. Kind of disappointing but my wife who has an 05 gets slightly better mileage. She gets just about 52 in summer and 45 in winter but she has a different commute then I. She drives from Walnut Creek to Hayward each day as a grammer school principal. I commute from Walnut Creek to Cal Berkeley each day and I use Fish Ranch Road to avoid the tube but that means a 1700 ft climb up and over the Berkeley hills twice a day, so I average slightly less mileage then she.
I would also agree With efusco and others here. In Sac. you should see, after some miles are on the car, at least 45 in summer and 40+ in winter. I'd like to comment on another topic that is related to this thread. It would seem that we Californians get slightly less mileage then others on this site that live elsewhere. I can only conclude that our gas has more additives that reduce fuel economy for cleaner air or, and I think this unlikely, we as a group are not as good at saving gas as others here.

-Paul R. Haller-

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Paul R. Haller @ Nov 20 2006, 02:46 AM) [snapback]352000[/snapback]</div>

Interesting theory Paul! However, I have driven in Atlanta, Clinton, New Jersey and Chicago and have noticed similar traffic patterns everywhere, although the only place that even comes close to the Berkeley/Bay Bridge/San Francisco corridor is New York City!

However Two, my best mileage ever was 2004 Memorial Day Weekend, a round trip from SF to Sacramento one tank 67 mpg and that was at 7704 miles on the odometer. Here's some other bests:
• 54 mpg, 313 miles one tank, in and around Elk Grove 5/30-6/14/04, 9063 miles on the odo
• 45 mpg, 1449 miles on 5 tanks, SF to San Diego and back, 8/18-8/30/04, 12,452 miles on the odo
• 51 mpg, 294 miles on one tank, SF to Santa Rosa to Chabot Science Center back to SF, 8/15-8/16/06, 33,376 miles on the odo

All of these bests are routine for us with regards to vacation driving, but I think they can easily be duplicated for commute driving especially the 67 mpg run on Highway 80, my knee aches just thinking about that horrible commute back to SF.

I think the real issue is the Californians that live in rolling hills in the bay area with commutes under 5 miles. The LA folks seem to always talk abot 50mpg+, eh? I think my numbers prove I can hang with the high-milers, it's just I can't make the mileage thing work on my everyday real life trips to Safeway, LOL.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Nov 19 2006, 12:51 PM) [snapback]351776[/snapback]</div>

My lifetime average is 45.7 mpg after over 12K miles. If I go by a lifetime average of the MFD readings, it's 46.5 mpg. My drive is briefly described at http://www.priusonline.com/viewtopic.php?p...ighlight=#83916. I don't think given the OP's patterns he'd get even that. I'm guessing maybe mid to high 30s for a Prius and at least a few mpg less for the HCH.

I definitely would NOT give them both the same predicted mileage.

Here are the top 11 vehicles in terms of mileage in Consumer Reports' tests:
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars/bu...s-206/index.htm

You can see the Prius, HCH and Civic w/manual listed. When CR tested the currenet gen Civic w/an automatic, they got 28 overall, 18 city, 43 highway.

You can read about CR's test procedusre at http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/cars/ne...tests/index.htm but you need to have a subscription to their online service to see it.

 

Problem 1.
I find that at speeds less than about 60 kph I can keep the car in the glide condition (no arrows on the energy display) for pulse and glide but above this speed it becomes very difficult if not impossible to achieve this glide condition.
I would like to see a modification that if travelling above the EV cut out speed and the EV button is selected the car goes into glide mode whenever no ICE or electric power is required to drive the vehicle. This state would equate to a pulse and automatic glide. Once the car's speed drops below the EV cut out speed the normal electric braking would be reinstated.
I believe better fuel consumption can be had because the kinetic energy available is used directly to propel the car rather than being temporary store in the battery and then reclaim later as electrical drive. If the state of the battery was such that recharging was necessary, then the system currently in vogue would prevail until a satisfactory charge had been achieved at which time the automatic glide would be reinstated.

Problem 2.
Another limitation I see is in cruise control. When going down hill the current cruise control system allows the car's speed to exceed the set speed. This is no problem unless that increased speed is above the speed limit set by the authorities.
I would like to see the Prius modified so that a second selection on the cruise control lever would limit the speed to that set and any additional speed is prevented by increased electric braking to charge the battery.
Although this mode of drive may decrease fuel economy it would allow cruise control to be used without the fear of getting a ticket for speeding because it would hold the selected speed.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Tideland Prius @ Nov 26 2006, 12:57 PM) [snapback]354201[/snapback]</div>

Your second point raises another question. Why do journeys over the same roads have differing fuel consumption figures?
I recently met my first driver of a Prius while checking into a motel. Subsequent discussion revealed that he often drives a route and logs greatly differing fuel economy figures. He even stated that he used cruise control set to the same speed. The only differing elements would be traffic (not relevant said he), wind and temperature. However, the different results were such that wind and temp could not have had such an effect.
On my 2500 km journey where I met this driver I found that travelling on a freeway that had sections of single and dual lanes my fuel economy figures varied in an unexpected way. On the single lane parts the fuel consumption 5-minute bars had about 2/3 above the 5 L/100km line. On the dual lane sections 2/3 were below the 5 L/100km line. Here is where the story gets hard to understand. On the single lane sections I set the cruise control at 100 kph (the speed limit) on the dual sections I increased the cruise control to 105 kph (the speed limit was 110 kph). Seeing my trip was over 2000 km of freeway and the same winds and temperatures seemed to prevail over the entire time I noted the fuel consumption differences I was surprised that the higher speed gave me better fuel consumption readings.
I then ventured onto a major country road where the speed limit was mostly 100 kph. I intentionally reduced speed to 80 kph, which allowed me to use cruise control without having to slow down for bends etc., and found my fuel consumption figures were about the same as those of travelling 100 kph.
Why does the Prius behave in this manner? It seemed to be most inconsistant and not logical.