Toyota's own plug-in Prius pictured!

Damn... you really can't tell what the picture shows in that, unfortunately. I *think* they may be sacrificing some trunk space for the batteries, but it's really difficult to tell with the video so grainy.

 

Dang! I've always compared destruction of the Ev1 and other anti battery philosophys of the auto industry as being like the smoking lobby . . . sure sounded weird hearing out of the mouth of the auto industry.

 

He didn't show the whole car right? He's just showing what the trunk will look like for the current Prius if they add extra battery for plug-in.

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Nov 7 2006, 12:48 PM) [snapback]345068[/snapback]</div>

Evan, maybe you can submit this suggestion to Toyota and see if they actually implement it.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Nov 7 2006, 11:48 AM) [snapback]345068[/snapback]</div>

Probably, at this stage of development, they are just working with modifying stock Prius. Ease of access and not truck space is the major consideration at this point. Practical refinements will come later in the development cycle.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Nov 7 2006, 10:48 AM) [snapback]345068[/snapback]</div>

As far as I can tell their still comparing inputs to outputs. It takes ~41 kWh of energy to produce a gallon of petrol. Where did that energy come from? If it comes from a coal fired plant the numbers that they've thrown around are worthless. Did I miss something in their discussion? They never seemed to include the energy inputs to produce the petrol.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(tripp @ Nov 7 2006, 11:21 AM) [snapback]345151[/snapback]</div>

'Zactly!

 

Quote Evan: "Too bad they can't go to those new fangled airless tires, eliminate the spare and use that space." Good thought, Evan!!

ANY mechanical device, even the 'airless tires,' is subject to mechanical problems. Suppose, for example, you had to drive through some mud and it collected within the 'spokes' of the airless tire... what an out of balance problem that would be! I suppose that could be prevented by adding some sort of 'sidewalls,' though. Perhaps they could produce an "inflatable" spare good for 50 miles... I suppose I'm 'old school' and would be very uncomfortable without some kind of spare tire. OTOH, I have a "spare tire" around my waist. :lol: :lol:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(efusco @ Nov 7 2006, 12:48 PM) [snapback]345068[/snapback]</div>

vans that have fold-under-the-floor seats come with run-flats because there's no room underneath for a spare... but man are those things a $#*(& PITA to replace.

 

You can see the full presentation here

http://www.aspo-usa.com/fall2006/presentat...Boston_2006.pdf

 

This is a fascinating presentation from a Toyota engineer/industry specialist with many new pieces of information. Here are some key points from his presentation on the video:

1) Model cycle is 2008 for the Prius (so updated Prius is next year?)
2) Presenter asks us to 'do the math' that indicates this next generation Prius design goal = City at 75mpg and hiway at 64mpg (plus provide additional power)
3) That the current hybrid price premium is $2,000 (based on the Camry)
4) Lithium-ion issues are: recycling; and survivability (because of wide charge swings)
5) Toyota engineers get a 'carbon budget' for CO2 pollution - for lifecycle of all materials used in the car
(one would presume this would include the fuel)
6) Toyota believes future electric generation capacity is going to have higher pollution than present capacity
(with the implication due to Toyota 'carbon budget' engineering criteria - Toyota would not favor electric 'plug-in' option when considering total lifecycle of the vehicle - in terms of CO2)
7) There will be 1 billion more cars on the planet soon contributing a lot of pollution
(implication is that people will engineer solutions other than cars for transportation)

Based on this my suggestion to Toyota (and other manufacturers) on point #5 & #6 is this:

Package the (plug-in) hybrids for sale with 'wind power' certificates for the wind power premium for the first 100,000 miles of the vehicle - a value of $320 (included in the vehicle sales price). The plug-in car now runs on wind power. Here is the calculation:

Given: 80 cents for a gallon equivalent of electricity and a gallon goes about 50 miles on the Prius
(so the Prius uses about 2,000 gallons in 100,000 miles)
Given: wind power certificate is equal to about 20% higher charge for electricity (today)
(so 20% of 80 cents per gallon equivalent is the cost of non polluting wind power or 16 cents)
Calculation: 2000*16(cents) = $320.00 (total) for wind power premium for first 100,000 miles

So, the public has no choice - they get the 'wind power' certificates 'for free'. Toyota gets a car that causes zero green house gasses (needs to be a plug-in for this to work) and zero NOX etc. (achieves design goals).

Market as 'let the wind carry you', 'run with the wind', 'with the wind at your back' and 'the first non-polluting car' etc. Also, work out joint marketing agreements with large electric energy companies that will advertise the cars to their customers (with special additional incentives etc. if you buy the car and charge at night)

Separately, can someone post the video from this same conference for the presentation from Andy Frank (on Lithium Ion batteries)?

Best regards,

Eric