Inverter: How much power? and how?

Okay, so you are NOT running them in parallel, but set up as separate.
So the original battery in not involved in the fridge, etc., but, after the car is running, it will charge up
the 2nd battery. But what about the original battery? The inverter charges slowly. Do you also have a
solar charger hooked up?

 

Not sure which post you're (not) quoting, but you might want to look at #26 above, which gives three stages of things that can happen under different levels of overload (and also says the converter "isn't very likely to be fried"). You might be looking for more explanation after that, but there would be the place to start.

It could be that you've discovered a difference between the PiP converter and the earlier versions PriusChat members have tested in the past. To be sure of that, though, it would be helpful if you had current-clamp measurements from a few different places, and also the state of the converter's IDH output, under different levels of load.

 

A battery isolator charges two batteries in parallel by closing a relay while the car is charging, which is anytime the voltage is higher than the off state battery voltage. The isolators are commonly used on rv dual battery setups and prevent the "starting battery" from excessive discharge when the charging system is off. With a Prius system constantly charging in Ready, the batteries will remain in parallel unless the 12v drops excessively. The real isolator benefit is when the car is actually off, then the extra battery is running the load by itself. In Ready you have more amp hours through parallel batteries.

 

The Prius inverter only puts out a certain amount of amperage, right? So if your 2nd battery is low
because it's been running all night, will it get more amps to charge it?
I know on most no hybrid systems the alternator puts out 90 or more amps, but the Prius inverter doesn't.
Right?

 

The Prius DC/DC converter has a 125 amp fuse at its output (and serves some other circuits in the car that branch ahead of that fuse, too). There's a limit to its capacity, of course, but it's stouter than some gasser's 90 amp alternator.

 

People have measured 12v charge currents upwards of 70 amps on a Prius. It will quickly taper off as the 12v battery gains charge. The vehicle requires 12v to operate, sometimes large quantities if loads like water pumps, radiator fans, power steering and electric heat are being called. No doubt the inverter can output well over 125 amps for short times.

 

Interesting... Pretty much everyone says NOT to charge the battery with a charger over 4 amps.
Or 4.5..... And that the inverter charges the battery in the car very slowly. Low amperage over
long time is better for the battery. And the battery is only going to take what it needs.
So you need to drive, or leave the car on for several hours before it fully charges the battery.
So if you put 70 amps into it, it would seem to damage the battery... Unless it's only for a few seconds
until the system determines it doesn't need that much.

That system you have see the weaker battery needs more charge and give it more, and the other one less?

 

First the 4.5amp thing is a warning against putting an old school trickle charger on the agm and forgetting about it. Particularly bad if Dad's old 50/10/2 amp charger was left on 50 or 10.

If you have two parallel batteries they should be the same type and ideally the same size. Perhaps the vehicle is off, the battery isolator has them separate and the extra battery is run down to 9 volts. The "starting" battery is 12.5 v.

Connecting them in parallel is the same thing as jump starting. Assuming no charging is occurring the two batteries quickly equalize in voltage with the higher voltage battery dumping massive amps to the lower charge battery. This is constrained only by the interconnecting cables, internal battery resistance and terminations. A very high current draw can easily go on for ten or more minutes with lower currents well over 10 amps for long periods. Typically a well designed battery isolator prevents this by not allowing parallel operation without a vehicle's charging system. However there are bypasses available to get people into or out of trouble.

Once the vehicle is started, the vehicle raises the charging voltage above either batteries voltage, typically 14.8 volts to begin. This causes current to flow from the vehicle's charging mechanism to the batteries.

If they are significantly discharged, it will be very high current. Both batteries charge at the same voltage however the amps into each may be different.

At some point the battery voltages rise close to nominal and full gorilla charging quickly tapers down. The inverter's water cooled dc to dc breathes a sigh of relief but it still carries the vehicle's "12v" load including a float voltage of around 13.4 to the batteries. Which is low current for as long as the vehicle is on.

So is adding a 1000 watt 85 amp inverter a good idea on a Prius? Not really. The inverter's dc to dc is carrying the load anytime the car is in Ready, increasing thermal and power stresses on that expensive part. Offline use of the secondary battery will take life off of it over time, however agm and other high discharge chemistries are designed for that kind of application. Finally the factory agm will last seven or eight years when used as designed, eg as a standby low current demand float battery.

 

Those things are all true about the charging system in Gen 1 and Gen 2, where the DC/DC output voltage is limited to about 13.8. I measured a Gen 2 recharging a severely empty battery and it never went over 8 amps, and dropped fairly soon to below 5.

If you have a Gen 3 (this is the Gen 3 forum), you'll have noticed that the DC/DC output voltage is sometimes as high as 14.7. That extra volt makes a huge difference in current into the battery, leading to the charging currents AHetaFan measured.

But another thing that changed in Gen 3 is there is a temperature sensor over the aux battery. Gen 1 and 2 didn't have that.

This is one of those areas where it matters to keep the differences between generations straight.

 

I just take it for granted NOT(assUME) since this is the 3rd Generation chat room, that people talk about
the 3rd generation.

 

Then you should have been totally unsurprised by talk of 70 amp charging currents.

 

Engineering is more of a sure thing with plenty of divergent opportunities. The more you know the more you know you don't know. Which makes you more effective.

 

Hello Group, I am thinking of buying a Bluetti AC300/B300 and connecting it to my Prius 2015 for continuous operation (until gas runs out). What do you guys think?

I am thinking about using this transform. Only problem is input is 220v ac and Prius traction battery is 201v dc and output is 48v dc:
“DC 48V 40A 2000W Transformer 48 Volt 40 Amp 2000 Watt 48Vdc Switch Power Supply (220v ac input, output 48v dc - from eBay)” - this transformer will take the 201v dc from the Prius 2015 Traction battery and convert it to 48v. Then the 48v will be connected to a 48v 2000w pure sine inverter which will convert 48v to 110v. I would then connect the AC300/B300 110 power cord to the inverter 3-prong 110v plug.

The Prius above system will charge the Bluetti AC300/B300 with its 201v Traction battery that is charged by the Prius gas system that will automatically turn on/off to charge the Traction battery continuously, until it runs out of gas. I assume the Bluetti built in charge controller will control the charging plugged into the Inverter.

Will this work? The purpose of this setup is to keep the Bluetti AC300/B300 charged while it is being used to run my appliances, until the Prius runs out of gas (which will run on and off while charging the traction battery).

Please let me know? I want to do this setup to ensure continuous operation, since solar panels are only good during the day. This needs to run at night. Also, thinking of using/finding an inverter that has an input of 201-250v to 110v. I think Alibaba has converters 100-300v input and 48v output.

Thank you all for your help.

 

No.

The gadget you found is pretty cool, but it is still an inverter with a 48v DC side and a 120/240v AC side. Your car can do 12v DC easily, and 201v DC with a little extra work. Both of those are difficult to convert to 48v DC at a meaningful rate. Yes, you can get converters but it is difficult and expensive to get ones big enough to properly work in this application.

An inverter with a high voltage DC input is the very best way to power large & medium appliances continuously with a Prius. The modified AIMS units and plugoutpower setups seem to work great.

 

Leadfoot, thank you for your reply. Yes, I was considering the plugout, but the entire setup is too bulky and the price is around $2500, too pricey. The plugout looks like a transformer for a 220v setup, I do not need and the other box looks like a high voltage hybrid inverter with maybe an input voltage rating of 200-300v, which I can not find (pure sine wave). Do you know of a specific AIMS pure sine wave inverter that has a voltage input around 200-240v and output of 110v? I saw a couple in Alibaba, but I would rather buy one in the US. Any product recommendations would be appreciated. Thank you.

 

NOTE: The pure sine inverter link above is broken and goes to Walmart - it no longer exits, so if some one has a product recommendation plz respond here. Thank you.

 

BINGO: Through my tedious research I found this “
2000W 220VDC to 110V/220VAC Off Grid Pure Sine Wave Inverter”. Now! Can anyone tell me why I cannot hook this up to my Prius 2015 Traction battery directly and get 110v to my Bluetti AC300/B300 setup. Please respond. Thank you.

If you want I will send you the specs. This is DC to DC.

 

Sorry, this is 220v DC to 110 AC.