Excessive oil consumption?

the same filter for 15k miles... ouch

I would be curious to find out hope many people that had engine failures admitted to only changing the oil once a year or every 15-20,000 miles

 

Only the BG 109 (I think it's called) which I bought and shelved before I started seeing the hybrid version. (Price on Amazon has doubled since then.) I already use Techron before oil changes ever since finding carbon buildup on two cylinders in my 2010 when changing plugs at about 130K miles. That car had Costco gas for ~90% of fill-ups, usually Shell the rest. (ISTR that Costco was not "Top Tier" when we got the 2010, but I know it had been Top Tier for several years before that 130K point.)

My impression from reports on PC is that the 109 cleaner has helped some folks and others not. And one poster said his consumption went down for a while and then came back. I think you're right to be cautious -- most of these products are snake oil.

 

My bet is that short tripped cars suffer more ill effects overall then just long intervals...

My wear rates are below average for oils that have been run shorter intervals.

15k of short trips in a year vs 15k every few months are two very different animals.

 

I would think the earlier one addresses consumption and tries the BG treatment the more likely they are to see better results.

As soon as I notice my car starts to consume oil I'm going to try it. I don't really see anything to lose other then the purchase price.

 

Guess I worry that a solvent that can do good to the rings in under 30 minutes could do bad to the rubber seals. But once I found myself buying single quarts of oil at the gas station convenience mart I got over that fear...

 

You may be referring to my posts about the oil consumption coming back. My current theory is that the BG products cleaned up the cylinders and rings but that the cylinders were already scorched and the rings wore down moreso after the fact. I believe this b/c my car burns oil the most when I've driven around hilly areas so there's much more use of the engine at higher RPMs. If I'm not driving around hills much it hardly burns at all so that's an important factor to consider. Also, I bought my car used at around 144k miles and it's currently around 166k. If I had a time machine and bought a 2010 new or close to new, I'd bet that if I'd started regularly using the BG treatment at around 75k miles then the car would be consuming much less oil.

 

I think based on a "WAG," that your current "issues," are based on the mileage at which you got the car? The damage was already done?

The start/stop feature and short daily drives and the fact that most "Prius," owner's feel the gas pedal, is a rattle snake, is hard on oil. The oil just never get's hot enough to work effectively? But

Except perhaps in NV? On the Hwy from Carson City to Reno the speed limit is 70 mph. And the "Prii," out here fly down that Hwy! In the gen 2, you can get 40 mpg at 70 or 80 mph? So WTH, in NV, the Prius is not the car that backs up traffic.

But the Gen 3's, yeah the EGR system is an issue? I feel it should be addressed before 100'000 miles? But at the time no one knew? And yes you can address it after the fact but the damage has already been done? If the cylinder wall's are scored, your screwed. ;(

 

So you're telling me using a high mileage 25,000 mi synthetic oil filter, engine oil with ZDDP 1,200 parts per million and oil sample analysis sent to blackstone oil labs with feedback of "Your toyota put up some very impressive wear numbers, your metal numbers are quite low for a longer run pointing to normal wear...nice engine" with 15,000 OCI is ouch? If my engine is deteriorating faster because of my OCI then explain how am I yielding the current MPG tank and trip below?

 

That is what I implied, yes. Initially my oil consumption did noticeably go away after running cleaners through the engine, so I think now instead of burning a lot of oil all the time it's burning mostly when the RPMs get high. I'm also judging this based on the car's Toyota history, the recorded oil changes weren't very consistent and at some point they changed to 5W-30. I can only assume that was the point when oil burning was noticeable.

 

Yeah most likely you got screwed, but at the time no one knew what the deal was? The Gen 3's do have a lot of advances over the Gen 2's but longevity does not seem to be one of them? But whatever, what is done is done. Now you can use a "Borescope," to look at the cylinder wall's and see if they are scored? If they are? Just keep lot's of oil in the hatch and check it frequently or replace rebuild the engine? I'm a rebuild guy myself, my local machine shop knows me by first name. But a low mileage JDM import engine is not that expensive?

And you have to weight the cost of another motor with the cost of replacing the car? And what you get to replace it?

 

Appears like your Prius is very healthy and efficient. I don't know much about zddp, but yours is higher miles and proof that oil burning can be prevented. What do you run as far as oil/filter? How was your EGR circuit?

 

When you average 35mph, certainly the mpg's will be higher.

 

yes, I'm saying that a LOT of things can happen to oil in 25,000 miles... like start burning, start losing (leaks), lose viscosity, etc, and I don't want to risk an engine over a $25 oil change.. and generally I don't trust ice to run that long on an oil change. I'm just beginning to trust them for 5k mile change intervals, but it's still bothering me to do so.

edit....
I saw the picture of your odometer (similar to mine) and mpg (wow!) when I got onto wifi... those are impressive numbers. I have no idea how you managed 67 mpg, but that's very impressive. the best I've seen from our 3rd generation was 60 mpg, during some easy 35-55mph mountain driving using non ethanol fuel.

I am very interested in a few more pieces of into, since your odometer is very similar to mine ( 175k ish).... like: how long have you owned yours, and what kind of driving does it normally see ? (hilly/flat/mountainous/city/etc)

one other thing, I noticed your mpg for the trip was very high, but the trip was very short at only 49 miles. there best I've seen was also a shorter trip if about 50 miles at 35 mph average with 60mpg for the trip. that's interesting, a lot of numbers are similar between our vehicles.

I've only owned mine for two months, and am curious about running a lab test on your last oil change. would you mind posting a picture of your results, and I'll do the same from my next 5k mile oil change ?

thanks !

 

I thought my Prius would never burn oil. I've used amsoil, all the quality oils and filters.. It didn't matter, starting sipping once I've reached the 100k miles. Now I have to change every 5-6k miles and still have to add a little bit of oil. Used to be up to 15k intervals or once a year without any changes on the dipstick.

Of course I could look into EGR cleaning, catch can, other things. Problem is- no time for that.

The other thing is- we have the 2009 Prius as well that is my daily commute car and it barely burns any oil and have even more miles than my wifes 2012 Prius. I haven't tried any newer Prius, but always though the second gen was the most robust Prius ever made.

 

this is why I don't like long oil change intervals... the oil has more and more carbon , which is abrasive to bearings/rings/cylinder walls/etc ... I really don't want that abrasive slurry being circulated

 

That's why there is an oil filter, to catch all that.
All all engines wear, that is normal. Some faster than others.
Oil does brake down over time. It's not designed to last forever.
That's why you change. It is still "best" to change it when the manufacturer says to change it.
Which usually is before the brakes down to the point of not doing it's job and damaging the engine.

I haven't seen where any car manufacturer say 15,000 mile internvals. Oil companies do, because they
want you to buy from them.

But it is YOUR engine! Tempt fate if you wish...

 

It's a shame that its a weak point on our cars as they age. Of the opinions on what causes it, so many point to the design issue of the piston/ rings and the rings sticking. If you subscribe to this theory, it seems like some things can slow its progression. While I'm in the shorter OCI camp, others have proven me wrong with their success with longer OCI. So it may have more to do with the type of driving, perhaps short trip heating/cooling cycle leading to more build up. I've kind of thrown the kitchen sink of approaches at mine, with the idea of keeping the whole ICE/combustion chamber system as clean as possible so rings don't stick.

Cleaning out that EGR system seems to be pretty essential to getting more life out of the Gen 3's so you may want to make time for it at some point. My son replaces failed gen 2 and 3 Prius engines regularly at a Phx area dealership and all the gen 3's failures seem to have clogged EGR coolers in common.

Homelite 308311014 Pressure Washer Replacement Turbo Nozzle helped me clean the EGR cooler

1/4 E-8 socket from NAPA model "S14E8" was the only special tool I had to add to my basic tool kit.

 

Head gaskets and engine replacements take even more time...

 

A stitch in time…

 

I just turned 237,000 on my 2010. I've put 120,000 miles on it.
Mostly highway.
Cleaned the EGR twice, with a spare cooler.
Engine coolant is right at the full line or just below, all the time.