The case for knobs over touch screens.

I use "AUTO" climate function almost exclusively. My car is set on 70F AUTO ECO S-FLOW and I just turn on and off the climate control. For most times in warmer months (May to Sep), it is OFF. For most times in colder months (Oct to Apr), it is ON. I don't usually play with fan speed or other settings.

FYI, for a PRIME with a large screen meaning Premium and Advanced (not sure how it works for Plus or other PRIUS and earlier models), you can "Turn ON" the climate control by hitting the fan switch. Although there is no dedicated "ON" switch, you do not have to hit "AUTO" to turn it on, if you do not intend to use "AUTO" function. (However, there is dedicated "OFF" switch only on the large screen.) I just checked this function on the MID using only the steering wheel switch, and it also work to "Turn ON" the AC with fan speed control, though you can not "Turn OFF" the AC using only the steering wheel switch.

 

Our previous Civic Hybrid at least had "Easter Egg", hitting fan speed up button would turn system back on, with settings as they were. It was undocumented, as far as I know.

It's funny, with a few manual controlled knobs/sliders, everything stays right where you left it. With new-and-improved systems, it typically returns everything to pre-ordained defaults, and/or "takes over", resets it to auto-mode.

Some designers in their wisdom decided this is what is best, and memory is short, so buyers go along with it.

 

Different people also have different ways they like to interact with technology. This thread shows some of our preferences. Auto manufacturers should surely realize this. It is interesting that some manufacturers force the way an individual must interact with their technology onto the customer. I think the better choice are the manufacturers who give customers the choice of how they interact with redundant controls - smart screens coupled with knobs and voice recognition. Then the customer gets to choose the way they interact.

 

Yes, but that pretty much doubles the cost of production and the whole point of touch screen interfaces is to cut costs. Knobs and buttons are expensive (the good quality ones used in the automotive applications), touch screen is cheap. This is how Tesla manged to cut many corners on M3. They spin it as "cool" and "now", but the emperor really has NO clothes.

 

I agree it can be more expensive. This is where innovation and kaizen (process improvement) can take place. Putting the customer first and meeting the customers demands are how you can have satisfied return customers who are having their needs met.

It would be fascinating to know if there actually is a cost up and how much that cost up is. I don't think it would be that much on mass produced vehicles that manufactures could negotiate bulk price cost of radios or climate controls across their entire product line. .

I wonder for long term success which variable is more important for manufacturers - profit margin or smaller profit margin + satisfied customers.

Again, you are right it is certainly cheaper and easier to not include redundant controls but at what price and how does it affect your customer base satisfaction?

 

That is pretty much how a felt about my gen2 Prius(I even had that Matrix).

Learned to accept the use on the Auto function, and even letting the A/C run when I wouldn't want it, when I realized that it is what cooled the battery, and kept it operating efficiently.

 

I really enjoy driving with windows down, so AC mostly needs to be off for me. I live in the countryside and driving with windows open is much more enjoyable than in a closed cage with AC. Just me, I do the same in my house. I have central AC, but only turn it on when things get super-hot, otherwise open windows, birdsong and fresh air. I guess I am old school like that.

 

Haven't trotted this one (late model Honda Fit, all but top level) out in a while: most controls are detented knobs, large, tactile. There's one slider in the middle for fresh/recirc, and a couple of easy-to-find-without-looking buttons, for AC and the rear defog. You cannot get lost with this.

@The Electric Me mentioned he had a touchscreen on his late model Fit, but they went back to knobs, due to demand. As far as I know, this is the setup on all but the top level, which gets "upgraded" to touch screen:

 

Yes, it does not have to be complicated to wrok well. In fact, the simpler the better. One thing that was better on my 20th century Euro-designed car was the mode control was laid out corresponding to actual items. Floor was 6 o'clock, windshield was 12 o'clock dash was at 9 o'clock and everything in between was positioned as expected. It was very intuitive for tactile control. But those are details, the principal was big tactile detented knobs and buttons.

 

In a nutshell, if you can easily operate the controls with your eyes shut, that'd be optimum. Maybe designers should consider that.

 

Yes, eyes closed when operating important functions in the car and eyes wide open when designing the exterior! They got those two in reverse, I think for later gen Prii.

 

Yes, those dial controls are consistent with mine.
I should be more clear, the absence of dials or knobs on my 2016, is referring to the infotainment portion of the vehicle. Basically no radio knobs or dials. And like I said, this wasn't met with a lot of popularity. I believe Honda returned them the next year, and I think they still exist.

I'm not anti-dial or knob. In fact, I really liked my 2010 Honda Fit, because it had borderline ridiculously over-sized knobs and dials.
The tactile, psychical grab and press or turn, button or dial WORKS.
Even though the touch screen volume controls work on my Honda Fit, I would admit touching the screen then tapping the graph to lower or raise the volume is NOT as convenient or easy as simply turning a dial.

On topic/Off topic, I wonder how much of this is generational and just part of evolution. I'm old enough to remember rotary phones, push button phones, and a time when "Touch Screen" meant Mom had to clean the fingerprints off the TV.

Today's Generations are much more comfortable with interacting with a pure touch screen. I think they expect it.

 

I think certain things are objective. Physical controls are objectively easier and more user friendly (given they are designed well) than touch screen controlls (no matter how well those are designed). It's just fact. Sure younger generation is more comfortable with touch screens, but that does not mean it's better. In the 80's (which I also remember well with the rotary dial phones) smoking was widely accepted, but that does not mean smoking is not a bad, BAD thing!

 

Younger generation is more accepting, cus that's all they've ever known?

I peeked at a Tesla interior the other day, looks like a largish laptop growing out of the dash. I'll pass...

 

It's a fine line.
And I think more subjective than objective. I think it's endlessly debatable.

Knobs and Dials have worked for as long as mankind has created any technology or tool that needed a knob or dial. So yes...WORKS.
Touch Screen interface is much newer. But those born with it...only know an existence with it.

If I was betting on trends?
I'm betting on more and more touch screen interface.
But I'm also betting the traditional knob and dial isn't going anywhere very soon either.

But who knows what the future really holds?
It may be someday not so far in the future, today's generation is debating the benefits of Touch Screen over Voice Command.

 

Yes, it is all they are use too, but we are teaching them, and others, that using a phone for anything while driving is dangerous while driving. So what do car designers do, move controls to a fixed tablet in the car.

Touch screen control can be done right, but even done right, it need some other operator input methods to support it.

I'd adapt for a Tesla. By my understanding, their interface is like setting up a home theater. You have take some time to set up the picture and sound settings, but once you do, you just have to turn the thing on to watch the news. Same with the Tesla. Once you got the drive mode, climate control, wipers, etc. set to your preference, your required interaction with the touch screen is small, with most of rest covered by controls and stalks on the steering wheel. So once set, driving is as easy as turning on the TV.

It is an example of doing touch screen right in a car. The con for a Model 3 for me is not having paddle shifters for controlling regen levels.

 

Doing touch screen "right" in the car means you do not need to use it. I agree with that. And yes, we keep repeating: DO NOT TEXT AND DRIVE! It really is very dangerous. But looking for musing on a touch screen in the car or tuning on windshield wipers two layers into a menu on a touch screen? That's okay. Really?!

 

Teslas have rain sensing wipers. 'Mist' and washer control are on a traditional stalk. There is also a button on the stalk or steering wheel to directly call up the wiper screen if you need to intervene with the auto wipers.

Having the usual wiper control should not be too much more in cost, so having it shouldn't have been a big a deal, but it isn't like you have to go fumbling through touch screens to get the wipers to do anything.

Also keep in mind that Tesla uses large screens. That means they can make the buttons more commonly used bigger and easier to spot and hit than on the screens of other cars.

 

I have never realized how ironic that is till you just mentioned it. I am currently teaching one of our children to drive and have given them a lecture on not using the phone and texting while driving and I may have been using/looking at the touchscreen while giving them the lecture. I need to check my own behavior to set a better example. I wouldn't have picked up on this if not for your post! I appreciate you posting this observation.