Help, Wheel Bearing Mystery....

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by priusrecon, Nov 28, 2018.

  1. priusrecon

    priusrecon Member

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    Help, Wheel Bearing Mystery....

    This summer, I started having road noise coming from the front of my car after I had some
    new tires put on. Later, when I took the car to a dealership to have some brake bleeder work
    done on it, the dealership stated that the noise was a wheel bearing going bad and needed
    to be replaced.

    I let it slide for a awhile because I thought they were just trying to pad my bill, and it
    was just tire edge tread noise from the newly replaced tires. But over time it nagged at me
    so I put the car up on the jack and re-checked it, and everything looked and felt real tight,
    and clean, and solid. But the noise continued.

    It seemed to behave like either wheel bearing noise or tire edge tread noise, because it
    would usually occure only when the car was turning to one side, but then abruptly quiet down
    when going straight.... but then it would occasionally make noise when turning in the opposite
    direction as well....but only sometimes....

    So I then took it to my mechanic to get his opinion. A wheel bearing, he said, and he identified
    it as the one I figured as well. He didn't think it was tire noise, so I took that as a confirmation
    of the wheel bearing.

    It's real cold here in NY now so I figured in this case I'd just throw the job to him and avoid
    any possible grief of me doing it wrong by having a real certified mechanic do the job for me
    and spare my bad back the aggravation for once.

    He replaces the wheel bearing, and it has no effect what-so-ever. The noise is all still there
    exactly as before. So he suggests it may be the bearing's mount is bad to the steering knuckle
    (his terminology for the part that turns that the bearing bolted onto). I left it with him to
    try that fix while I was overseas for the holiday. He gets a new "steering knuckle" and mounts
    it with the new bearing, but again, absolutely no difference, the noise is still there exactly
    as before.

    Now this is two different professional mechanics, one of them from a dealership, that believe this
    is a wheel bearing problem....and I've had them do the work and it does nothing to solve the problem.

    I am not a fan of the Hail-Mary fix, but the mechanic is stumpted, and now reduced to throwing
    new parts at the problem, and he admits that it may be a lot of money for no results for awhile
    until we stumble upon something that works.

    Before I do that, I come here hoping that someone has some wisedom. What am I dealing with?
    Thx;
     
    #1 priusrecon, Nov 28, 2018
  2. audiodave

    audiodave Active Member

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    #2 audiodave, Nov 28, 2018
  3. priusrecon

    priusrecon Member

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    Tires are perfect. Been on awhile now, too. Asked the mech about that, he didn't seem think that the problem.
     
    #3 priusrecon, Nov 28, 2018
  4. bobodaclown

    bobodaclown Member

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    Does the pitch of the sound change with speed?
     
    #4 bobodaclown, Nov 28, 2018
  5. padroo

    padroo Senior Member

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    Can you reproduce the sound with the car with both wheels off the ground. I am not a big YouTube person as far as making YouTube videos but I posted one several years ago that helped me pin point my bad right front wheel bearing. I will look for it and post it here.
    The trick is testing it with the car in the air and stopping one wheel at a time while it is running in EV mode. If it goes too fast the traction control will kick in. It seems I was running at 6 mph when I did the test.



    The key is to isolate the noise and this will eliminate tire noise.
     
    #5 padroo, Nov 28, 2018
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2018
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  6. Patrick Wong

    Patrick Wong DIY Enthusiast

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    My wisdom is to leave the car as-is until the noise worsens and it becomes more apparent what the issue is. This does not appear to be a safety issue.
     
    #6 Patrick Wong, Nov 28, 2018
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  7. John321

    John321 Senior Member

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    If you are interested in anothers experience - I replaced my wheel bearing hub assembly 2 months ago on my 2008 Prius. It was my drivers side front wheel bearing. After considering all options I ordered the wheel bearing and hub assembly from Toyota (online) and replaced the unit myself. I could of ordered a cheaper aftermarket unit but went with the Toyota unit as many others have complained with unsatisfactory results from aftermarket units.

    There are some variables that can affect this installation to make is less than satisfactory If a person is very careful and does a professional job with a good part they will probably be okay. If a person beats a wheel bearing assembly off or on, all bets are off on how long it will last or if it will work at all. Hopefully your installer took the time to remove the knuckle assembly and press the old bearing/hub assembly out and then carefully clean the knuckle where the hub assembly goes, grease it properly and then press the new hub/bearing assembly carefully in and properly torque all units back to spec. If not you will probably have problem immediately or somewhere down the road eventually.
     
    #7 John321, Nov 28, 2018
  8. priusrecon

    priusrecon Member

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    Yes, pitch changes with speed. It also abruptly starts when car turning and stops when car
    going straight ahead.

    Work done on car so far....

    - original wheel bearing hub replaced with new one, into original steering knuckle
    - original steering knuckle then replaced with tested and cleared replacement steering
    knuckle with it's original wheel bearing still in it.
    - another new wheel bearing placed into that replacement steering knuckle.

    Result: No effect - problem still persists. Mechanic said he placed car on lift and spun & listened
    to all 4 wheels yet still insists that the other three are not the problem.
     
    #8 priusrecon, Nov 29, 2018
  9. jimolson

    jimolson Member

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    Presumably Prii have CV joints that transmit torque to the front wheels. What you describe could be worn CV joints, especially the part about the noise increasing when the steering angle changes.

    The mechanic's original guess that the noise arose from a bad front wheel bearing related was a fair one. I either own or supervise maintenance on about 4 Gen II Prii. All have required one or both front wheel bearings before 150k miles. The problem usually starts out as a speed-influenced humming noise that worsens with time. Just before the wheel seizes the humming turns into loud grinding noise.

    However, the last front wheel bearing I replaced was peculiar in that the humming noise was very subtle and did not worsen over time. Even at 10k miles after I began to notice it, the sound was imperceptible to most listeners. But it drove me nuts, so I replaced it and the humming disappeared.

    I can affirm one poster's comment that the method by which a bad bearing is replaced greatly influences its lifetime. I had one replacement bearing that lasted less than 10k miles before humming again. I suspect it was installed by someone who pounded too hard.
     
    #9 jimolson, Dec 4, 2018
  10. 05PreeUs

    05PreeUs Senior Member

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    If the noise is best described as "growling", it is most likely a wheel bearing. If, OTOH, the noise is more of a click or tapping noise, the CV joint(s) are worn.

    In EITHER event, loose or worn driveline parts on a FWD vehicle are nothing to be trifled with, because the potential for sudden failure is always there and the results are generally very ugly.
     
    #10 05PreeUs, Dec 4, 2018
  11. priusrecon

    priusrecon Member

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    The noise is neither the usual bearing growl nor a clicking noise. It sounds just exactly
    like the usual tire tread noise, only amplified when I turn the car.

    The noise does not increase as steering angle increases, it merely starts and stops
    all or nothing, turning on and off instantly as if a switch is thrown when I start
    turning in the car. It stops just as abruptly once I straighten out again.

    I'm having a THIRD shop do a front end alignment on it tommorow and see if they catch
    anything on it or have any ideas.

    Might there be any bushings or anything on any suspension linkages that if they get worn
    or thin; that might be collapsing under the car's turning force, and getting me direct
    metal to metal contact, to maybe better conduct the tire noise thru the chassis to me
    during a turn? I can feel the noise coming thru the floorboards when it happens.

    It just sounds so much like the regular tire noise, and the mechs are not having luck
    chasing the wheel bearing thing. I asked them about axel shafts and the possibility
    of x-mission and differential gear problems as well.... they keep dismissing those....
     
    #11 priusrecon, Dec 5, 2018
  12. 05PreeUs

    05PreeUs Senior Member

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    There is no such thing as "usual tire noise" on passenger car tires. Granted, some tire models DO make tread noise (whining/whirring) it is unaffected by steering and typically gets louder only with increased speed (or different road surfaces/tire inflation changes); steering inputs have little, if any effect.
     
    #12 05PreeUs, Dec 5, 2018
  13. Formula_Ron

    Formula_Ron Junior Member

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    I had the same/similar issue recently. In my case, whenever I turned the wheel to the left at speed, I would hear a metallic scraping/squeaking noise from the front driver's side wheel. I initially thought it was the wheel bearing so I lifted the wheel off the ground to check for any play. It was solid.

    I then took off the wheel and noticed that there was enough rust on the brake rotor edges to rub against the bottom of the brake dust shield. After bending the shield back with a screw driver, that eliminated the noise. Might want to give it a try.
     
    #13 Formula_Ron, Dec 6, 2018
  14. priusrecon

    priusrecon Member

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    Wish it could be that, but the rotors are brand new, and everything is clean and fresh under there. Both me and the mechs have gone over that several times. We are now creeping up the axel halves and differential gear sets looking for alternatives, but even after all of that, they keep saying that it's the wheel bearing....that has now been replaced with a new one THREE TIMES now!....
     
    #14 priusrecon, Dec 7, 2018
  15. audiodave

    audiodave Active Member

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    Make sure brake shields are out of the way.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
    #15 audiodave, Dec 7, 2018
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  16. audiodave

    audiodave Active Member

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    After working on my brakes the shield got bent a little. On turns it would scrap.

    Posted via the PriusChat mobile app.
     
    #16 audiodave, Dec 7, 2018
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