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Red triangle of doom, VSC and a couple other check engine lights

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by stace, Aug 21, 2018.

  1. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    Hello Friends!
    Long time lurker, first time poster. I have a 2007 Gen 2 with 205,000 miles on her in Portland, Maine. I have an Apple phone and laptop, so no TechStream, just a basic OBDC2 using the ELM app which is supposed to have some Prius compatibility. It is reading no DTC codes, though yesterday, driving almost 80 miles an hour, the triangle, exclamation point (not tire), VSC and check engine light came on (photo attached). I pulled over in terror. Stopped and restarted, VSC went out. Used my reader to try to read (none) then clear the codes because I had just had 2 weeks of autobody and thought they may have run my 12 volt down. It was not until I reached high speeds again that the lights came on. Cleared when I got home, did a short low speed trip, still runs perfectly, and the lights stayed off.

    Read a bunch of threads on here, and I checked, and I think I see no turbulence in the inverter reservoir. In your experience, if the car is running, is there turbulence? I only started it, and then looked. Didn't run for a long time. Nothing. I believe this may be the problem as perhaps low speed, low heat, doesn't trip the code.

    Does anyone know where I could perhaps get my stored codes read other than the stealership, lol?

    I already looked into battery replacement, worst case, because of the triangle, and having to pay a stealership for labor to have a code read, after how they rake you over the coals on a hybrid battery replacement is sort of the last thing I want to do. Thank you so much!
     

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  2. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    as soon as you make it ready, the inverter pump starts. did you open the cap? any movement means it is working.
    a dead pump on the highway usually sends you into limp mode.
    you might have a bad wheel speed sensor. how is the tire pressure? are all 4 tires the same model?
    get a volt meter and test the 12v. if you are going diy, you might need tech stream and an old laptop.
     
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  3. Kevin_Denver

    Kevin_Denver Active Member

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    Based on the lights and lack of OBD code, it is likely related to the traction control system. Any unusual vibrations at higher speeds? My car behaved similarly before starting to vibrate a lot, and then one of my tires blew. Basically the tire was old and dry rotted, causing the threads to separate. The code showed up as speed sensor fault, but was really just a bad tire.

    You'll need a code reader that can read the Toyota specific ECU codes to really know what's wrong. The cheapest and most powerful way is to buy a Mini VCI cable for ~$20 off amazon and then install Techstream on a laptop. However you need to be fairly good at software to do install it. There are many code readers that can read these Toyota codes if you want to purchase one off Amazon and are DIY.

    You can also call your local auto parts stores and ask if they have a code reader that can read Toyota ECU codes. It's likely you'll find one that can read the codes for free (all of them can read OBD codes, need the Toyota specific code).

    Your final option is to take it to a mechanic that has such a code reader.
     
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  4. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    I did look in and remove the cap. There was no movement. Very suspicious, except no limp mode!
    I can check the tire pressure (all the same model) but usually I will get a light when one is low. I have like 14 volt meters, not sure where they keep coming from. The 12 volt is only a couple of years old, but you never know.
     
  5. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    Thank you! I should mention that the VSC light never has come back on; just the initial time. When I restarted the car, it went out and never came back. All the rest of the lights have returned (at higher speeds, off all day today).

    I was traveling at a high speed, though I noticed no vibrations. I don't have a windows laptop, will keep my eyes open even though I know installation of techstream can be a little tricky. My amazon search for a toyota code reader other than the mini VCI with Techstream didn't turn up anything. Thanks for the term ECU code! I didn't have that in my vocabulary. Maybe I can call around auto-parts stores.
     
  6. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    As a less powerful, but less expensive alternative, you could try Enginelink, which is available on the App Store. Somewhere around here are the Prius PID codes for Torque, which is an Android app. However, Enginelink can import Torque PID files. There's a thread here on how to do it. Combine that with a wifi OBDII adapter and you're good to go. Another option that's a little more expensive if you use it much, but easier, is Carrista which is pretty much a turnkey operation.

    If you put the car in ready mode and open the inverter coolant tank lid, you should be able to see the coolant swirling in there. Not a maelstrom, but distinctly moving. If it' snot, then that would most likely be the cause of your problems.
     
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  7. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    if it' snot, that might gum up the works.:p
     
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  8. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    Thank you so much! This is very helpful about the code reading. I will look for the thread on importing Torque PID files, Carista looks like it only offers basic OBD2 data for my model Prius, though that may be enough for a check engine light. Now that I have seen the term ECU codes, I am no longer sure what data toyota communicates through OBDII! Would it describe the hybrid failure light? I think not. I cleared my codes and haven't had the lights come up yet again; I may not have to hit highway speeds, or temperatures, as the case may be.

    Which brings me to your other point, Jerry, that there really does seem to be no movement at all in the coolant after putting the car in Ready mode. I assume that pump failure can be diagnosed by a regular garage without a code... I don't want to hurt the inverter trying to make it code again! Unless the code is stored somehow after I cleared it with my rudimentary device. I did read on the forum of a man who had very similar, frightening lights come up, and it was not the Hybrid battery, but merely this pump, so I checked it to the best of my ability. Car still runs perfectly fine!
    Thanks again. I appreciate your input!
     

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  9. dolj

    dolj Senior Member

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    The inverter (and therefore the the inverter coolant pump) also runs in IG-ON mode (2 presses of the power button with foot OFF the brake). Doing the inspection of the inverter coolant tank in IG-ON mode is better from the point of view that the ICE is not running, so you don't have to guess whether what you see is real movement or just engine vibrations.
    It is sounding a lot like your inverter coolant pump has failed. Consistent with your running symptoms too.

    This is not a difficult job to do (there are some good posts here to guide you), but if you are not a DIYer yourself (my immediate assumption is you are, as you are here asking questions), maybe you can call on a family member who works on cars. It is a job that is much cheaper to do yourself that have to pay a mechanic to do it.
    Great minds, eh, bisco? :p
     
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  10. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    Thank you Dolj! I appreciate hearing from you. I have read your sage advice on other threads many times. I'll go give her an Ig-On observation in order to better bolster my confidence that this is the issue and I can buy a part without the benefit of a code! I have a handy friend who I believe might be willing to tackle it... I found this thread (even my model year in the vid) that seems a good resource! A mechanic wants $600 it sounds like from the post, I'll offer my friend 3. ;) I don't expect anyone to know a reputable Prius guy (ahem, cheaper) near Portland, Maine.

    Replacing Inverter cooling pump | PriusChat

    I'll report back!
     
  11. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    All codes are available through the OBDII port. It's just a matter of plugging in the right diagnostic tool. I have not used Carrista, but a lot of people here love it. I have Enginelink with the DTCs for my models as well as Techstream running on an old laptop with Windows XP that never connects to the internet for those times I want to dig deeper.
     
  12. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Snot can do that, I hear. LOL! :eek::LOL:
     
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  13. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    Thanks for the info, I checked out EngineLink, the reviews don't seem too great, only 2.5 stars. Don't yet see info about the PIDs and how to load them, but I may have to take your word for it! Now I have to figure out what kind of wifi OBDCII reader I have, someone gave it to me!
     
  14. jerrymildred

    jerrymildred Senior Member

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    Sadly, Engine link is not nearly as good as Torque, but it's the best I've found for iOS. It's weird and annoying that they don't make Torque for iOS.

    As for the wifi OBDII reader, I've read that there are some cheap ones that don't work well. I got this one and it does fine.


    Anyway, here's a link to an explanation of how to import custom PIDs into Enginelink. Since you will have already downloaded a csv file, you can skip to method #3 and step #8. This is what I did and it wasn't as hard as it first appeared to be, but not as easy as Apple should make it.
    Engine Link for iPhone | Page 8 | PriusChat

    And here's a link where you can download the scv file for Gen 2 custom PIDs. It's in the 5th paragraph of the first post. I have that one plus the file for the PiP on my phone.
    Gen2 Prius: Custom PIDs for Torque (Android App) with formulas | PriusChat
     
  15. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    Wow, thank you! This really helps! Ironically, that is the reader that I have!
     
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  16. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    It finally got hot enough in Maine for the check engine lights to reappear! I took the prius to Advance Auto Parts and their free scan did indeed pull the P0A93 code. I went ahead and ordered the pump from Amazon.

    I am going to try to replace it myself.

     
  17. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    It took a little under two hours, and I finally got to hear what the pump sounds like in IG-ON mode. Hooray! Nice to see the turbulence in the coolant. I only broke one little plastic tab on a black part that the bumper connects to. But since it's an old car I just bolted it back on. Thank you everyone so much for your support in this! If anyone finds this thread down the road and has any questions of me, I will be monitoring!(y)
     
    #17 stace, Sep 2, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2018
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  18. exstudent

    exstudent Senior Member

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    There are postings here and other forums of Apple users getting Techstream working.
    OR, ask a friend/family/co-worker if they have an obsolete Windows 32bit laptop running XP/Vista. Someone will know someone who is in IT and has a laptop or two collecting dust in some corner. Craigslist also has many such laptops for $50+.

    Remember Techstream is the official software designed and written for Toyota/Lexus, and approved by Toyota. Thus the inability of so many aftermarket junk devices and apps that are unable to read so many codes.
     
  19. VFerdman

    VFerdman Senior Member

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    Good for you! Glad you figured it out. For future, you may want to consider getting a cheap or free Android phone (like from a friend who is upgrading theirs) and use Torque and/or Hybrid Assistant apps. Torque will pull all the Toyota codes and Hybrid Assistant will give you a very nice drive along experience with excellent displays of various systems in real time. It's always good to have a decent OBDII dongle. I had a cheapo one and it didn't work very well, then I got this one and it works perfectly well (and not expensive).

    Again, congratulations on fixing the inverter pump and avoiding the stealership.
     
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  20. stace

    stace Junior Member

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    I definitely feel fortunate that this time, Advance Auto Parts could read a legit code for my problem! I think it is a shame that the dealership charges labor for this. I'll keep my ear to the ground for a windows laptop, for sure.