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My Next Gen Prius Wish List

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Technical Discussion' started by habel, Jun 29, 2006.

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  1. efusco

    efusco Moderator Emeritus
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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(john1701a @ Jul 20 2006, 08:43 AM) [snapback]289318[/snapback]</div>
    I'm often at odds with John's point of view, but here I'm totally with him. To keep the PHEV practical cost is and will be a factor. Large, high capacity Li ion or Li gel batteries capable of 20 mile range will be quite large, quite heavy and quite expensive.

    I think that the 9 mile range is more realistic. And the thing is that it really doesn't make much sense to have a hybrid that only runs on batteries for 20 miles. It still makes sense to have the ICE be used during times of acceleration and high speed driving. Too a much lesser degree than the current Prius indeed, but still it should do the best thing for overall efficiency.

    If one were to assume no recharging of the battery by the ICE (obviously not likely) a PHEV that could go only 9 miles on Pure EV might be able to go 20 or 30 miles while averageing over 100mpg with the judicious use of the ICE. And at a huge saving in cost and weight of the vehicle.

    I'll willing to pay an additional $3000 or so for a PHEV with a 9 mile Pure EV range, I'm NOT willing to pay $10000 for a Pure EV range of 20 miles.
     
    #21 efusco, Jul 20, 2006
  2. molgrips

    molgrips Member

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    Diesel!
     
    #22 molgrips, Jul 22, 2006
  3. habel

    habel New Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(molgrips @ Jul 22 2006, 10:29 PM) [snapback]290609[/snapback]</div>
    No way! Diesel is simply the most DIRTY fuel used in today's cars and trucks, and I hope that extra taxes on Diesel fuel will be imposed - to lead consumers and companies away.

    Yes, i know that a comparable size Diesel engine use less fuel and gives more grunt in the midrange area compared to a gasoline engine - and also emits less CO2.

    The latter is partly why it is so popular amongst many these days - particularly in Europe.

    Apart from the two mentioned benefits, I see several severe downsides with using Diesel - also as in "Diesel Hybrid".

    If you still got eyesight, hearing and a good nose, you will know that these cars (and trucks) emmits dark clouds of smoke, are noisy and smell worse than many things I'd rather not mention.

    It is a scientific fact that diesel fumes are heavy polluting and a health hazard to the public. Among the effects are:

    Coughs and phlegm
    Lightheadedness, nausea
    Increased susceptibility to allergens like dust or pollen
    Irritation of eyes, nose, throat and lungs
    Inflammation of lungs, and increased asthma attacks
    Respiratory diseases such as chronic obstructive pulmonary disease
    Lowered resistance to respiratory infection
    Macrophages overwhelmed by particles result in immune reactions that cause inflammation and 'sticky' blood, increasing risk of clots and both heart and lung disease
    Mutations in chromosomes and damage to DNA
    For people exposed chronically to 1µg/m3 of diesel exhaust, a rate of lung cancer in the range of 34 to 650 people per million
    Possible cause of multiple chemical sensitisation, leading to changes in red and white blood cells, bleeding, liver damage, and degeneration of the nervous system.
    etc. etc.

    Numerous articles can be found covering this subject, for instance:
    http://www.cleanairnet.org/cai/1403/articl...46_pamphlet.pdf
    http://www.oehha.ca.gov/public_info/facts/pdf/diesel4-02.pdf

    Diesel exhaust contains more than 40 toxic air contaminants! I believe that there is a reason for Toyota NOT choosing a Diesel Hybrid solution for the Prius and other similar vehicles - even that they do have several Diesel engines in their offering that could have been implemented. They chose gasoline vs diesel - despite a little more CO2 and consumption - to gain a cleaner/healtier solution, less noise and no smell.

    I hope this will continue as I tend to use my resirculation button a little too much when behind a diesel vehicle. Just today I was behind a brand new VW Passat 2.0 TDI that made a sudden acceleration - and I found myself engulfed in a smelly black cloud. Time for people to wake up about diesel - who wants to drive around in a noisy smoking car? Not me!
     
    #23 habel, Jul 23, 2006
  4. MikeSF

    MikeSF Member

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    <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(ServoScanMan @ Jul 8 2006, 07:19 AM) [snapback]282960[/snapback]</div>
    Well if you get a little bitty copper tubing (same size as your wiper output) you can bend it backwards in your rearwiper (and press the wiper spray button) then WAMMO squirt fluid on them. I know not as effective as a rear firing missile, but maybe it's enough to tell the guy "Get the F off my nice person!"
     
    #24 MikeSF, Jul 24, 2006
  5. rockmon1&#33;

    rockmon1&#33; New Member

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    Non-glare interior front wind screen (shield)
    Non-marring (scratching) plastic trim on interior components
    Higher Res. MFD
    More comfortable seats with better lumbar support
    NO Vinyl! Let's get to better sustainability. Make it a Vinyl-free car!
     
    #25 rockmon1&#33;, Jul 24, 2006
  6. molgrips

    molgrips Member

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    The reason for Toyota not using diesel is definitely emissions, yes. However, there are a few points here. I do wonder if any of the diseases and symptoms you mention are more common in a European city than in a US one. I am not sure they are, but I would like to know.

    The clouds of smoke are only from tuned-up diesels. I had the 1.9 engine in my previous car that was tuned for 100bhp, and I never saw any smoke at all, and I specifically tried to create it (being the sort of person that worries about this stuff). The same engine is available in 130 and a 160bhp, and these versions I think smoke a bit when you have your foot down.

    As for noise - I do think that's not true, speaking from experience. The engine was always inaudible at 60mph and only barely at 80mph. The reason for this is that the engine revs at lower speeds than petrol equivalent. And as a pedestrian, I don't find diesels any more noisy when moving than anything else, although it's noticable when passing idling traffic. Unless it's a BMW....

    The only smell I ever detected was a faint whiff of diesel when starting the car in an enclosed space, and this isn't at all unpleasant. A little like paraffin, and a lot nicer than petrol. Maybe US diesel is higher sulphur and smells more, but Toyota don't just sell in the US of course.

    So it's down to emissions. Diesels seem to emit 20% less CO2 perhaps than their petrol equivalents, and I think this is significant. Okay, so NOx and SO2 and whatnot are bad if you live in LA and have to face smog, but CO2 is a much greater problem, don't you agree?

    I think this warrants a new thread...
     
    #26 molgrips, Jul 27, 2006
  7. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Hmm, I don't know but the I've seen smoke from the Jetta and Passat TDIs we have over here. It's usually visible when accelerating.
     
    #27 Tideland Prius, Jul 27, 2006
  8. molgrips

    molgrips Member

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    Aye, the bigger cars seem to do it. I knew a guy who had a Peugot 306 diesel - slightly older car, and he'd apparently boosted the fuel pump pressure somehow to increase fuel delivery, and this resulted in more power but loads of smoke.

    I'm sure Toyota could clean things up a bit - how about an electrostatic filter? The smoke is unburned fuel, so if it were designed for maximum efficiency you'd expect minimal smoke.
     
    #28 molgrips, Jul 28, 2006
  9. jimmyhua

    jimmyhua New Member

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    Instead of diesel, I'd go for a E100 (ethanol), flex-fueled Prius.

    When running on E100 or even E85, the Prius wouldn't need to go through the 4 stages of Prius driving to become ultra-efficient.

    With E85, it could be ultra efficient as soon as you hit the ON button as you wouldn't need a warm-up sequence for temperate weather conditions.

    Jimmy
     
    #29 jimmyhua, Aug 12, 2006
  10. Rangerdavid

    Rangerdavid Senior Member

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    I love ALL these suggestions!!!! :lol: :lol:

    The realistic ones that could actually be done by Toyota that I would like are the electrically adjustible seats with memory, telescoping steering wheel, and an acceleration feature on the cruise control. thats all, other than that, i love it just as is.........
     
    #30 Rangerdavid, Aug 12, 2006
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