ARE WE LOOKING AT A FUTURE LITHIUM ION PACK FAILURE TOO?

Discussion in 'Fred's House of Pancakes' started by Dxta, Dec 30, 2017.

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  1. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace 2025 Camry XLE FWD

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    Put on your world glasses.
    1. Countries outside the US had Lithium Ion batteries in Gen 3 HSD vehicles.
    2. Not all countries have a NiMH trim option for Gen 4.
    I believe @Tideland Prius could give us more details.

    In any event. The OiP wqas a Gen 3 HSD Prius with a Lithium Ion battery.
     
    #21 Prodigyplace, Dec 30, 2017
  2. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    Tempted to move this to "Other cars" or "FHOPancakes"


    Yes 7-passenger versions of the Prius v called the Prius+ or Prius Alpha elsewhere have Li-Ion batteries placed between the front seats, beneath the centre console. Of course, the Gen 1 PHV (based on the Gen 3) has Li-Ion as well.

    My understanding of Li-Ion is that there are several different chemistries (i.e. the ionic solution can be made up of different elements and compounds).

    The Li-Ion in the Gen 4 is different than the Li-Ion in the Prime. They share the name of the overarching terminology for that type of battery but their composition is different because they serve different purposes.

    Lastly, Toyota is a conservative company and I believe they have taken the necessary precautions.

    Why?

    Look at the Prime. The acceleration in both EV and HV modes are quite anemic. The LEAF, Volt and Bolt have much faster acceleration times. I think I've asked this question before to the more technically-inclined PC members - I believe the Prime is capable of faster acceleration based on the battery pack and EV motor output. My guess is that Toyota wanted similar performance throughout the lifetime of the vehicle so it does not allow rapid discharge of its battery to allow for faster EV acceleration. This way, the Prime feels the same 10 years from now as it did when it was new.

    The LEAF, Bolt and Volt may lose a bit of acceleration and it may or may not be noticeable without a stopwatch, we don't know yet. But the conservative nature of the EV side of things make me think Toyota has thought it through.
     
    #22 Tideland Prius, Dec 30, 2017
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  3. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    @Tideland Prius . Could you suggest a place I could move such threads next time I have one to post?


    Thanks
     
    #23 Dxta, Dec 30, 2017
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  4. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace 2025 Camry XLE FWD

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    Since this is a general, primarily Prius related question I do not think any of the current forums is appropriate.
    To me the closest match would be the abused News forum.
     
    #24 Prodigyplace, Dec 31, 2017
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  5. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    :(
     
    #25 Dxta, Dec 31, 2017
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  6. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace 2025 Camry XLE FWD

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    Hey, at least I tried. Comment in that thread. If there is enough support perhaps Danny can be convinced.
     
    #26 Prodigyplace, Dec 31, 2017
  7. El Dobro

    El Dobro A Member

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    The last time Erick Belmer checked in with Sparkie , he has over 418,000 miles on the original Li-Ion battery in his Volt. I wouldn't worry too much about the battery.
     
    #27 El Dobro, Dec 31, 2017
  8. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    it's a good question, no matter the forum. i wonder if mpg's can reduce the battery output to increase longevity. is that what apple is doing?
     
    #28 bisco, Dec 31, 2017
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  9. Sam Spade

    Sam Spade Senior Member

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    Just because you noticed it when it is cold out does NOT necessarily mean that is the reason.
    AND the first item I listed IS because of the cold.

    I give up.
     
    #29 Sam Spade, Dec 31, 2017
  10. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    Hey! You more than tried. Like your inputs mehn!
     
    #30 Dxta, Dec 31, 2017
  11. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    That was great, if one could achieve such a mileage. But I don't think there's any NIMH chemistry that could achieve close to that.

    Contribjtory factor y that must have being achieved to 400...miles, could be attributed to maybe the leaf's algorithms controlling the battery vis-à-vis its method of battery cooling.
     
    #31 Dxta, Dec 31, 2017
  12. William Redoubt

    William Redoubt Senior Member

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    I agree. The normal aging of the car is going to affect MPGs regardless of the health of the traction battery. It all adds up to more friction, just like cold tires, rain on the roadway, head winds and type of pavement.
     
    #32 William Redoubt, Dec 31, 2017
  13. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    It think for apple, what they did was kinda like deliberately slow down the output "juice" from battery of old phones, as a shrewd marketing..., to force consumers to buy newer phones. They know that if they don't do that, lots of people would stick with their old phones, as long as the capacity output is still the same.

    I would ha e related that to civic hybrids, but in the Honda, it wasn't a deliberate attempt to cause people to buy more, because that succeeded in tarnishing their reputations in the HV market.
     
    #33 Dxta, Dec 31, 2017
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  14. Johnny Cakes

    Johnny Cakes Senior Member

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    #34 Johnny Cakes, Dec 31, 2017
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  15. Prodigyplace

    Prodigyplace 2025 Camry XLE FWD

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    No apology needed. It is performing according to their published specifications.
    You did read them first, didn't you?
     
    #35 Prodigyplace, Dec 31, 2017
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  16. Dxta

    Dxta Senior Member

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    OK, I apologize to you for Toyotas sake. We'd try as much as possible, to upgrade your car's BMS software in the coming days:D
     
    #36 Dxta, Dec 31, 2017
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  17. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    i got it.:cool:
     
    #37 bisco, Dec 31, 2017
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  18. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    thank you.:p
     
    #38 bisco, Dec 31, 2017
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  19. JimboPalmer

    JimboPalmer Tsar of all the Rushers

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    3 words - larger diameter tires
     
    #39 JimboPalmer, Dec 31, 2017
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  20. Tideland Prius

    Tideland Prius Moderator of the North
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    It really depends on the topic. This one really doesn't fit any of the Prius forum so typically it goes to the off-topic section which is Fred's House of Pancakes.

    If you post somewhere and then realise you meant to post it elsewhere, you can click the "! REPORT" button and just explain what happened and where you want to move it and we'll do it for you :)
     
    #40 Tideland Prius, Dec 31, 2017
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