Hybrid battery balancing

I believe the Prolong grid charger & discharger system from Hybrid Automotive is the preferred path for many here. @jeff652 is quite active here helping used in addition to promoting his very good product.

Prolong Battery Systems. Extending the life of your hybrid. - Hybrid Automotive

 

Don't expect to get several years out of an 11 year old pack by balancing with RC chargers or with a pack level charger after your HV pack has set a P0A80 code. Your modules are senior citizens and no amount of electrical Geritol is going to perk them up as you would have it.

If your Prius has relatively low miles <150,000 you should splurge for a brand new pack from Toyota. If more than 200,000 miles the decision is easier; do a DIY repair and balance and be happy with doing so every year or every other year if you are lucky. Modules will continue to fail as the years and miles pass by.

Whatever you do, don't spend upwards of $700 on a fancy charger/intelligent discharger. It's not worth it with an old HV pack like yours. You can charge the pack with a less expensive pack level charger ~$300 and use incandescent light bulbs of decreasing wattage to discharge it to regain some lost capacity.

A pack level charger has many advantages - the one I think is best is the ability to charge and discharge the pack in the car without removing the interior panels or the pack itself. But when a module fails.....it's disassemble city no matter what you have.

There is no "approved" written procedure for balancing, it's not as simple as that - unless you get the system @Prodigyplace just mentioned. These systems do have procedures unique to their equipment and work well.

 

New Toyota batteries from a dealership can be had for about $2100+tax if you install it yourself. First you must pay a $1350 core charge which is a PITA but unavoidable if you DIY. Another issue is getting a dealership to actually sell one to you - many will not. There are some independent hybrid battery installers who have very reasonable prices and the two I know of are located in Texas and Florida. The one in Florida would be a possibility for you once you repair the pack sufficiently so that your Prius could make the trip there.

Don't even consider a refurb. I don't know enough about the Bumblebee battery except that it is new and may contain cylindrical modules - not the prismatic modules that the OEM battery pack contains.

So there are your two options - do a DIY with a brand new pack or go to a installer who does it all of the time. I considered the latter the better option after my pack failed because the price difference between DIY and installer was not very much. The hybrid battery installer gets to keep your old pack which usually contains about 10 to 15 good modules that he/she can use to make a refurb pack with. You get a brand new battery, installed for you, without the hassle of a core charge or a search for a dealership willing to sell you one.

 

We have many customers who have extended the life of their battery by a couple years or more by using our products. There are several first person reviews attesting to this on PriusChat (Search 'Prolong Battery Systems'). By correctly load testing your modules (resting voltage is a poor indicator), replacing failed modules with good quality TESTED replacements, and caring for the battery on an ongoing basis multiple years of incremental life can be expected. You can give us a call at 800-589-0730 to talk about the process or read more about it here:
What causes hybrid batteries to degrade and fail? - Hybrid Automotive

Here is one example of the results of our products on a Prius pack with 140k miles:

 

Your products are parasitic.

 

You lost me with that comment. Can you please explain it to this layman?

 

I know darn well what the word means I'm asking what's your beef with the product?

 

…as would many more of us (…I venture to bet!)

 

How about this definition of parasitic:

obtaining nourishment ($$$ from purchasers) while offering insufficient benefit in return.

The OP has an old HV pack that has failed once. The car's relatively low miles makes a brand new pack the best option, in my opinion, if the OP wants to drive his Prius another 120,000 miles which he certainly would be able to with a brand new pack assuming no other major failure occurs.

My beef is with this particular seller. He trots out his boilerplate to persuade a potential customer (sucker) that his equipment
can allow an 11 year old HV pack to last a long time.

and

I doubt that Prius owners with 11 year old HV packs that have failed at least once would get "multiple" years of incremental life out of them with his system. What is almost certain to happen is additional module failures as the pack ages. This seller actually mentions:

And where do the purchasers of his system obtain these good quality TESTED replacements? Does he sell them?

Do you understand now?

 

Jadz,

I must respectfully disagree with your assessment. I believe Jeff has very clearly and accurately explained his equipment and expectations in Post #6. Everyone is entitled to their opinion about how rechargeable batteries can or cannot be restored. Fortunately, there is plenty of evidence available in regard to restoration success. A new battery is not always a feasible option. Many people sell their cars when a dealership presents them with a $4031 estimate for a new battery. I've seen plenty of examples where swapping a single module has allowed the car to continue operating with no further alarms up to this point. I've also seen them last less than an hour. It all depends on attention to detail and sometimes a bit of luck estimating module capacity to get a good match.

I can provide plenty of data showing improvement in module capacity. I have a battery that will be reassembled and installed tomorrow or Friday. We're currently cycle testing the modules. I have capacity tests of the battery as installed in the car prior to removal. I'll perform capacity tests after installation. I would be happy to post the information here. I can post the original capacity tests, the individual module cycle tests, and the tests we'll perform after installation. We'll see what it looks like!!!!!!!!!!!!

And of course, as many of my posts will show, I am a firm proponent of using a battery salvaged from a Gen 3 wreck to rebuild Gen 2 battery assemblies. It eliminates a lot of the hassle and time requirements of trying to restore a battery. But, even with that said, older batteries can very easily be made to be very reliable.

 

So you "doubt" his product will work for an additional 120k miles (he never claimed it would) but you can definitively claim without evidence that the product is bogus? You're being ridiculous. He has posted some evidence as well as the disclaimer that it may help but it may not. You haven't.

"Let the buyer beware" and buyers can make the determination as to buying the product, based on the evidence at hand. He's not twisting anyone's arm and a lot of us are pleased with the results.

As for tested replacements, plenty of mechanics are selling modules that are tested, listing them with the numbers so they can be matched to the rest of the modules.

 

I see alot of statements and assumptions being made here with little to no facts backing them up........sorry I'm calling BS on this one. The Prolong charger does in fact work when used properly and will help extend the life of the battery assuming the cells have not already failed (reversed). Good replacement modules are certainly available and many folks (Eric, Jeff D, myself, etc) gone over many, many times how to test both new and old modules to match them when rebuilding. If you don't understand how it can work then fine express your opinion that it's all just a bunch of hooey but that doesn't make it true either.

 

Yes, it is my opinion and I stand by it. There are many "visitors" to this site that can be persuaded that there is a simple solution to their problems with an old HV pack. It is definitely NOT that simple.

Again, this system's cost far outweighs the benefit it provides. MY OPINION and mine alone. Take it or leave it and most of you probably will leave it and that's just peachy. Waste your hard earned money if you want to.

 

So Jadz, you've provided your opinion. Explain to us the evidence that makes it valid? What is your experience? WHY is your opinion what it is? What is it based on? Help us understand your side of the argument.

 

BTW, The Ni-MH Technical Bulletin put out by none other than Duracell in September of 2009 supports what Jeff's products do.

Wayback Machine

Especially Page 10 on memory effect.

 

In my view, why not verify from those who have used Jeff chargers on PC to confirm, instead of outrightly saying the charger doesn't work? That would settle all this.

 

I my coworker refreshed his daughter’s Civic Hybrid and was very impressed. I know @jerrymildred has used one for quite a while. Perhaps he can post his experiences.