Prime vs. Hyundai Ioniq

Manufacturing location has an impact on reliability as some processes require a high level of technical skills, meticulousness and care. However, as we have seen with the EGR issues on Gen III, the design of a vehicle's various subsystems has an equally important impact on performance. Even the best manufacturing shops in the world can't fix a flawed design - they build what the engineering DWGs dictate using good manufacturing processes & work instructions.

 

i wonder if the engineer's ever get a whack on the backside?

 

That should only be an issue if the company didn't have a high standard for quality, and didn't train their employees properly.

 

True, but when you have a multi-national corporation that is a much more challenging feat to achieve. I work for an aerospace company and we have extremely high standards of quality and rigorous training, but some sites are not quite at the same high level as others. This takes time, diligence and discipline - it's not impossible but indeed not easily achievable across all locations. With the right leadership (notice I didn't say management), training and knowledge-base all sites can achieve parity; maintaining that level of excellence requires perseverance while cultivating the correct approach and attitude.

Anyways, my main point above was that no matter how high-quality the production team may me, they cannot correct a design that isn't optimal (EGR implementation in Gen 3 vs. Gen 4, for example) - they simply build what the engineering states. They can refine that with great processes and skillful manufacturing but it'll still be a well-built sub-assembly that is poorly designed.

 

I bought the "Consumer Reports New Cars," November 2017 at Costco and you might want to check pp. 41:

1. Toyota Prius Three
. . .
3. Toyota Prius Prime
. . .
6. BMW i3-REx
7. Chevrolet Bolt
. . .
12. Chevrolet Volt (one of two low rated reliability)
. . .
14. Mitsubishi i-MIEV SE​

This is not an endorsement of Consumer Reports, yet, but it is also how I keep tabs on their methodology. What surprised me was seeing "52 MPG" for the Gen-4 Prius ... Huh? Even the Prius Prime showed up with "133 MPGe/50 MPG". Of course it could be Toyota cracked the Consumer Reports test protocol ... or those are just highway miles, not the CR 'urban' mileage dreck.

So page 185 had this:

	model	Overall	City	Highway
1	Prius Four	52	43	59
2	Prius Prime Premium	69	56	81

The CR City mileage still leaves a lot to be desired, especially for the Gen-4 Prius, but it looks like Toyota has cracked the CR code.

Bob Wilson

 

here is the side of the engine in a ioniq plugin I had as a loan car that shows how big the valve cover is. also the battery in the boot / trunk

 

trouble is as we have seen in the UK /EU with the NEDC testing cycles there are lies, damn lies then unrealistic std mpg figures

the NEDC favours small turbo engines with mpg figures you can never achieve, the EPA figures in the US seem better at actual real world figures but at the end of the day it all comes down to the type of journey you do day to day

that's where sites like fuelly come in handy, but no substitute for forums like this where you can ask actual owners who do similar journeys

if you give manufacturers a std test they will design the car to be best in that test, that don't mean it will be best on the road in the hands of a normal driver

on paper (epa figures) the Ioniq is a couple of MPG better than the prius, if you look on fuelly currently they are pretty much exactly the same, both give great mpg and the owners are more than happy with what they get compared to their old cars

over on the dark side new members getting a hybrid for the first time are blown away by the mpg from day one, I suspect you guys see the same over here when you get a new prius owner

 

And what are your impressions on IONIQ plug-in? Is there enough EV power for normal overtaking and merging on main roads?

I'm asking this because it has electric motor rated at max 44.5 kW and long term 30 min power at max 25.3 kW it's a little difficult to imagine what this numbers mean, so would be great to know from someone who actually drove the car.

 

normal day to day driving / acceleration was ok nothing exciting but more than adequate for round town but out on faster roads by the time you get yo 55-60mph the the rate acceleration definitely slows down, if you gave it a bit more gas / accelerator then the ICE kicks in to give another 100 horses and gets you moving quicker, then you can ease off and drop back into EV mode again

on the whole not bad, a definite improvement on the hybrid I have, but it was strange to see the battery indicator drop so quick, each segment of the SOC is 3-4 miles of range

it has two driving modes, charge depleting (EV) mode and charge sustaining (hybrid) mode, you have a button next to the gear selector so you can choose when to use the battery, so I can see on a longer run you could say start the run in hybrid, as you know the far end you have a lot of slower town traffic where you will get more range / benefit of the EV mode

on the darkside I did this long post so easier to link to http://www.ioniqforum.com/forum/226-hyundai-ioniq-plug-hybrid-phev/14169-comparing-plug-hybrid.html

plenty of pictures and compared the plugin to the hybrid

 

love what they did with the battery packaging.

 

I agree. Look at the majority of the type of cars being advertised on TV and radio. Big trucks, fast sportscars, Muscle cars, large SUV's. The big three is taking advantage of the lull in gas prices. Sooner or later, that 650 dollar monthly payment, coupled with 200 dollars a week in gas will break the bank for most.

 

Mr. Montgomery, have you seen ANY Prime commercials at all?? I think this car is probably the best-kept secret in Southern California! I "sold" one to a fellow soccer family who currently own a Honda van and would love to have the benefits of the Prime!! They loved my Advanced! Now if my kid (43 years old!) and his team would just win more soccer games....!

.

 

Paging Harvey! Paging Harvey!

Hummm, we have a new nickname for man made global warming, Harvey.

Bob Wilson

 

Don't know what Toyota is thinking. Seen more Prime's and even the occasional Mirai on the road than the new 2016 Prius.

 

The incentives where you are make the plain Prius a poor deal.

 

I'm sure Toyota is selling all the Primes it needs to in California without any advertising at all. I would urge them to put this car on the radar, so when they meet head-on competition from ioniq etc., they are going to be able to compete. It's going to be a very tough hybrid, EV marketplace until gas prices start skyrocketing again.

.

 

here in the UK the Ioniq was only advertised for a couple of weeks, then nothing, not seen much in the way of prius advertising at all

ford, Vauxhall (GM in states) and Peugeot with a few dacia adverts seem to account for most of the adverts I see on TV, don't see many adverts online (block most), most car adverts I see are in print media and bill boards these days

 

I do find it humorous that you are on this forum with a pic of your Ioniq in your avatar on a Toyota Prius forum.

 

yep, but I restrict myself to relevant Ioniq topics and don't get into "mine is better than yours" arguments, there is a lot the ioniq / Hyundai owe to Toyota / prius, they have done a lot of the groundwork to make hybrids acceptable to the masses and shown you can have a modern car using modern tech that don't look like a leaf

Tesla are doing similar for the pure EV market

so long as both sides are polite, respect each others opinions and choices then you can have a good informed discussion about the merits of both vehicles and the tech in them

and hopefully have a bit of fun / humour at the same time