Prime vs. Hyundai Ioniq

After 2019, I may try VOLVO

 

I feel like by then the car is going to be so different they’re going to have to call it Prius Prime (we actually mean it this time).

 

toyota is being forced into plug ins. they can be as good as it as anyone, but they have to own it. the market won't support it right now, but it will eventually. they'll have the technology ready. two dollar gas is frustrating!
(except it allows for steep prime discounts)

 

Patience my son, the mighty oil conglomerates will prevail in a mighty way with ever abundant price increases.
By the end of this year, middle of 2018, their supreme price-fixing power will be felt by all. Then woe will be the SUV, truck, and other Sledsky Special owners!
Prime Season will soon be upon us!! Rejoice my children!!

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well, there's two side to every story, as @wjtracy will tell you.

 

I hope gas prices go up. My portfolio will finally thank me on my almost 2 year old bet.

 

i've been saying that about interest rates for 10 years now.

 

So I have been reading a few articles that predict the gas prices for the rest of the year and for 2018 and it doesn't look like gas prices will go up that much... it looks like a very gentle increase, but still within the sort of range of gas prices we are used from the last year or so... we will not see a return to $4 gas in the next few years... in other words, there is not going to be a huge influx of new buyers to the Kingdom of Prius... I wish there was as it would be cool. Even companies like Tesla wish for price increases, but alas, it doesn't look like it will happen... relatively cheap gas is here to stay ... and as more and more electric cars are bought (Model 3?), it will not put pressure on gas prices, quite the opposite. I wonder if anyone has any recent and trustworthy articles that predict gas prices to climb considerably, but I wasn't able to find any.

 

gas prices are a result of geo politics. while impossible to predict, at the end of the day, someone will be right, and someone will be wrong.

 

California, at least will be offering increased gas prices in November, thanks in part to increase in gas tax. Also trust me, when the oil refineries have their inevitable shutdowns and "accidents", we will be blessed with increases!!. Price increases are inevitable; we just don't know when. Not knowing is still not a reason to purchase irresponsible cars! Of course, it might turn out that the best car to buy might be the one most resistant to radiation fallout, thanks to the current calm diplomacy being practiced!!

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Yes well they can frack in a lot more place than they do now, such as in Cali, but the state might not let them.


iPhone ? Pro

 

Duplicate post. What's wrong with the forum software?

 

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That is so vague, it could mean anything. Try again with some detail, any sort of specific will do... like time, volume, cost, capacity... Then, think about how those comments apply to all legacy automakers.

I see the continued push from Toyota in the form of electrification, not EV range as most. What's the point if you don't have an efficient & affordable collection of components. It should be obvious with Prime's design under the hood. The ramp-up of lithium production for both Prius & Prime/PHV is not so obvious, be just as vital.

How will expansion to other vehicles, Camry & RAV4, happen without the production & reputation of the needed components well established first?

 

the discussion is (was) about prime. i maintain that shoehorning the battery into the gen 4 reflects toyota's commitment. i'm not interested in other manufacturers or models, that's a different discussion.
they could have made a 5 seat, full hatch prime. would it have been profitable? i have no idea.

 

How can a series-parallel hybrid be just a parallel hybrid?
The Ioniq and other parallel hybrids coming to market are labeled parallel because they don't have series hybrid operation like power-split hybrid do.

Someone here that got to go to an unveiling event hinted that the Prime originally had a smaller battery, but Toyota USA stated that wouldn't sell here. NDA involved, so no details.
With the state of Japan's grid, a smaller battery makes sense for that market.

 

Forcing comparisons with What-If scenarios doesn't work. Countless attempts over the past have overwhelmingly proven it.

Model to Model works fine though.

 

agreed. i was hoping for an improvement over the pip (as i think you already know) and they did a great job in many area's. but a few went backward.

 

but the fact the Ioniq is larger diameter doe that not increase the torque produced for the same power input, also the Ioniq power train allows ICE only if no power applied to motor, hybrid mode with both ICE and motor providing power and motor only with the ICE decoupled due to the clutch between the ICE and motor, also the car can use both the HSG and motor to increase regen braking / energy recovery to charge the battery faster, this is most apparent in sport mode which has a more aggressive energy recovery and use to provide what appears to be a more powerful drive but is actually no different to the normal ECO mode just less gas pedal travel is needed to get the powertrain up to full power

the gearbox and the larger diameter of the motor help, this lower power and toque multiplication of the gearbox in lower gears mean less power is used and the drive is more efficient,

one advantage of the DCT in the Ioniq is it has a true reverse gear where both the motor and ICE can drive the car in reverse, I believe the eCVT can only use the electric motors running in reverse limiting the amount of power and gradient the Prius can reverse up
another way the Ioniq overcomes some of the issues of judder when moving off with an ICE only DCT is the fact it starts moving using the motor only which don't require any clutch slip so also means less clutch pack wear increasing life of the DCT, also the fact it is a dry clutch system the DCT oil is not contaminated so less oil changes / maintenance of the DCT compared to a ICE only car with a wet clutch DCT

or reducing the price to make it more competitive to other hybrids on price alone, as Hyundai seem to have done at the moment, there are rumours certainly of larger batteries in the full EV, not seen anything about bigger batteries for the plugin or hybrid but it would be nice

yep, both the prius and Ioniq share this as both use highly efficient Atkinson cycle engines and low drag kam tail designs

both cars have different approaches to achieve very similar economy results and which transmission type you choose will come down to preference. Toyota have done a lot to bring hybrids to the masses now others like Hyundai are joining the party which means more competition which hopefully will result in drivers getting either cheaper or better spec'ed cars. At the moment there is plenty of capacity and customers to go round but as more hybrids, plugin and EV's hit the market competition will increase and it will be interesting to see how the various manufacturers respond to it