VW Faces $17B Fine for Emissions Scam

Oh did they suspend sales on the TDI's? Do you have a link?
The article I just posted says otherwise, but could very well be old info.

Thanks.

 

There's a stop-sale order on all new and used TDI's at US VW dealers. A VW spokesman originally said that 2016's wouldn't be affected (they're still at the ports), but that appears to have been corrected - no TDI sales of any kind.

 

VW Diesel Emissions Recall: What You Need To Know In 10 Questions

 

In the case of the SCR Passats involved, the fix should just be using more DEF. The incentive to VW there was likely to just extend the fluid fill interval to that of the oil change.

For the others, buy back might be the cheapest path for VW, and they might be able to resell the cars in Mexico, South Americo, or China.

It is an assumption they'll even go that far. I see it as unlikely, since the car owners aren't the ones to have modified the cars to pollute more, and no has posted a story here on the EPA fining some guy for 'rolling coal'. If owners refuse to get the fix, it is a maybe. But keep in mind diesel vehicles sell at about a third of the rate of hybrids in the US.

This is just curiosity, but has the NOx emissions of these cars been compared to the pre-ULSD/tighter NOx limits models?

And this is the real crime. Diesel exhaust can be cleaned up, and still provide desirable performance, but most will just think of VW's crime.

Perhaps this will get Volvo and partners to speed up the introduction of their diesel fuel cell. No NOx emitted from it.

The 3.0L TDI's didn't have the illegal defeat operation. These were introduced on Audis in the past few years.
I'm guessing this started at the beginning of the tighter emission regulations on diesel cars, so VW could avoid putting SCR onto the Jetta. That was their most popular TDI model, and SCR with DEF was seen as a bigger negative by buyers in the beginning. Being cheaters, they got lazy, and didn't remove or turn off the defeater on the 2.0L models with SCR. If VW had installed SCR onto their smaller cars sooner, and removed the defeater, they probably would have gotten away with it.

 

A more interesting variation is 'what are the long-term performance' of any car?

Toyota uses O{2} sensors on both sides of the catalytic converter to measure efficiency. But what if someone else decides the up-stream and down-stream sensors will always show 'effective catalytic converter operation?'

Spoofing is not a German invention . . . it seems to be common to primates and not just our species.

Bob Wilson

 

The e-tron has a gasoline engine and is a plugin, so is more a Volt competitor than a Prius one.
BTW, Peugeot was selling a non-plugin hybrid diesel and has just declared that they will stop the project and go the way of the gasoline one because the result were poor.

 

On an unrelated topic, just came across this link about VW using cyber attack to shutdown a website complaining about their cars. VW Fraud Class Action

The website summed up VW well... VW = North Korea of Automotive Industry

Maybe a sour grape former owner, but it sounds pretty genuine on face value.

 

But will it only operate during emissions testing?

 

Watching the morning news, I grab a camera to take a photo. But here is a better screen shot:

Talk about 'product placement.'

Bob Wilson

 

The software defeat appears to be on the 2009-2015 clean diesels SCR for reduction of NOx. As such it probably is there to allow "full Performance" which might be reduced if NOx levels were too high. I doubt this was done to spike efficiency claims, as these would have been conducted with the defeat on. This would not appear to affect gasoline or plug-in vehicles as they do not have SCR.

Hyundai and Ford both cheated on efficiency claims, but these don't effect safety or the environment. Hyundai when caught did a simple mea culpa. Ford used some math tricks which made their claims technically ok under the law, but completely unethical. That dragged out longer, they finally did a mea culpa. Not much harm done by either company.

GM was fined less for its ingintion switch screw up than toyota, in spite of their being more dealths. The higher fines for toyota were not because of the "safety" but because of the active cover up, which toyota some how claimed was accidental. Doccuments showed that it could have not been accidental under reporting.

This is not as serious as gm or toyota, but we have a new level of bad behavior. Toyota violated the law by keeping secret safety information. VW actually designed software to hide emissions data. I expect a higher fine than toyota for this despite the lack of proof of even 1 death.

 

This is what I sent to the 'Greenhuman' group:

The technical report comes from an ICCT sponsored study conducted by West Virginia University. The report is huge, 4.7 MB, so I recommend searching Google

"In-Use Emissions Testing of Light-Duty Diesel Vehicles in the United States". ​

There may be an EU report in the UK but I've not looked for it. Regardless, I'd recommend downloading a copy and reading the source.

Bob Wilson

 

maybe so, but the guy in the commercial, staring longingly at the e tron, is polishing his prius, not his volt. it's a direct shot across toyota's bow, as they have been doing for years. they don't see gm as a threat.

 

Well, I expect a very small amount of those vehicles in this list for the next few months.

 

Because it was expensive and emissions were high. I don't know how much they cost in Italy but some of the higher spec versions were almost as expensive as a BMW 5 series, or an Ampera/Volt, and more expensive than the Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV.

There seems a trend in Europe that hybrids are only for range topping vehicles - a token gesture. These hybrids barely sell. If hybrids are offered as an option across the range then they do sell, and in good number. I don't want to become a bore about it but the Outlander PHEV is selling **** loads. It gives a car people want, for a price they want to pay - and the sales show.

Peugeot hybrids = getting pulled because nobody wants them
Outlander PHEV = can't keep up with demand.

I think it depends on if there's a will at the manufacturers HQ.

 

No more "German Engineering" commercials for VW: VW German Engineering

 

My German Engineered VWs were back to the dealer on an average of once every three weeks.

 

So far, I have not been told what "German Engineered" is supposed to mean!

 

In all fairness to Engineers, it's usually the money/power people that muck things up by not listening to them....regardless what company or government they work for.

 

I thought the US cars were made in Mexico?

You can imagine the meeting in 2008; "How much to add SCR to each car? OK, how much to fluff the software?" prompty goes to his boss and says he's saved the company $3 million a year and gets fat bonus.

6 years later......