Bush Quote on Hybrids

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mardikes @ Apr 25 2006, 12:05 PM) [snapback]244870[/snapback]</div>

Far be it from me to say anything nice about Bush, but this is actually a pretty good idea. Imagine a combination EV/Hybrid that could be plugged in and go 40 miles on the EV and then have the gasoline/hybrid system kick in if you needed to go further than that.

Of course, one might argue that we should just put that time/energy into developing better EV components (including better/more efficient batteries) so we can go pure EV.

Also, what's (honestly) so bad with hydrogen fuel cells? Is it just that it is going to require a large lead time to actually make the cars/infrastructure, or is there something inherently "bad" or "worse" about them?

Ug. So much agreement with Bush. I feel dirty. . . .

BUSH SUCKS!

Ahh. . . much better. . .

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mardikes @ Apr 25 2006, 05:49 PM) [snapback]245098[/snapback]</div>

George, this is precisely right! Any mention of hydrogen is a smokescreen, because H2 ONLY has a potential benefit when there is sufficient renewable energy generation capacity in place to make it a viable "fuel". In other words, first you need the renewable energy generation capacity, then MAYBE H2 makes sense. H2 and H2 technology in and of itself is less than useless, because it wastes energy (generated from fossil fuel) to create H2, and the only remotely cost effective way to generate H2 is to breakdown fossil fuel (as you pointed out), which makes it doubly wasteful.

Its that "silver bullet down the road" aspect of H2 that causes people (like Bush) to bring it up. It enables you to sound like your doing something when actually you aren't.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Betelgeuse @ Apr 25 2006, 04:49 PM) [snapback]245096[/snapback]</div>

Hydrogen fuel cells are good, but it requires a lot of energy to make them.

Iceland is going to a hydrogen based economy. They are using geo-thermic energy to produce hydrogen and power their country. In 2004, one of the obscure Democratic candidates in the NH primary, suggested using the power of the ocean to produce hydrogen along our coasts. These ideas make sense.

Bush's idea is to produce hydrogen from fossil fuels. That doesn't make sense.

Like ethanol...ethanol production requires vast amounts of fossil fuels. We'd be better off just burning the fossil fuels it in our cars.

And yes, Bush does suck. But today he wanted to repeal some of the tax advantages to Big Oil and give more tax incentives to hybrid technology, so he sucks a little less for today only. Just today.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mardikes @ Apr 25 2006, 06:56 PM) [snapback]245136[/snapback]</div>

That would make a great bumper sticker :lol:

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(kingofgix @ Apr 25 2006, 06:04 PM) [snapback]245107[/snapback]</div>

Well said, king

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mardikes @ Apr 25 2006, 03:01 PM) [snapback]244974[/snapback]</div>

That's the most beautiful one-liner I've heard in a long time. Almost qualifies as poetry.

 

Well Bush isn't even the worst of it. The Governator was quoted saying his inane solution once more...."drive less". This coming from a man that owns more gas guzzling toys than most... improve public transport 1st Ahrnold!

 

"Also, what's (honestly) so bad with hydrogen fuel cells? Is it just that it is going to require a large lead time to actually make the cars/infrastructure, or is there something inherently "bad" or "worse" about them?"

Darrell has some info u might want to read:

http://www.darelldd.com/ev/

It's there under Fuel Cell something something. Great stuff. I've never learned so much about EVs and their advantages over fuel cells. Why isn't this kind of thing even talked about by decision makers? The battery tech seems to be here, the car tech seems to be here, the infrastucture has been here for ages...C'mon, are we that brain-dead in our "leaders"...oh, wait, forgot.

 

One of my favorite quotes from that Earth Day 2004 speech:

"I knew better. I came here from (a mechanical engineering) position at General Motors and since they were really pushing [hydrogen fuel cells], I knew it had to be crap."

I'd also like to add a paraphrase to that: Since Bush is pushing it, it has to be crap. Based on that Earth Day 2004 speech, it appears that Dumbya is pushing it because if it actually comes to pass, the fuel for fuel cells will actually cost a lot more to the consumer than gasoline does. Figures.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Fibb222 @ Apr 25 2006, 01:02 PM) [snapback]245012[/snapback]</div>

The words out of this mans mouth are all Rove's cynical marketing spin. There is very little action behind them. It's easy to project fantasies as pablum for the masses that won't take effect for 10-20 years. Very safe. Notice his programs are all research and very little "production". Note how there is no conservation in the message. In truth this administration has fought almost all environmental advances and dismantled many good programs.

I find it totally ironic but believable that today he hired a new mouthpiece to replace McClellan, Tony Snow. Now all we'll get from the podium are Snow jobs. B)

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Salsawonder @ Apr 25 2006, 10:22 PM) [snapback]245363[/snapback]</div>

totally! what a hypocrite. if you want less driving, give us a good public transport system, ya big lug!

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(dipper @ Apr 25 2006, 04:16 PM) [snapback]245082[/snapback]</div>

Put the entire space program in mothballs and use all that manpower and technology to work on improving hybrids

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mardikes @ Apr 25 2006, 09:05 AM) [snapback]244870[/snapback]</div>

Some thoughts. First, I was surprised when Bush went with the 'addicted to oil' theme, but I'll give him credit for saying it. Now, whether it's just PR BS or he'll actually do something about it remains to be seen. Given his record so far I'm not convinced. My main question is why now? Why not go this way ~6 years ago, when he was first elected? We could be that much further along in our "War against Oil Addiction"! It seems like he tried the "control-a-big-oil-producing-nation-by-overthrowing-its-hated-leader" strategy, and it's not working (gas is still expensive), so in desperation they turn to a saner approach.

Al Gore-I'm guessing the original comment was a joke, but I have to say it anyway: Gore never claimed he invented anything. That was a manipulative conservative PR spin. Gore simply claimed to play a role in allocating govt funding for development of the network that would become the Internet. Or something to that effect.

CAFE standards: Great, but the problem with any standard based on MPG is that it doesn't really measure fuel consumption for a fixed amount of driving. Try this some time: Assume a fixed MPG standard of, say, 30 MPG. Now calculate how much gas gets used for a fixed distance if all cars get 30 MPG, and then try it when half the cars get 20 and half get 40. The result may surprise you. Someone once pointed out that having a few high MPG cars actually could lead to more gas guzzling, since if a fleet has a few Prius's, that means it can have more Hummers on the other end and still meet the CAFE standards. Since they're based on MPG and not GPM, the guzzlers use more extra gas than is saved by the hybrids.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Mardikes @ Apr 25 2006, 12:05 PM) [snapback]244870[/snapback]</div>

Gore would have said that he invented the hybrid. Sorry, just had to have some fun with that.

Tom

 

we cannot and must not trust anything coming from the bushivistas as it is all a smokescreen. they know they will lose big in every election for the next decade (barring more tainted elections (where´s international protection when we need it)) and must grab anything they can for their own selves while the getting is good. Past results predict future performance.

 

<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(stevenokc @ Apr 26 2006, 04:46 PM) [snapback]245716[/snapback]</div>

Actually, that very thing has been proposed (not just hybrids, but sustainable/alternative energy resources in general):
http://www.apolloalliance.org/