Interesting article talking about the CO2 produced by the electric grid, and how that relates to CO2 emissions from gasoline cars. How Do Electric Cars Get Cleaner With The New Year? It even has a map that breaks it out by region. Pretty interesting! Also, pretty sad that (according to this) my Prius (in Oklahoma) has less CO2 emissions than a Leaf. But, as the article states, these electric grid emissions should be improving over time.
I'd have to look at the raw data. Lately coal is making a bit of a come back following a minimum in 2012. They are showing VA/MD/PA as clean elec states, but we use a lot of coal...whoever made the chart found a way to carve out small chunks of PA/MD/VA as coal areas, but showed most of the area as cleaner energy. Sort of energy gerrymandering.
You think big-coal southwest VA is the same as Nuclear around Fredericksburg from Lake Anna? There are differences within a state even if they are connected to the same grid.
To be fair, a true comparison of CO2 should probably factor in the CO2 produced from the well to the gas station, and add that back to the CO2 that a car produces. It's not like gas magically appears at the gas station, lol.
you can put your mouth over my exhaust pipe when i'm in ev, with no ill effects. except chromium poisoning.
...on the other hand we need to consider that CO2 is not the only problem. Mercury, acid rain, NOX smog, particluates, coal ash disposal, are an issue with electric made from coal especially. Not to mention nuke hazards which I am not too crazy about either. When we say CO2 needs to be the No. 1 consideration and energy ranking factor, then IMHO that could be a mistake.
No more gas station visits Cost per mile lower or equal All but end oil changes and coolant I don't know if I could stand the savings . . . wait, I'm 65 and will eventually graduate to fixed income. Bob Wilson
What about the massive power stations situated next to the oil refinery? Are they ever included in the 'well to wheel' calculations?
What about EV users in Northeast winters if they have any heat on? I personally do not feel EV's are as low in CO2 in the Northeast as the map would suggest. I keep meaning to rent a Volt in winter to check it out, hey it's about that time to do that.
The Volt does but unlike engine coolant, I doubt it ever approaches 100C or regular engine coolant temperatures. I could be wrong but my understanding of battery technology and the plastic separator mesh is pretty temperature sensitive. The power electronics are probably liquid cooled but the same thing applied . . . much lower heat load than the engine. Bob Wilson
Off the top of my head, there is Peach Bottom, Limerick, and TMI still has a reactor running in the east of Pennsylvania. Coal is under 40%, and is beaten out by nuclear in the mix for me. Coal doesn't get greater than 50% until you get to Pittsburgh. Though there are spots that still use coal for home heating.
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The UCS uses some questionable methodology and it is difficult to really know what happens marginally in the short term. In the long term though we know some things. The US repealed many of the 70s era pro-coal rules, and even though today's laws still favor existing coal plants, economics favors less coal not more. We won't have large amounts of plug-ins on the road for at least a decade. What will the grid look like then? Why EVs Are And Almost Always Will Be Greener It is likely that the country will have much more wind, solar, and natural gas power plants and will continue to shut down coal. If you add a plug-in to the grid it is unlikely that you will slow the decrease in coal generation over a decades term, but many do accelerate growth in renewables.
All cars take a hit in efficiency in the cold, but efficient cars take a bigger hit than ineffient ones. My guess is a small adjustment should be made, maybe 7%, but then again the north east grid should be getting cleaner in the future. Go 10 years out and it will be an underestimate. Remember don't be like consumer reports and just act like worst case is the regular one. Use should be averaged on an entire year.
..... you can wrap your lips around mine too.... if you can ever find it. some cars break the CO2 general RULE - and the ratio of rule breakers is growing. For example the state with the most cars registered is Cali. In that same vein, they have the most EV's. And, a substantial % of EV owners either have PV setups or are planning on installing PV. Think about it .... potentially doing away with almost all of the well to wheels computation. Sure - being grid tied after dark means not all your juice is completely carbon free - but that's about as far to the opposite side of the gross polluter scale as is practical. .
I was hoping that wouldn't have been so easily misunderstood ... too late.... should have followed your lead with exhaust pipe ... oh well I'm thick skinned - not worth the edit. But ... at 6'-5" ... I DO wear a size 13 shoe. Just sayin' .
