The law in almost all regions says that pedestrians have the right of way, especially in marked crosswalks. Unless the crosswalks are controlled by walk/don't-walk signs as part of the traffic light system. But every town has its share of uncontrolled crosswalks as well, and technically when someone comes to one end of the crosswalk intending to cross, auto traffic must stop for them. . Usually, in an already slow area such as parking lots or at lights when traffic is likely stopped or just turning anyways, it makes sense. How well drivers pay attention and obey this is sometimes another matter, and sometimes the timing of when the pedestrian makes clear an intent to cross vs. where a car is gets dicey such that a car shouldn't need to make an abrupt stop, and can get safely past the crosswalk before the pedestrian reaches the traffic lane. . However, think about this for a minute: A sudden stop and then having to restart is a HUGE energy hit to a vehicle. It takes a lot less energy to stop the 150-pound piece of meat than the 3000 pound lump of scrap metal, especially if said scrap metal is traveling anywhere over, say, 20 mph. At that point, pedestrians taking advantage of their legally-given right to stop traffic is not only a major annoyance to drivers, it can waste significant resources. . What do you think would be the merit and the entailed work to institute changes, such that there would be certain types of pedestrian crossing areas where they *don't* have right of way for the sake of smoother vehicle traffic flow? Personally, I really hate having to almost panic-stop for some donkey who's on his cellphone and not even paying attention and decides to just casually saunter across the street when I'm on a nice 30 mph glide. And yet if he arrives at the curb and I keep going past, even if the timing is such that I had plenty of margin, I can get pulled over for it. This is just WRONG in many situations, and especially for vehicles that are going to burn all that kinetic energy away in brakes and then have to use even more to re-launch afterward. . _H*
The alternative is for you to just run right over the pedestrain, and that may dent your prius and that would be a shame...
Not a problem in Puerto Rico... cars never stop at crosswalks, and pedestrians don't expect them to stop. B)
Unless it rains and there are less then a few cars I allways sign drivers to drive through. This because I am aware of the energy spoils. It's to bad I am one of the few and it's not because I am a driver myself. I only have my license for a few months and I always did this. The problem is if I sign and I walk through the car driver is still responsable. I think it would great if everywhere over the world there would be one sign to tell drivers to go through instead of stop. Maybe holding up your hand....
Forget the energy issue, at best that is an attempt to divert the attention from the real issue. If you're a selfish donkey (as you seem to think the pedestrian is), then you are driving around, and the whole world revolves around you. You are all about you, so stopping for someone else is clearly not plan A, and really, to yield or stop for someone else to have the right-of-way would be to think that they may have a plan for their day or need to get to their car to continue with what they need to do. Heck, it may be real windy out, may be raining, it may be a mother with 2 children in tow, but let's not cause YOU to burn an extra 1/32 ounce of gas and wait an extra 12 seconds for them to cross safely while you sit in your comfortable car and obey the cross walk laws. I know that if this is your mindset, that thinking of someone else, or waiting for someone else was an all fresh and new concept. thinking of someone else has never been done, so that was a new angle on how to handle a situation. It probably caught you a little off balance and may be a little uncomfortable at first. If you do it a couple times, you my actually begin to like it. The best part... is how this tends to work out in life. You may run a few crosswalks in your day and get away with it... But... that one day when you finally run one too many and you finally hit someone, it's not going to be that overweight (insert your worst favorite race) (insert your worst favorite gender) (insert your worst favorite age) person. It's going to be some old lady who's been a grandmother to the entire city for the last 60 years, or some really beautiful pregnant lady with one baby in the stoller and another toddler in the other hand. All you'll be in the newspapers is the impatient selfish AHole that hit that innocent person in the cross walk. You'll probably only spend 15 years for killing 'em.. Have a very nice selfish life.
On the other hand, making it more difficult for pedestrians to cross the street will only encourage them to drive places. Which is the bigger energy loss? I'd rather go the other direction. Add more marked crosswalks. On signalized crosswalks, make the call buttons interrupt the cycle sooner. Enforce the law giving pedestrians the right of way more. (Around here, most people won't stop.) Maybe if crossing roads wasn't a pain, people would be willing to walk farther than from Wal-Mart's parking lot to Wal-Mart.
It would be a sad day if cars had the right of way over pedestrians. However, I do feel some small towns around here go overboard when they have an official crosswalk every 50 feet or so along a downtown streach. Not that such a layout mitigates the need to stop, it does make driving through those towns a bit like a video game where people are coming at you in a non-stop fashion as you try to navigate along the street. I think drivers have a hard time processing this much data and that is a safety issue. Sometimes I ride on a bicycle trail that has a couple of signaled crossings. There is a bit of guilt bringing a line of traffic to a stop on your command, but the alternatives aren't very safe (if I see a safe clearing coming up, I'll just wait for the traffic to pass, but this is usually the exception rather than the rule). What bothers me most is seeing very poorly timed traffic control. There you have big time energy waste where a little work and money would have a huge efficiency payoff.
EV button. Sometimes, when I have to make a short stop, I'll punch the EV and use it to get the car back up to around 30 MPH. Then I turn it off and continue on.
Timed lights, one - way streets. Hobbit, your energy frugality side will really get mad if you compare your hunk of steel to a 30 lb toddler
Pedestrians have rights of way over vehicles for many good reasons. Energy use also favours the pedestrian. If you're so concerned about it, leave the car at home and walk. After learning what it's like to be a lowest class citizen (people only walk because they can't afford a car, right?), go back to driving with an attitude of respect for those 'in your way'.
What I didn't include in my OP, probably because it was like 2am, was that I spend my share of time as a pedestrian [and bicyclist] too, and I feel bad if a driver has to sudden-stop for me. I try to time my walk to match where cars are, or wave them through, but then that gets into the "arbitration" game which people are notably bad at -- if you're driving and trying to do the right thing and a ped waves you past and you're worried about not yielding, what do you do? You could theoretically get pulled for that unless you could PROVE somehow that the ped specifically yielded in that instance. . Don't misinterpret this topic as me being an arrogant driver. I like to think I'm one of the more aware and cautious ones around here. It's just that sometimes, pedestrian interactions really mess with my sense of appropriate timing and flow continuity. I hate anything abrupt on the road, because that's *what* causes accidents. . And no, it has nothing to do with the pedestrian's age or gender. Sheesh. . _H*
Maybe I'm lucky about the places I've lived, but I don't see pedestrians very often stopping traffic needlessly. Occasionally there's the guy that looks homeless, maybe looks like he's not right in the head, exercising his right to the full, stepping right out into the street and crossing as slowly as he can. I like that guy. I feel momentary annoyance, but I quickly remind myself that he's teaching me patience, and learning patience lowers your blood pressure and reduces ulcers.
I've been told that, while yielding the right-of-way to a pedestrian is a requirement, you can resume driving as soon as the pedestrian passes. You needn't wait till he gets to the other side. As long as you're not impeding his progress, you have yielded. It helps a little bit, but once you've stopped, the (efficiency) damage has been done.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(hobbit @ Apr 2 2006, 03:16 AM) [snapback]233717[/snapback]</div> Where we live it depends on the crossing. Some crossings are marked for the pedestrians saying "Traffic does not stop!", other crossings are marked for drivers saying "Stop for pedestrians in cross walk." Other crossings have no indication who has the right of way. Pedestrians crossing against the signal or in unmarked locations are jay-walking and can be fined, but you still can't run them down (a somewhat bigger fine, I expect).
well we can construct a $300,000 pedestrian overhead walkway... there is a hikng/riding trail that has 2 of these in my town. there was a bill created to have the state pay for one...probably 10 times maybe...maybe more. dont actually know how many millions of dollars was wasted voting on the $300,000 walkway. eventually a grass roots movement was taken up by the father of a 10 year old boy who died trying to cross the road. in less than 6 weeks, the money was raised.
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Rick Auricchio @ Apr 2 2006, 12:53 PM) [snapback]233856[/snapback]</div> This will depend on individual state law. In WA you must wait until the pedestrian has cleared the lane next to yours. That is, there is a full lane seperating you from the pedestrian. Again, it will depend on your state. And since "ignorance of the law is no excuse," you should find out your own state's law if you don't want to risk a ticket.
I do understand your question (with your additions) Hobbit. And I go to lenghts to avoid making others stop for me as well. And when I'm in my EV, I'll accelerate harder than usual to avoid slowing down that Hummer that I'm attempting to merge with - I don't want him changing velocity any more than required! And as far as making it *less* convenient for pedestrians, I fully agree with what 404 said here: <div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(FourOhFour @ Apr 2 2006, 07:21 AM) [snapback]233746[/snapback]</div> If I were in charge of my town, I wouldn't even let people drive cars in the congested downtown area where all this pedestrian business would be a problem for cars. Screw it - get rid of the energy-wasting cars. Put up a bunch of parking lots all around the edge of town, and have people walk or bike for the rest of it. Energy problem and safety problem both solved for VERY little money.
i don't expect the first car coming to stop. i expect maybe one down a way to start slowing so he or she can stop in time.. nice and slowly.. maybe start with coasting, then slow down for me to cross. I also expect the car next to him to stop with thim. Once a car initiates a stop, all cars should. Now.. same goes for me driving. If i see someone in the crosswalk ahead, i'll slow down and make sure the car behind me does too. at times people just drive without paying attention and i don't want to be rear ended. when i start braking the car beside me usually does too. the prius lights are bright and well seen.
I can hardly believe what I'm reading. Safety, courteous driving, and obeying the law is way more important than energy conservation when it comes to appropriate action at the crosswalk. Last December I stopped for a pedestrian at a crosswalk. (Not abruptly. There was plenty of room and time.) An inattentive driver behind me (probably on his cell phone) slammed into the back of me, totaling my Prius and seriously messing up my back. You can bet that when I stop for pedestrians at crosswalks now, energy conservation is the last thing on my mind. Instead, I'm focused on the rear-view mirror hoping that the same scene won't repeat. PLEASE PAY ATTENTION and be safe at crosswalks.
^_^ Reminds me of the classic "image" of a Boy Scout helping a sweet old lady across the street. Now... If I can be a Boy Scout (and I was, although I never had occasion to help an old lady across the street), is it not logical to continue to be courteous and helpful to any pedestrian even though I'm driving my car?
