More Engine Oil Discussion - Magnatec?

Hi KiwiAL.
I am NOT the expert on this,
but apparently from Google I see the Magnatech is a dino lube oil with a smaller amount of synthetic additive, not used much in USA. Apparently there was an infamous USA court case where the judge somewhat inexplicably ruled (CASTROL?) could say (MAGNATEC?) was synthetic. So this prompted the current lube oil marketing terms like "fully synthetic" which I think means it is truly synthetic.

Many of us in USA use "fully synthetic" oils in our Prii such as Toyota brand or Mobil-1. Mobil-1 can be had in Walmart here for only $US 22.50 for 5-quarts (~=5 liters). So I do not think we in USA have too much market for a dino oil that claims to a little bit synthetic. Some countries if fully synthetic is too expensive, then maybe dino oil sounds good with good PR campaign. I don't think that approach works in USA due to cheap synthetics, and probably not too well in Europe where folks are willing to pay the extra cost for higher quality synthetics.

All the above just a guess as best I can see. Hope things are well in NZ, I had a chance to visit both Islands years ago. Since the Magnatech is apparently not available in the USA, via Amazon.com for example, we here can't tell you local reviews about it.

 

only one way to find out, controlled testing bob wilson style.

 

Your dealer probably said Penrite oil. You can look here
Synthetic Oils - Supercheap Auto New Zealand
. I would not bother with Magnatec as you can buy full synthetic oils for pretty much the same price here in NZ.

 

@KiwiAl, you can spend quite a while agonising over the various (but limited) choices of oil here.

I settled on Castrol Edge Fully Synthetic Engine Oil - 5W-30, 5 Litre which can be purchased from Repco when they run their discounts on oil. Recently you could pick up 5 litres for NZ$49.90.

I have just used it for the first time and I'm on my second tank since service, so the jury is out for the time being as to whether it has made any difference. The first tank was good, but the second not so much. As everyone knows, there are so many variables, it is hard to attach any benefit to any one thing.

Left to their own devices, dealers here will use 10W-40, which was used in my engine until now.

Certainly the best improvement I have had is some adjustment to nut behind the wheel.

 

I notice in the Supercheap Auto site they do not list a 0w20 oil. This really does save fuel in the UK climate that is not to dissimilar to that of NZ.

John (Britrius)

 

I have researched oils available here in NZ and can say that 0W-20 is as scarce as hen's teeth. When you do find it, it is also considerably more expensive. The oil that dealers use as standard is 10W-40 and according to the owner's handbook, that is acceptable.

Weather-wise, it depends where you are in NZ as there is a considerable difference in mean temperature at the extremes depending on whether you are in the north or south. To complicate things there are micro climates (e. g. inland in the South Island) where the temperature can drop to -5℃ (23℉) in the winter but go as high as the late 30's early 40's (~104℉) in summer, so in these areas you would need to choose your oil grade carefully.

Given the cost of 0W-20 in NZ, I'm not sure the economic benefit is there for us.

Presently I'm experimenting with 5W-30 fully synthetic (which is much more readily available), bearing in mind I've gone from 10W-40, and have no perceivable differences comparing before and after the service. I'm only on my second tank so I'm not drawing any conclusions as yet. I find I need to review quite a few tanks in Fuelly to ascertain a fuel economy trend.

I'll update when I'm confident there is a trend and it is attributable to the oil.

 

Just seen that SuperCheap have a today and tomorrow only special on the above - limit of 2 per customer:
Castrol Edge Engine Oil - 5W-30, 5 Litre
Was: $85.88 each
Now: $42.88 each ends 05/10/14

[EDIT:]
In US measures and currency:
Castrol Edge Engine Oil - 5W-30, 5.28 Quarts
Was: US$67.55 each
Now: US$33.73 each ends 10/05/14
(Exch rate NZ$1.00 = US$0.7866)
Prices include Goods & Services Tax (GST) of 15%.

 

I was just about to post that "heads up" here too. I picked up two of these today for the awesome price of $28 each. Good to see you getting a decent discount there in NZ too.

This is the oil I've been using for a while now. SCA runs specials on it fairly often, so I stock up and usually get it for under $50. Today's price of $28 is the best yet though.

I like this Edge 5w30 A3/B4 a lot more than the magnatec too. The A3/B4 euro rating is more about wear, deposits and stay in grade specs rather than a fuel economy. It's up toward the upper end (12 cSt and 3.5 HTHS minimum) of the 30 weight range, but I get very good fuel economy anyway, so that's a non issue to me.

My opinion is that manufacturers can make lots of colourful claims about the wonders of their products, but industry specs like ACEA A3/B4, A5/B5, dexos etc are only passed by running stringent tests, so that's the only real thing I'm interested in when looking at oil. I couldn't care less about all the "true synthetic" vs "bogus synthetic" arguments, and whether it's made out of unicorn tears or grubby crude. I'm interested in the performance of the end product, not what it's starting raw materials are, and it's the well recognised and well tested industry specs that tell me this.

That Castrol Edge 5w30 meets API SL, ACEA A3/A4, VW 502/505, MB 229.3/229.5 and BMW LL01. These are really good antiwear, deposit control and long life stay in grade specifications.

The Magnatec 5w30 fuel saver however carries no industry specs other than the API SN and ILAC GF5. These are good fuel economy specs, but not nearly as demanding for wear etc as the Edge's specs.

There's a really nice interactive chart that lets you compare the relative performance of the different manufacturer and industry specs on this site here: The Lubrizol Corporation

Take a look it's very interesting.

Edit: If that page doesn't load properly for you then click "select a specification" and then do a page reload. For some reason I've got to do that every time since they've updated that page.

 

Just thought I would add my thoughts on the use of Magnatec. Here in Australia it is cheaper than the fully synthetic options. I have used Magnatec for years and am a believer. Prior to getting my Gen 2 Prius, I had a Camry for 8-9 years and used Magnatec throughout- getting rid of it at 460,000 Km. The engine was untouched, and it still had normal oil usage, and did not smoke. I was originally convinced about the benefits of Magnatec after watching the research done at Castrol in the UK. This is available on the web. Now, what I do with the Prius is when first purchased I give it a Nulon treatment with an oil change, which is a long lasting pfte treatment. Then, at every oil change, I add about 70 mL of Nulon to the Magnatec to keep some pfte (teflon I think) in the system. I believe this to be a very good anti-wear regime. In Australia they did a well known trial on a V6 Falcon where they gave it a Nulon treatment, then drained the oil, and drove it non-stop from Melbourne to Sydney (approx. 800 Km), with no problems!

 

Hi David. Do you use the 10w40 magnatec in the Prius, or the newer 5W30. Around here the (5L) 10W40 is often on sale for $25 or less, while the newer 5w30 "fuel saver" stuff is almost always about double that price.

Anyway, I was wondering how well the Prius runs for you on 10W40, as most people here use 5w30 (and some even 0w20). Personally I don't think it is going to hurt at all in a warm climate, but just wondering if you've ever tested it against 5w30 for fuel economy?

 

Are people missing the point? I believe the OP is not about the viscosity or origin of the oil and more about the necessity of an ionic additive. I too have thought that magnetic oil might have great benefits for the HSD duty cycle. My concern is if the small forces of the ionic additive would be useless in the face of strong centrifugal forces of the spinning gearset.

 

Hi Al, it doesn't explicitly wait for oil pressure before firing, but it does crank the engine quite fast before firing. Fast enough to give oil pressure on those warm restarts, as long as you have oil present of course.

Another alternative to PTFE that's been well proven to be provide good surface bonding lubrication is MoS (moly sulphide). The Lubromoly MoS additive is pretty good in my opinion. Personally I'd much rather use this than any PTFE based product.

 

Hi uart,
the grade I've used is the 10W-40. I'll have to check whether the 5W-30 is available here. I haven't noticed, and it may be because the climate is warm here- rarely get frosts. the Prius runs fine, and no- i haven't done any comparisons with 5W-30.

 

Hi KiwiAl,
By the way, I'm a kiwi from way back- been over here for 35 years! I have had the car for about 8 months, and covered 22,000Km, all with the Nulon/magnatec combination. No data re low pressure rings, and I guess I'm assuming it will be OK with the Prius- no sign of any issues so far. That test I mentioned with the Nulon was done by the Nulon company, and they advertise it with their products.
Regarding starts with no or little oil pressure, I think that the Magnatec is designed for this situation. Have you checked out the Castrol UK website? There is an interesting trial there where they show the wear on camshaft lobes with & without Magnatec. Big difference. I guess camshafts may take a little time to get fed oil in most engines.

 

FWIW, the value of PTFE (Teflon) in engine oil is widely disputed. The manufacturer of Teflon, Dupont, doesn't recommend its application. If you can't get the manufacturer to back a product, what does that say about it?