Tensions concerning charging stations.

The irony is - a. PiP will get about the same range on either fuel 50mpg's. Gas - and a close equivalent on electricity (appx 3 miles kWh) so the PiP that uses a public charger only does so if there is a cost difference. between gas and electricity..
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OK - I'm checking in here as a driver of both cars. I still have my PHEV 2012 and I now commute in a Rav4 EV.
There are two factions here.
Right, and Heart.
As in, "I have the right to this charging station as much as the other guy" or "I have a heart. I GET that this guy/gal needs the charge to get anywhere, while I can also gas up my car in a pinch."

I'm the heart person. I never, ever stand on ceremony with the plugin because while I like to charge it and improve my mileage overall, I don't NEED the electricity to move. I will always defer to the EV who cannot go anywhere without the electric charge. Matter of fact, I never plug in the PHEV outside of my home or my work and everyone at work knows, with 3 Leviton chargers here, if we need them all at the same time, unplug me, no questions asked!

Nuff said.

 

With the ChargePoint stations I've seen that have the 110v outlet behind the door...what you say is true. You cannot remove the male end of the EVSE from the charging station...but you can unplug the cable from the car and stop the charging. This prevents someone from unplugging you and plugging in themselves. You must tap your card to allow the door to open to remove your plug.

On the 220v side once the EVSE is unplugged from the car a relay opens and does not close again until someone taps their card.

Mike

 

Philosophically, yes, if everyone does the right thing, that would be great. Bravo !! And yes, this philosophy worked great during the 1990's /early 2000's. Our company had several Chevy S10-EV's. EVERY occupied charge stall that I ever used ...whether occupied by a Chevy or a Ford, had a courtesy note left on it, stating in so many words, "feel free to unplug me (after 3pm or whatever) if you need to - and plug me back in when you're done.

It was great! Enter GM - strong-arming the local So Cal legislators that are aparently in their pockets (in essence). At GM's prompting legislation was drafted ( See AB 475 ) and eventually put into law that effectively makes it illegal to unplug a cooperative plugin ... even if they grant permission via a note.

GM Riles CA Electric-Car World (Again) Over AB475 'Charger Sharing' Ban

Thus, plugin owners are forced to leave the shopping mall or the work place, to move their car, just to do the right thing. Many charge stalls can accomodate 2 to 4 cars next to one EVSE. But that's of no benefit any more for those who'd share. GM ram-roded this law thru, without even thinking twice, "gee, I wonder if Ford, Tesla, Honda, Nissan, Mitsubishi or Toyota will go along with this". In stead, GM was apparently thinking, "screw the other companys". The only redeaming thing about this law is that private company lots, and municipal lots have the option to NOT post (required to be valid) it, and to NOT follow the law. Fortunately, only a few areas think GM's, "it's all about ME" legislation is a good idea. But it's sufficient to say ... this kind of corporate policy comes from selfish, small minded, grace lacking individuals. As the article points out, "The funny thing is, one of Chevrolet's slogans is 'It's more than a car, it's a community." Yea ... a community of one - trying to spread it's lack of cooperation. Sure, I share ... and maybe you share too ... but many won't. ergo tensions. One plugin site has a thread about inconsiderate use of the charge stall called, "Wall of Shame" ... encouraging members to post shots of offenders not plugged in ... fully charged but sitting there all day etc. It's a shame that some have to be shamed into doing what's right. Nuf said
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Some posters may have lost track of the original and initial posts on this thread. To recap, only one of the just two level 2 chargers is working at the Galleria. These are free charging stations, graciously provided by the City of Roseville. They do not belong to the Galleria. These stations are almost always occupied during normal business hours and there are lots of BEV and PHEVs that want to use them but they are usually occupied.

However, neither BEV nor PHEV “need” them. There are four level 2 ChargePoint stations within 4 miles of this currently one free station, but of course these are not free. Anyone want to guess how busy the pay stations are?

If you have a BEV or PHEV and are running low on EV juice, you can easily make it to one of these pay stations. Yes, it will cost you up to 5-10x you home rate as pointed out here, but in an emergency, that’s a small price to pay. And really, how often will that emergency come up to break the bank.

Using the Galleria as your personal charging spot whether you have a BEV or PHEV is no different. This is what “cheap” is and it’s disrespectful to the city that didn’t have to do this in the first place. BEV and PHEVs “need” to share these spots, first come, first serve, maybe a couple hours charge if busy (as it always is)...

 

A BEVer planning a trip which is out of his/her driving range relying on a free charge station down the road is a stupid one. And BEVers are not stupid, their awareness of driving range is the highest among all drivers.
Let's face it - they are there for the free electricity and as such they are no different from PHEVers.
A BEVer in distress will aim to a non-free station nearby where he has much more chance (at a cost).
The question if a free plug is worth fighting for is a completely different issue, I think there is no single objective answer to it.

 

I average about 160 EV MPGe and about 50 MPG. So no, it is not the same range on either fuel.

 

Yes but it takes you about 16 different trips to get your 160, but you can get your 50 all day and night!

 

$/mile wise at least at my electricity rates it's almost the same on kWh or gasoline.


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I think I'm averaging around 3:1 cost-wise.

 

Due to heavy taxation of gas in Israel, I am averaging 5:1 cost-wise.

 

Listen, MPG/e is a fiction. Although gasoline technically contains 32kwh worth of electricity - it takes between ¼ &½ of those kWh's to 'acquire' that (roughly) 1/3 of a gallon's worth of energy ( turning on what ratio of health costs, tax subsidies, military death costs to acquire - drilling, pumping, shipping piping maintenance of infrastructure, etc) just so you and I can acquire that 32kWh of gasoline energy. On the other hand electricity can be made from 100% renewables, although 1/2 of the country chooses not to for one reason or another. Don't fall for the heafty 160mpg/e deception , just because it's a cutesy ear tickling number - unless of course you like living with blinders. Gasoline cost you and I a lot more than what you pay at the pump in paper money. When you're honest and try to factor in all costs - the real cost of gasoline or electricity in a Prius gets you about the same distance down the road. That's all I'm saying. In short, that's a testimony to how great prius gas mileage actually is.
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I don't agree. It doesn't even pass a very simple thermodynamic test. When you drive a Prius using gas there is a large amount of waste heat....just touch the engine after driving for 15 minutes. Now drive for 15 minutes in EV and see how much waste heat there is. Almost none.
Of course this isn't in any way a definitive test or proof...but certainly a large percentage of the dollars spent on gas go toward just heating up the air, while in EV not so much.
EV driving is much more efficient, per mile.
And, of course, if you are driving a short distance, the Prius, on gas, isn't nearly as efficient.
Yes, the Prius on gas is better than pretty much all other cars on gas...and when using electricity is even more so.

Mike