1. Attachments are working again! Check out this thread for more details and to report any other bugs.

Reversed polarity... Now what?

Discussion in 'Generation 1 Prius Discussion' started by ramutremblay, Nov 7, 2013.

  1. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Any and all feedback + suggestions are appreciated.

    In short, I went traveling for 7 months. I unplugged the 12v and hv battery on our 2002 Prius before embarking. Naturally, upon returning the Prius would not turn over. I replaced all 38 cells in the hv with remanufactured gen2 cells from Ted Barcelon. I also replaced the 12volt w/ a used one from our 2004 Prius (which was regularly driven while I was gone).

    I accidentally reversed the polarity on the 12 volt and fried the 100 amp fuse along with three 15 amp fuses. Now that the fuses have been replaced, the car won't start. The dashboard lights turn on along with the main screen...I can also hear the electric battery humming, but when I go to turn the ignition to on, nothing happens.

    Also worth mentioning, prior to doing any of this work DTC's that showed up were: P3030, C1215, C1241, and C1259.

    After I rebuilt the hv, replaced blown fuses etc, the same DTC's came up.

    I'm wondering if the problem now has to do with the fact that the car was sitting too long, the polarities being reversed, or both. Any and all suggestions on what to search for and ways to evaluate the problem would be greatly appreciated!
     
  2. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,665
    15,664
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    Ok,

    Step one, use your Prius-aware scanner and see if you can communicate with each ECU. See what codes and status show. Strange as it may seem, the built-in, 'diag' screen may help identify what units are responding. I'm not an expert in this area but it is a good place to start. Someone else may have something handy.

    When you turn the car ON, what is the 12V voltage? There is a 125A, fusible link that is supposed to protect the 12V DC-to-DC inverter. If you see 13.8V or there about, you are lucky. But I've seen a blown, 12V converter (have one handy in fact) and blowing it up is pretty ugly (parts inside ugly with burnt leads.) Inverter replacement is the only known cure.

    Bob Wilson
     
    ramutremblay likes this.
  3. yotatoter

    yotatoter Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2011
    161
    43
    0
    Location:
    Ohio
    Vehicle:
    2001 Prius
    Model:
    I
    Your code 3030 indicates its one of your batteyr voltage sensing wires broken. What that means is remove the battery cover and look on the front side where all your sensing wires are attatched to the battery terminals. One of them will be broken . You have to look very close because they sometimes break in the orange case right next to the terminal itself. And yes the car will not start if one of these is broken.. PS your other codes i would not worry about at this point, they are most likely related to your car not starting.
     
  4. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    @yotatoter and bwilson4web Thank you for taking the time to respond. Can't wait to apply your suggestions. I'll keep you posted with what I find out.
     
  5. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    @ bwilson4web Are you sure it's a 125A fusible link connector? The 100A fusible link in the engine compartment was fried... but I replaced it (not an easy task due to the small space). Let me know?
     
  6. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    2013-11-07 17.14.19.jpg @ bwilson4web and @ yotatoter The DTC's are the same now (post polarity reversal and hv replacement) as they were before any of this started. Might the computer be giving "residual" codes?

    I ask because I put a new harness in the HV battery when I put the remanufactured cells in, so all sensing wires are brand new. Before I take the HV battery back out to search for a faulty sensing wire, I just thought I'd ask about "residual DTC's."

    P.S. If it helps any, here's a photo of what I see when I turn the ignition to on. The HV battery also releases a faint humming sound.

    2013-11-07 17.14.19.jpg
     
  7. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,665
    15,664
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus
    You're right:
    • 120A at battery
    • 100A at inverter
    Bob Wilson
     
  8. usnavystgc

    usnavystgc Die Hard DIYer and Ebike enthusiast.

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2011
    3,159
    989
    0
    Location:
    Tucson, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    Ramu,
    So the dtc's you have now are p3030, c1215, c1241 and c1259? The car should at least attempt to start with those codes, does it?
     
  9. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A

    It doesn't attempt to start. When I turn the ignition to start, I hear quick click and nothing happens.
     
  10. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    So I took off the cover and inspected the sensors. It has a brand new harness with new sensors and bus bars, so as anticipated none of the sensors are broken. What else might trigger P3030?
     
  11. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    All cells measure 7.6 or 7.7 volts. So cells seem to be good. I'm not sure where to go from here.... The car was sitting for 7 months undriven. Might the starter be the problem?
     
  12. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    When I turn the ignition to start the car, there is a single clicking sound coming from near the inside fuse box ( far left side of the dashboard). I've checked all the fuses, and all seem to be working fine. Any further ideas what the problem(s) might be?

    Thanks for your feedback!
     
  13. xpcman

    xpcman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2009
    1,302
    295
    0
    Location:
    California - SF Bay area
    Vehicle:
    2008 Prius

    Does any Prius generation even have a starter? I don't think so.
     
  14. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    I wasn't sure. I'm stumped then. This is quite the puzzler. Anybody else have any ideas on what to check/ look for?
     
  15. bwilson4web

    bwilson4web BMW i3 and Model 3

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2005
    27,665
    15,664
    0
    Location:
    Huntsville AL
    Vehicle:
    2018 Tesla Model 3
    Model:
    Prime Plus


    I would recommend getting a 'repair' scanner because it will show more metrics than a traditional scanner:
    • miniVCI - uses Windows XP although some report getting it work on more modern versions.
    • AutoEnginuity - a little more expensive, it has TechStream capabilities. Be sure and get the Toyota option.
    • TechStream Lite - the gold standard, some sort of 'rental' licensing, I don't have any experience with it.
    These scanners will show more details including the subcodes of the inverter. But I'd like you try one quick test:
    1. Try to start
    2. Turn back to IGN
    3. Try to start again
    There is an obscure signal that goes from the inverter back to the traction battery, safety interlock switch, and then to the HV ECU. When I say obscure, I'm not whistling Dixie as I've not been able to tell if it is AC or DC. Regardless, if it is broken or failed, the car will not initially start. But the second attempt after returning to IGN works.

    Bob Wilson
     
    yotatoter likes this.
  16. usnavystgc

    usnavystgc Die Hard DIYer and Ebike enthusiast.

    Joined:
    Jul 29, 2011
    3,159
    989
    0
    Location:
    Tucson, AZ
    Vehicle:
    2005 Prius
    Model:
    Four
    Is your battery interlock fully seated? This is for a Gen II. I don't have a pic for the Gen I but it should be similiar (see page 21-118).
     

    Attached Files:

  17. yotatoter

    yotatoter Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2011
    161
    43
    0
    Location:
    Ohio
    Vehicle:
    2001 Prius
    Model:
    I
    HHHHMMM,not sure where to tell you to look,but that code 3030 will prevent the car from starting. The only thing that i know will cause that is the sensing wires however you stated that you replaced them. I would check the harness plug where it gets plugged in to the ECU. Also you can take a multi meter and check for continuity between each wire at the plug and the other end of the wire where it hooks to the battery.. That is how I found mine..
     
  18. ramutremblay

    ramutremblay Junior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    22
    3
    0
    Location:
    Maui, Hawaii
    Vehicle:
    2004 Prius
    Model:
    N/A
    Update:

    Once of the cells had a nut missing. I discovered this while doing a visual inspection. I attached the nut over the bus bar and cell and wham-o... the car started. It's been driving like a charm ever since. Only thing is the emergency brake light and ABS light are illuminated on the instrument panel. The emergency brake is not depressed, so wondering what the issue could be.

    Thanks all for the wonderful feedback!
     
    yotatoter, Cristino and bwilson4web like this.
  19. ChapmanF

    ChapmanF Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2008
    24,912
    16,215
    0
    Location:
    Indiana, USA
    Vehicle:
    2010 Prius
    Model:
    IV
    Great news so far!

    It's possible your brake computer latched a trouble code while it knew there was a problem logged by the battery or hybrid-vehicle computer. (They have to keep track of each other's status to make regenerative braking work.) Or its possible the brake computer has some other issue.

    If your Prius-aware scanner hasn't been delivered yet, the brake computer is one of the computers with an alternate way you can read the trouble codes, by counting light blinks ... you could search the forum for TC CG blink.

    -Chap
     
    bwilson4web likes this.