BACK UP CAMERA FOR 2012 PRIUS two TOUCH SCREEN- NON NAV

Wes_33073 · May 16, 2013

our1vue said: ↑

Wes_33073,

A question. If I read all these forum entries correctly there are two ways the HU knows about the camera. One, it can sense the video signal on the Red wire. Two, it can sense the return voltage on the orange wire. In your test setup are you using the red wire or the orange wire ? LanLam in append #177 just hitched up the video signal to the red wire, connected the camera to a 12V source (blue wire) and everything worked.

The HU may act differently if it sees the return voltage on the orange wire. I know Dan4500 figured out that the orange wire was more than just a ground for the 6V white wire.
Click to expand...

Got ahold of a 2010 repair manual. Yes... My car is a 2013... but the 2010 was all I could find. The information appears to be relevant to my situation. Here is what I found:

The connector in the driver kickpanel with the 4 wires is called "LR1" and the connector in the headliner is called "VR1"

At LR1 connector in kick panel:
pin 32 is white and is "CA+"
pin 34 is red and is "V+"
pin 35 is black and is "V-"
pin 33 is orange and is "CGND"
========================================================
The notes below are valid only "with Rear View Monitor System"
========================================================
CGND: This is a SHIELD GROUND. Voltage to body should be below 1V
V-: This is a GROUND. Voltage to body should be below 1V

V+: TV camera image signal "when power switch on (IG) and shift lever in R".

CA+: TV camera power supply. Voltage to body should be between 5.5 and 7V "when power switch on (IG) and shift lever in R"
========================================================

So, it says CA+ should be ~6V when in reverse. What is doesn't say is, what voltage CA+ should be when NOT in reverse.

nelsc · May 16, 2013

Wes_33073 said: ↑

I checked my headliner plug, there were no pins in mine on the female side
Perhaps Nelsc's wires were jammed in against the male end of the plug, and held there by friction?
Click to expand...

No I looked at mine and the pins where in it.
Not sure why mine did or yours did not?

Yay123 · May 17, 2013

not a EE here.... but just want to ask if:

So something like this Camera
SONY CCD CAR REAR VIEW REVERSE CAMERA FOR TOYOTA PRIUS 2012

plus beatsonic harness
Beat-Sonic BCUS2 Back-up Camera Interface

may do the job?

Dan4500 · May 17, 2013

Yay123 said: ↑

not a EE here.... but just want to ask if:

So something like this Camera
SONY CCD CAR REAR VIEW REVERSE CAMERA FOR TOYOTA PRIUS 2012

plus beatsonic harness
Beat-Sonic BCUS2 Back-up Camera Interface

may do the job?
Click to expand...

Don't know about the camera as there was no link to it. Be careful with the Beatsonic cable. Looked it up and it has about $5 in parts. At retail. It speaks as being usable with 12 volt cameras. There is nothing to indicate it converts the 6 volts to 12 which would be necessary if the camera you list is 12 volts.

I found Beatsonic to be super inflated pricing. Worse than Toyota dealers. Also pulling the HU is not super tough but is a pain.

Wes_33073 · May 17, 2013

our1vue said: ↑

Wes_33073,
Having the camera on all the time is not a good thing. I'm sure it has a finite life, and running it anytime the car is on will make it not last as long. I can't believe the stock camera would be set up this way. I thought the 6V would only be sent when the car was placed in Reverse and turned off when it was taken out of Reverse (after the power up sensing is done). Wes_33073, what method were you going to use (ie relay, regulator, etc) ?
I think we need Dan4500 to do his magic again
Click to expand...

Got my 6VDC relay today, and everything is wired up and working fine.
I hooked up the voltmeter for further tests and, the 6V mystery is solved... my revised observations:

IF VIDEO SIGNAL IS NOT SENT TO HU:
Upon startup the 6V wire goes to 6V and then a few seconds later goes to 0V, and stays that way.

IF VIDEO SIGNAL IS SENT TO HU:
Upon startup the 6V wire goes to 6V and stays that way FOR ONE MINUTE. Then it goes to 0V.
Upon entering reverse, the 6V wire goes to 6V. Upon leaving reverse (entering drive, or park, etc) the 6V wire will stay at 6V FOR ONE MINUTE. Then it goes to 0V.
If you turn off the car, the 6V wire will go to 0V immediately.

Thanks again for everyone's help in getting this done!

our1vue · May 17, 2013

I just love happy endings

Chuck815 · May 23, 2013

Dan4500 said: ↑

Starting off, I don't intend to offend anyone, but in reading the prior posts, I think some of the "successful" installs result in the need for work arounds at power up, may be to supplemental displays, and/or continuous displays, whether on the HU or a supplemental display. I bought my first Prius in Sep 2012 and am a relative newby to Prius Chat. I goofed when signing up as a Three owner. I have a Two b/c I did not want to spend the $ for the GPS with its expensive updates. But I did want the backup cam. I joined this thread at about page 8 and have sifted through all pages and some several times. My solution is on page 10 and forward. Following is compilation of my contribution:

1. Get the set of Trim removal tools from Harbor Freight to remove the panels. On sale they are about $7. Well worth it. Make sure you don't lose any of the snap in fasteners. I broke the pins holding the back of the headliner, cost $2.00 each at the dealer to replace.
2. Make sure to pull the rubber strip out and over the external plastic trim strip across the back hatch when you replace it. This keeps rain from getting in behind it and messing up the installation and other Toyota stuff behind it. I used masking tape. There's another poster who used either grass trimmer line or heavy fishing line.
3. Use silicone lube (from a pool, home depot or auto supply store) to get the wires through the left rubber tube thingy. Silicone lube is more inert than petroleum lube and will not rot the tube or other wires. The tube is made of silicone rubber.
4. Willco planned to post the timing of the 6 volts and the video signals, etc. but never got around to it. I measured the sequences with a voltmeter and reported them somewhere around pages 8-10. When power button is pressed, 6 volts appears on the white wire. If a camera is present, the current from the 6 volts returns by flowing back into the orange wire, signaling the head unit to look for video on the red wire, with the black wire being the return for the video. The HU performs this inquiry and detection process in 3-4 seconds while the Toyota logo is displayed. If the 6 volt current doesn't show up returning on the ORG wire and/or the video doesn't show up on the red wire, the HU says no Backup Cam is present.
5. I did research the diode configuration and discovered its roots derived from postings in one of the Prius C forums. After some study, I could not figure how the posted circuit would work. Somewhere along the way, the diodes got reversed in the subsequently posted diagrams. I eventually studied the original diode circuit posting and determined that it could work if the operating parameters of the selected camera were within a certain envelop. Thus I could understand the reports of success with the diodes. I reported this also somewhere around pages 8-10.
6. As a EE, I dislike using relays so hence came up with the circuit on page 10. Relays, being mechanical do fail, although very infreqently. Solid state is more reliable. Additionally, a relay introduces another variable: the coil current, which depends on the size of the relay. Willco and I agree on the HU activation current levels being in the range of 150 milliamps. Some relays could draw this same amount of current. The solid state circuit uses only a miniscule amount of current beyond that of the camera's requirement. The relay coil current could affect detection or operation.
7. Thusly, what Willco did was to create a 6 volt camera (from a 12 volt) that works like the factory Toyota camera. His postings are on pages 12-14. Why they used a 6 volt camera is inexplicable unless the HU manufacturer forced it or Toyota just wanted to be obnoxious. Willco used surface mount techniques to modify his 12 volt camera which requires super eyesight and fine detail hand dexterity. Plus miniature tools. He went for the roof connection which is about as "factory install" as you can get. I congratulate Willco for his modification and installation.
8. My circuit posted on page 10 makes the 12 volt camera emulate a 6 volt camera. Thus it looks like a factory camera to the HU. I gave nelsc an alternate for the PNP transistor as the 2n2907. The MPS is harder to find. The transistors and resistors total less than a buck if you have electronics store close. The circuit board was another buck, but really is not necessary as you can use a plastic margarine tub lid to mount the components. (Use an ice pick to punch holes for the wires and leads.) I covered the board with plastic electrical tape (make sure no wires can contact the hatch metal) and wire tied it to the cable bundle in the hatch lid. Harbor Freight has a soldering kit including solder for about $12. Plenty of clearance behind the inside trim piece.
9. I ran the video cable and 2 other conducters to the driver kick panel. The camera came with a video cable (yellow RCA plugs, each end) with a third red conductor (wire lead ends). Rather than cutting the RCA plugs off, I added a female RCA jack at the kick panel to the red and black wires. Connected the red conductor to the white wire to carry the 6 volts back to the circuit and I added an additional long wire (stranded 22 guage) to connect the ORG wire to the emitter of the 2n2222.
10. Last, connect the 12volt (2n2907 emitter (arrowhead) to the lt Blue wire at the rear wiper motor. It's always hot ( ON) so be careful not to have any tools like the solder iron connected to the Prius chassis. To be absolutely safe, disconnect the 12 volt battery or remove the fuse for the wiper.
11. Reconnect, reassemble, and enjoy. Make sure to pull the rubber strip back over to trim piece. It's easy to forget this and just put the trim piece over the rubber. If you break the headliner pins, they are $2.00 at Toyota dealer.
12. I decided to use the 4 connections as Toyota intended. Some have reported success with three wires. But I recall the comment "so what if its on all the time". It may be possible to share the video return with the power return, but I did not want to risk too far from the emulation. Also the reports of being always "ON" suggest that the battery may be draining continuously. The wiper connect point is always ON. Both Willco and my circuit are OFF with Power down since they are controlled by the 6 volt line. The relay also should cut everything off.
13. Using the relay may be okay, but it's additional current draw takes it out of a close emulation of the factory camera. As described earlier, both Willco's and my installs look just like a factory camera to the HU.
14. Rather than reposting diagrams and photos , I refer you all to page 8 and onward of this thread. I'm almost to the point of wanting to turn the camera On to catch the tailgaters when stopped at a red light. Too bad the Prius ICE turns off so I can't get em to suck my exhaust.
Again, I do not want this posting to be taken as a rant. I intend only to clarify why I (and Willco) did what we did. This is a great resource and the Prius has been an extremely satisfying purchase. For those who followed this thread closely, we did stop the legislation, and I'm still working on getting Torque (monitor app) running.

dan4500.
Click to expand...

Firephoenix1980 · May 24, 2013

Dan4500 said: ↑

Starting off, I don't intend to offend anyone, but in reading the prior posts, I think some of the "successful" installs result in the need for work arounds at power up, may be to supplemental displays, and/or continuous displays, whether on the HU or a supplemental display. I bought my first Prius in Sep 2012 and am a relative newby to Prius Chat. I goofed when signing up as a Three owner. I have a Two b/c I did not want to spend the $ for the GPS with its expensive updates. But I did want the backup cam. I joined this thread at about page 8 and have sifted through all pages and some several times. My solution is on page 10 and forward. Following is compilation of my contribution:

1. Get the set of Trim removal tools from Harbor Freight to remove the panels. On sale they are about $7. Well worth it. Make sure you don't lose any of the snap in fasteners. I broke the pins holding the back of the headliner, cost $2.00 each at the dealer to replace.
2. Make sure to pull the rubber strip out and over the external plastic trim strip across the back hatch when you replace it. This keeps rain from getting in behind it and messing up the installation and other Toyota stuff behind it. I used masking tape. There's another poster who used either grass trimmer line or heavy fishing line.
3. Use silicone lube (from a pool, home depot or auto supply store) to get the wires through the left rubber tube thingy. Silicone lube is more inert than petroleum lube and will not rot the tube or other wires. The tube is made of silicone rubber.
4. Willco planned to post the timing of the 6 volts and the video signals, etc. but never got around to it. I measured the sequences with a voltmeter and reported them somewhere around pages 8-10. When power button is pressed, 6 volts appears on the white wire. If a camera is present, the current from the 6 volts returns by flowing back into the orange wire, signaling the head unit to look for video on the red wire, with the black wire being the return for the video. The HU performs this inquiry and detection process in 3-4 seconds while the Toyota logo is displayed. If the 6 volt current doesn't show up returning on the ORG wire and/or the video doesn't show up on the red wire, the HU says no Backup Cam is present.
5. I did research the diode configuration and discovered its roots derived from postings in one of the Prius C forums. After some study, I could not figure how the posted circuit would work. Somewhere along the way, the diodes got reversed in the subsequently posted diagrams. I eventually studied the original diode circuit posting and determined that it could work if the operating parameters of the selected camera were within a certain envelop. Thus I could understand the reports of success with the diodes. I reported this also somewhere around pages 8-10.
6. As a EE, I dislike using relays so hence came up with the circuit on page 10. Relays, being mechanical do fail, although very infreqently. Solid state is more reliable. Additionally, a relay introduces another variable: the coil current, which depends on the size of the relay. Willco and I agree on the HU activation current levels being in the range of 150 milliamps. Some relays could draw this same amount of current. The solid state circuit uses only a miniscule amount of current beyond that of the camera's requirement. The relay coil current could affect detection or operation.
7. Thusly, what Willco did was to create a 6 volt camera (from a 12 volt) that works like the factory Toyota camera. His postings are on pages 12-14. Why they used a 6 volt camera is inexplicable unless the HU manufacturer forced it or Toyota just wanted to be obnoxious. Willco used surface mount techniques to modify his 12 volt camera which requires super eyesight and fine detail hand dexterity. Plus miniature tools. He went for the roof connection which is about as "factory install" as you can get. I congratulate Willco for his modification and installation.
8. My circuit posted on page 10 makes the 12 volt camera emulate a 6 volt camera. Thus it looks like a factory camera to the HU. I gave nelsc an alternate for the PNP transistor as the 2n2907. The MPS is harder to find. The transistors and resistors total less than a buck if you have electronics store close. The circuit board was another buck, but really is not necessary as you can use a plastic margarine tub lid to mount the components. (Use an ice pick to punch holes for the wires and leads.) I covered the board with plastic electrical tape (make sure no wires can contact the hatch metal) and wire tied it to the cable bundle in the hatch lid. Harbor Freight has a soldering kit including solder for about $12. Plenty of clearance behind the inside trim piece.
9. I ran the video cable and 2 other conducters to the driver kick panel. The camera came with a video cable (yellow RCA plugs, each end) with a third red conductor (wire lead ends). Rather than cutting the RCA plugs off, I added a female RCA jack at the kick panel to the red and black wires. Connected the red conductor to the white wire to carry the 6 volts back to the circuit and I added an additional long wire (stranded 22 guage) to connect the ORG wire to the emitter of the 2n2222.
10. Last, connect the 12volt (2n2907 emitter (arrowhead) to the lt Blue wire at the rear wiper motor. It's always hot ( ON) so be careful not to have any tools like the solder iron connected to the Prius chassis. To be absolutely safe, disconnect the 12 volt battery or remove the fuse for the wiper.
11. Reconnect, reassemble, and enjoy. Make sure to pull the rubber strip back over to trim piece. It's easy to forget this and just put the trim piece over the rubber. If you break the headliner pins, they are $2.00 at Toyota dealer.
12. I decided to use the 4 connections as Toyota intended. Some have reported success with three wires. But I recall the comment "so what if its on all the time". It may be possible to share the video return with the power return, but I did not want to risk too far from the emulation. Also the reports of being always "ON" suggest that the battery may be draining continuously. The wiper connect point is always ON. Both Willco and my circuit are OFF with Power down since they are controlled by the 6 volt line. The relay also should cut everything off.
13. Using the relay may be okay, but it's additional current draw takes it out of a close emulation of the factory camera. As described earlier, both Willco's and my installs look just like a factory camera to the HU.
14. Rather than reposting diagrams and photos , I refer you all to page 8 and onward of this thread. I'm almost to the point of wanting to turn the camera On to catch the tailgaters when stopped at a red light. Too bad the Prius ICE turns off so I can't get em to suck my exhaust.
Again, I do not want this posting to be taken as a rant. I intend only to clarify why I (and Willco) did what we did. This is a great resource and the Prius has been an extremely satisfying purchase. For those who followed this thread closely, we did stop the legislation, and I'm still working on getting Torque (monitor app) running.

dan4500.
Click to expand...

Thanks Dan for your great write up, I do have to admit that the whole relay conversation still confuses me, I know I need one and diagrams are posted but I can't seem to wrap my head around it, let alone build one from scratch, it's quite frustrating for someone who doesn't really have technical expertise like me.

our1vue · May 25, 2013

FirePhoenix1980,
Dan4500 (and others) have been great in figuring out what the Prius is doing and how to hitch up the camera. It turns out, there are more than 1 way to get a rear view camera to work. Depending on how "technically challenged" you are may lead you to choose one method over another. The easiest is to get a 6V camera from a old prius and use that.
The next step up is the 12V camera and the 6V relay. I think they sell solid state relays that will eliminate the need for you to build your own. But it think it is cheaper to build your own (with Dan's instructions). The next step up is to get a 3.3V camera and make 6V to 3.3V converter. Turns out it is easy to convert 6V to 3.3V than to convert 6V to 12 V. The converter only contains 3 parts and should be easy to build (at least I thought it was pretty easy once I saw one built)
To tell the truth, I'm more worried about being able to remove all the interior panels than do the wiring.

Firephoenix1980 · May 26, 2013

Thanks our1vue, since I already have the 12v camera I will try to do the relay option (store bought) but even those are confusing, I saw this in a post earlier, I just want to make sure it's right for this as it says 5v relay:
5VDC/1A SPDT Micro Relay : Micro Relays | RadioShack.com

our1vue said: ↑

FirePhoenix1980,
Dan4500 (and others) have been great in figuring out what the Prius is doing and how to hitch up the camera. It turns out, there are more than 1 way to get a rear view camera to work. Depending on how "technically challenged" you are may lead you to choose one method over another. The easiest is to get a 6V camera from a old prius and use that.
The next step up is the 12V camera and the 6V relay. I think they sell solid state relays that will eliminate the need for you to build your own. But it think it is cheaper to build your own (with Dan's instructions). The next step up is to get a 3.3V camera and make 6V to 3.3V converter. Turns out it is easy to convert 6V to 3.3V than to convert 6V to 12 V. The converter only contains 3 parts and should be easy to build (at least I thought it was pretty easy once I saw one built)
To tell the truth, I'm more worried about being able to remove all the interior panels than do the wiring.
Click to expand...

our1vue · May 26, 2013

Firephoenix1980,
I think we need some EE help for that question. Maybe Wes_33073 can tell us what relay he used. Looking at that relay it says its max operating temp is 55 degrees F. That seems a little low for a car application. One other thing to consider is that this is a mechanical relay not a solid state relay. A solid state relay has no moving parts to wear out unlike a mechanical relay. With a mechanical relay, you may need to replace it in a few years. Of course if you're unlucky your solid state relay could burn out. But in theory the solid state should last longer.

Wes_33073 · May 27, 2013

our1vue said: ↑

Firephoenix1980,

I think we need some EE help for that question. Maybe Wes_33073 can tell us what relay he used. Looking at that relay it says its max operating temp is 55 degrees F. That seems a little low for a car application. One other thing to consider is that this is a mechanical relay not a solid state relay. A solid state relay has no moving parts to wear out unlike a mechanical relay. With a mechanical relay, you may need to replace it in a few years. Of course if you're unlucky your solid state relay could burn out. But in theory the solid state should last longer.
Click to expand...

Relay I used was a 6V relay from Newark.com, catalog number 1432873-1
1432873-1 - TE CONNECTIVITY / POTTER & BRUMFIELD - AUTOMOTIVE RELAY, SPDT, 6VDC, | Newark. It is 6V with low coil resistance (22.5 Ohm). Not sure what the factory camera would draw, but certainly more than 0.27 Amps.

For the relay socket / quick-connect, already had a few laying around from parts-express, sorry I don't have a part number. You will want one with a voltage suppression diode or resistor.

Wes_33073 · Jun 3, 2013

Discovered a small consideration when using the relay method...

The camera check happens when the car is turned on, OR when the car is put into accessory mode. Whichever comes first.

So... if you put the car into accessory mode, the 6V wire goes to 6V. This flips the relay, as usual. BUT, since the blue windshield wiper wire does NOT go to 12V at this time, the camera won't power up and the camera signal check will fail. When you later turn the car on, the rear camera won't show up on the screen.

Not a really big deal, because it is likely that 99.9% of the time you will turn the car ON without first going to accessory mode. Full functionality can be had by (a) modifying the voltage regulator and not using the relay as discussed elsewhere in this thread, or (b) using a different 12V line that is active in Accessory and ON mode.

bendersae · Jun 5, 2013

our1vue said: ↑

Willco,
I don't know how you can see a surface mount resistor, let alone solder them. You must have good eyes
and a steady hand. I made (with help) a 3.3v regulator with "normal size" components.
Click to expand...

What are the "normal size" components? Any advantages to this design over using the simple regulator (with diode) from Willco?

our1vue · Jun 5, 2013

bendersae,
I don't know the correct name for my "normal size" components. It is the way they used to make electronic stuff in the 1970's. To work with surface mount technology, you need tweezers and magnifying glasses. My regulator components are easy to handle by hand and no magnifying glasses are needed (well maybe reading glasses if you are over 40 .
I thought the regulator method was more energy efficient than the diode, but not being an EE I'm probably completely wrong. Hopefully Willco or Dan4500 can give a definitive answer on diode vs regulator.
Note: size of my regulator in the picture is 1" wide by 2.5 " long.

Dan4500 · Jun 7, 2013

our1vue said: ↑

bendersae,
I don't know the correct name for my "normal size" components. It is the way they used to make electronic stuff in the 1970's. To work with surface mount technology, you need tweezers and magnifying glasses. My regulator components are easy to handle by hand and no magnifying glasses are needed (well maybe reading glasses if you are over 40 .
I thought the regulator method was more energy efficient than the diode, but not being an EE I'm probably completely wrong. Hopefully Willco or Dan4500 can give a definitive answer on diode vs regulator.
Note: size of my regulator in the picture is 1" wide by 2.5 " long.
Click to expand...

The regulator is more efficient. But the additional power used with the Zener diode circuit is small and it's only when in reverse. The values given are well within the operating ranges of the components. No issues either way.

sang kang · Jun 10, 2013

Hello, Just to clarify things. The HU looks for the video input and not the 6V power? If this is the case then why not tap a 12V camera to the backup light and let the video signal be sent to the HU?

our1vue · Jun 10, 2013

sang kang,
The problem with that is the HU checks for video when the car is powered on. Normally the car is in Park when it is
powered on, so the backup lights would be off. So, no power from backup lights means no video signal and the HU thinks there is no camera.

sang kang · Jun 10, 2013

our1vue said: ↑

sang kang,
The problem with that is the HU checks for video when the car is powered on. Normally the car is in Park when it is
powered on, so the backup lights would be off. So, no power from backup lights means no video signal and the HU thinks there is no camera.
Click to expand...

Then why can't the cigarette light's power be sent to the rear 12v camera to power it when the car turn on?

our1vue · Jun 10, 2013

sang kang,
You could hitch up the camera to a power source that is on when the car is on and that would work to tell the HU there is a camera attached. The problem with that is the camera would always be on when the car is on. I don't
know how many hours the camera is designed to last, but I would bet it would last a lot longer if it is turned on only when the car is in reverse vs all the time the car is on.

BACK UP CAMERA FOR 2012 PRIUS two TOUCH SCREEN- NON NAV

Wes_33073 Junior Member

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BACK UP CAMERA FOR 2012 PRIUS two TOUCH SCREEN- NON NAV

Wes_33073 Junior Member

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camwire.png

LR1.png

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