plug in kits (fading away?)

mm so a123 is bankcrupped...

what about the china party?

 

Please move the Nissan Leaf talk to a new thread? Good discussion, but kind of clutters up this thread.
I'd like to stay on topic about PHEV kits.

NortTexSalv04Prius, I think you are on the right track that the overall components are still expensive, so there is no good way to make a kit low cost. Sometimes it's worth it to pay $400 for a BMS, rather than $150. Or A few hundred for a charger rather than sub-$100. As you mention, most of the systems still rely on third party parts.

I still believe there is a market for PHEV products, but I don't think we'll see prices as low as Enginer had them. I think we will see beefed up, or more reliable parts in future systems, which is a good thing.

PlugInSupply is still out there for people who want to self install.

I'm watching what is coming out of the 3ProngPower / Boulder Hybrid Conversion shop. (3Prong Power - Plug In Hybrid Conversion Kits) These guys have been doing conversions for a long time and have an installer's perspective when it comes to making sure the systems will satisfy customer's needs and expectations.

 

is it not more +1000 plus for a BMS and 500+ for a charger..

that makes a lot more then sub100 and 400

 

You can buy a $405 BMS for Enginer kit from Pacific EV
Electric Vehicle Parts --- PHEV BMS -- Simple BMS for bicycles and Enginer Plug-In Prius Kits

I'm willing to concede that a better charger choice would be more near $500.

 

A cellogs bms?



-Tapatalk

 

Over on Ecomodder member, Daox, put this together quite a while ago for his Enginer system.
He had one of the earlier Enginer system that came without a BMS, so he made his own.

DIY open source lithium BMS (battery management system) - Fuel Economy, Hypermiling, EcoModding News and Forum - EcoModder.com

 

I have had my pack in operation since November of 2007. I charge it daily. It only has 30000 miles on it. It's driven daily around the streets of San Francisco.

 

That's nice to hear, means you have close to 2000 charges on the pack so far. Do you do full charges everyday or just partial charges, and 5 days a week or 7. Thanks for responding-

Ron W.

 

Plug-in Autos Ltd. (UK) have announced a 3 year warranty batteries in their kit!

Here is a detailed report for the well initiated:

The MD-Tech kit has been performing problem free since deliveries were taken in June 2013. Reliability has been a wait and see issue. I, like many holding their breath, am beginning to turn blue. A lot of hard work had been done on the BMS and converter power output to get this kit working. But wait and see has been the best test. Many have "thrown the towel in" on MD-Tech's earlier efforts but they kept working at it. IMHO Enginer went to market too early without enough testing. This is not the case with the European release. Testing procedures were documented and all changes were non-regression tested. QC procedures have also been tightened up.

MD-Tech have no market presence in the US, this is where Enginer came in. MD-Tech sell 99% of their products to their domestic market and don't venture far. Business cultures are different but that did not mean they could not be changed. One of the ways progress has been made is in the BMS, with 0.002V accuracy, see here:

.
After that was done it made sense to review HVC and LVC voltages (Charge cut off and Discharge cut off). These play an important role in the trade-off between performance (power output), versus battery life. In line with current Li-ion philosophy by reducing HVC at 3.500V (for a single cell) and 2.750V for LVC battery longevity can been increased.

MD-tech are currently looking for a distributor in the US. The Kit is electronically different to Enginer now, who have gone their own way. There are no copyright and no patent issues, although Jack likes to claim these, Enginer have no patents on this kit and no legal case has been presented.

Over the later part of the European Summer there have been no reports of any overheating Converters shutting off power. Many internal component changes and re-designs have led to this better performance. Airflow was not the only issue. In fact the box fans have been removed as they have been found to be unnecessary with the new Converter.

Power output is 4500W at 225V (20A) which is an impressive 20% power increase over earlier versions. Anyone having driven a 15A max. kit, knows how much better the kit would perform with 5 more amps.

I have been holding my breath too, but on seeing a little blue coloration in my cheeks I am happy to announce I have taken a deep breath as things are going well.

Whoever picks up the ball in the US will need to have some stock as spare parts. As this is what many people are looking for in older kits. Just be aware that the battery to BMS connectors have changed as well as the battery temperature sensors which are digital now and also Converter output plugs, which are now Anderson pole connectors (suited for the power rating). One of many internal changes, the 12V Converter power relay has been replaced. I am not going to go through all the changes but there are many internal and some external such as the inline fuse. Which is now at the Converter end and not at the Battery end in line with standard Engineering philosophy on this issue. It is now easier to reach, although rated at 25amps none have blown.

The BMS now has a very handy internal clock. We decided to turn balancing on every 15 Days. The balancing algorithm looks for a delta of 10mV between the Hi cell and the Lo cell, it then balances to within 5mV. Balancing mode remains on for 24 hours. Just to clarify 10mV is 0.01V, this is the trigger for balancing on every 15th day. With the BMS 2mV tolerence this keeps things pretty tight. The BMS clock is also used to write data to the SD card creating a new files every 24 hours, taking system snapshots every 30 seconds. The SD card is located in he BMS module and does not need to be removed regularly. The BMS Display has a touch screen and shows all cells on one screen, as well as Amps out and Voltage out which is useful for configuring the Converter ouptut.

European kits are now shipped with an OBDII bluetooth scanner, see threads on the Smartpone App: Torque Control for setting this up.

Sush

Plug-in Autos - Griesheim, Germany - Automotive | Facebook
Plug-in Hybrid Conversions - Plug-in Autos
Electric Car Conversion | Simple and Easy

 

As one of the original installers I have been watching your progress with interest. I have continued to keep the lines of communication for when this market picks up again.
Last week we were discussing acquiring some new units from overseas. Would love to have a kit available for customers that is rock-solid reliable.
In the meantime I continue to support customers as best I can.

M470BSA ?

 

I too have followed the progess of pc poster sush ...
I would like to see a youtube video of the componets and/or kit that is being marketed in the EU
One question for MD/Tech would be is the new Charger/BatteryManagementSystem based on a top balance method of battery pack.??

 

- Kit Video.
The Kit is shown in the first minute of this video. It is the old style box. We are working on a Universal Box Model that will fit the Auris Hybrid, and the Nissan Leaf. The new box will use some of the tire well space for the converter and charger. with a battery tray running over the tire well space across the top, there is a preview here:
Plug-in Autos - Griesheim, Germany - Automotive | Facebook

Balancing is switched on for 24 hours, on every 15th day. You may see bottom balancing and top balance during this period, in times of use. I have not seen any significant Hi-Lo voltage differences in the pack with HVC at 3.500V and LVC at 2.750V. A Balance check can be done once a month but we decided to go do it every two weeks to fix any minor performance issues due to a hi lo cell difference of 10mV. I have seen a 0.010mV Hi-Lo difference over two weeks. After the automated balancing ran for a day, I observe a different Lo cell, it is not always the same cell. This is good news. It indicates that I do not have a weak cell in the pack. Remember that a "cell" is not actually one cell in this kit, it is four cells in parallel. There is natural balancing between these cells that occurs constantly.