Hydrogen Fuel Cell on my Prius gives me 65mpg+ going 65mph

And how much do you pay for the hydrogen?

 

My best guess this thing generates Hydrogen gas that is added to the air intake.

From their web site:

Aarmourcharge® can be ingested before and after use without causing physical internal damage.

Service is required every 6,000-10,000 miles. Systems will need to be flushed and replaced with new Aarmourcharge. Only authorized and trained technicians are allowed to service and install the fuel cell systems. Customers are never allowed to install, tamper, alter or service their purchased systems unless proper authorization and training has been recieved from a Bionom Tech, Aarmourtherm® Foundation, or an Auto Green Tech representative.
This will ensure that the conversion of your vehicle into a Muti-Blend Hybrid is accomplished with your safety being #1.

 

So it is not using the definition of a hydrogen fuel cell that the rest of the world uses?

Fuel cell - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

but in fact is Electrolysis?

Electrolysis of water - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

"Aarmourcharge® can be ingested before and after use without causing physical internal damage."

It's water.

 

yup. electricity plus water = hydrogen with much less potential energy than the amount of electricity initially consumed = stupendous mileage

65 mpg at 65 mph on a gen 3 isn't particularly unusual is it? My Gen 2 cruises at 55-60mpg at that speed.

Rob

 

I know, I know, its all in the Brown's gas and whirling vortex of power

 

Total NONSENSE .. I can do this without any hydrogen cell ...

bullshit ...

But if you BELIEVE this good for you ... I live an NYC and have a killer deal on the Brooklyn bridge ...

Please share with us where did you get this fuel cell and how much did you pay ...

YOUR mpg is due to your driving not the fuel cell at all !!! actually 65 MPH is better then the slow lane in most cases

Also can you share what degree(s) you have liberal art ??? or something ???

Here is a quote from the website of this product :

"All systems run under ten (10) amps.
Thomas J Brundige, owner and lead scientest at Aarmourtherm® Foundation invented our non-toxic, biodegradable, safe for the environment Aarmourcharge® stabilizer. This is the liquid we use in the electrolysis process to generate our powerful HHO FREE dry hydrogen fuel."

See the misspelled word of "scientist" (that is so he can never be sued as a scientist) and after this YOU bought something from them ... I guess you also dig the snake story ...

 

Is it April already?

 

I guess I missed something..

 

OHHHHH!!! I get it now!!!

 

Based on the info here:
http://www.nrel.gov/docs/fy06osti/40605.pdf
a high class (ie big & expenssive) commercial electrolyzer uses about 53.4 - 70.1 kWh to produce 1kg of hydrogen. A cheap unit is almost certainly less efficient than this, but we'll just assume its an amazing product.

Based on the info here:
Energy density - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Hydrogen gas has a specific energy of 141.86 MJ/kg, or 39.4kWh/kg.

So right off the bat we're in trouble. Electrolysis uses 35.5-77.9% more energy to make the Hydrogen than the resulting energy contained in the Hydrogen.

The next problem is that burning hydrogen is a very inefficient way to extract its potential energy. At best a specially tuned hydrogen ICE might achieve 40% efficiency, but injected into a standard gas ICE it will be no more efficient than the typical ~20% or so. It could actually be worse as the fuel mix is not necessarily well matched, but we'll ignore that.

So at 20% efficiency, we can extract 39.4 * 0.2 = 7.88kWh/kg of energy from the Hydrogen by burning it in an ICE.

That brings us to the production volume. The add states <10A power consumed on a 12V system. So that's 120W. Cruising at 60mph, 120W * 1 hr / 60 mph = 2Wh/mi of electricity consumed. Using the above production rates, that will produce 0.0187 - 0.0285 grams of hydrogen per mile. When injected into the ICE and combusted, that will yield about 0.147 - 0.22 Wh of drive power per mile.

So in a vehicle cruising at 200-250 Wh/mi, we're using an extra 2Wh/mi to get back an extra 0.147-0.22Wh/mi. That obviously won't boost your mileage, but could technically degrade it by ~1%.

Now the salesmen are smart enough to know that, so they claim its all about how the (very, very, very small amount of) hydrogen produced mixes with the gasoline to make it burn more efficiently. While not impossible, to my knowledge this has never been demonstrated and verified in an independent, controlled test facility running before and after load efficiency maps. My guess is it never will be either. Instead we get a lot of anecdotal evidence by folks who see amazing results without realizing that their way of driving the car differently trying to get great results are probably responsible for all the observed improvements.

Rob

 

Let me just run some numbers here to demonstrate that EVEN if you were right and this device would do what you claim it does ...

$450 today buys over 100 gallon gas. just let start with 100 gallon

Let's try to calculate how long you will have to drive to save this much gas...

Let see if you start with 55 mpg without the device and it gains 5 mpg making it 60mpg

10,000 miles @55 180 gal @60 166 difference 14 gal
20,000 miles @55 360 gal @60 333 difference 27 gal
...
50,000 miles @55 909 gal @60 833 difference 75 gal
getting there right ???

so about 70,000 miles will get your money back (I ignored the "recharge fees" which would be at least another $350 !! )

Look if we use the recharge YOU NEVER get your money back kapish ??



let just see another from 50 to 55 change (this would presume that at lower mpg the device is better why of course no clue)

10,000 miles @50 200 gal @55 180 gal difference 20 gal
...
50,000 miles @50 1000 gal @55 909 gal difference 91 about the magic 100 gal (additional $250 ignored)


According to your record your yearly gas would be about 200 gal which means you drive around 11k a year so you never going to make it !!!!

So even if this was not snake oil, why on earth would anyone buy this unless they drive 40k a year ???

But again dear OP just BELIEVE! Facts, science and reasoning are for pussies just BELIEVE the "scientest" whatever that means.

By the way you seem to be novice in this, your MPG increase is DUE to seasonal change your log start Dec 2011 and little by little get better wonder device installed in the spring "increasing" your mpg (warmer weather did that !!! coupled with more practice)

 

It would have been nicer to have turned on the car's cruise control to hold a constant 65 mph and see less throttle manipulation. It is hard to tell if the 65 mpg readings you are getting are due to running the speed up to 70 mph and slowly throttling down or if you are going downhill, downwind etc.

But, I will agree with the basic premise that if you are traveling at 65 mph on flat terrain with no tail wind, I would not expect mpg's > 65 mpg, and closer to the 55 - 60 mpg range on the display.

 

If any device installed in a motor vehicle would increase mpg's the
car manufactures world wide would use it. As it is now car manufactures
would nearly sell their first born to get another 1 mpg.......

Car manufactures invest billions of dollars in research and
development to improve efficiency in their vehicles.

For the most part don't expect someone working in their garage with
a six pack to come up with a device that gets a 30% improvement
in fuel mileage.

 

Driving 65 mph in warm weather, non ethanol gasoline, no passengers, dry smooth roads, with a slight decline in elevation it would be a snap to achieve 65 mpg "indicated" at 65 mph with a stock prius.

I am sure other members in this forum can attest to this...

 

Yep,

Been there, done that.

DBCassidy