How will the Chevrolet Volt be better than a Toyota Prius plug-in hybrid?

And that would be cherry picking. You can't just exclude sales elsewhere or disregard the fact that sales only recently began.

US total for Volt: 13,048

European total for Ampera: ?

US & Japan total for PHV: 7,300

 

Can too

 

wow, I still can't believe some are getting 100 MPG for a $32,000 car. that's awesome. talk about the future is now to reduce gasoline use. So...when will the Volt be affordable...for the masses that can take $7500 tax break?

 

I have done the same, and use regular in a lawnmower that calls for midgrade. An older John Deere. It started getting tempermental. Likely from the ethanol loosening dirt in the tank and clogging the carb. I found two cycle engines less forgiving.

But these engines are simple machines compared to a car's, with compression ratios of 6:1 to 8.5:1. Most new, regular fueled cars are close to 10:1. By their design, lawn equipment engines are more tolerable of low octane fuel.

 

Really? I guess we see different aspects of the industries. Both computer and auto industries have lots of awards based technology. The Volt has won dozens of national/international awards.. how many has the PiP won?

I would agree there some balance with price, at least within price categories. 100,000 cars are expected to be better than 35000 cars which are expected to be better than 20,000. But a price difference of 5%, is not enough to overcome significant technology differences. ( 5% can be within price negotiation)

 

Is there a source for monthly statistics, broken out by USA and Europe? It seems like both models have suffered sales volatility, as the PHV is brand new with a large backlog of pre-orders, while the Volt had the crash-test/fire issue to overcome.

Neither of these cars is a corporate winner at these production levels, sad to say.

 

Okay did I miss something? Is the Prius PHV just the regular Prius (unlike the Prius C and Prius V)? Does anyone have the Prius V yet, and what is the gas MPG like on it? I have a 07 Matrix, and I want to switch to the Prius V when they are at least 3 years old because that is when they have lost most of the value dollars.

On that note, the Volt is North American, and the Prius being Toyota is originally Japanese, and being that Toyota has a strong reputation for the life of their vehicles, why bother looking at the Volts? I know we can't compare here, but I have family members who have a 2004 Dodge Grand Caravan and 2004 Jeep Grand Cherokee which keep overheating and shutting off while they are driving. I am like thats what they get for buying Chrysler products. They are cheap and useless. The Volt on the other hand are still not as good as Toyota, so why bother even comparing the Volt, just wondering....?

 

The V, available now, is an excellent replacement for the Matrix, but be mindful of the zero towing capacity rating. V MPG seems to be in the low/mid 40s by most reports. Go for a test drive and see if you like it.

The PHV is the plug-in version of the Gen III. The prior 1000+ posts in this thread debates the strengths and weaknesses of the Volt and PHV. There are some very strong opinions here, along with fascinating real world data. Take a look at Voltstats.net.

In terms of quality, Toyota is better than GM, which is better than Ford, which is better than Chrysler. GM are not so terrible as to make the Volt unworthy of consideration.

 

Sales add to the bottom line = $$$ profits.

DBCassidy

 

Monkey the prius V is relitively slow compared to matrix as well, and a tad slower than a regular prius. Still I too am considering it in the future.

 

Different POV adressed.
GM to increase Otto cycle efficiency went up with the compression ratio, increasing fuel knock resistance requirement.
Toyota used Atkinson cycle.

You may have missed other points: higher octane generally give less LHV content, higher octane also mean more CO2 footprint in fuel production.

 

What RON ratings are available in portugal for you to buy telmo?

 

95 and 98.

 

Awards don't have a direct relation to earning business-sustaining profit. In fact, engineering success is no guarantee of sales.

How would you determine that for PHV, which is package upgrade not an entirely seperate vehicle like Volt?

Of course, PHV has only been in production for 4 months. Shouldn't we have to wait until the second year, just like the Volt supporters said over and over again that we must do for Volt?

 

I agreed awards and bettering engineering don't guarantee sales, but then again sales are not a measure of quality but rather of cost vs features combined with market conditions.


Why is technology more important? Cnce someone considering the cars makes a decision on what to buy, the "sales levels/profit" really don't impact them, but the technology impacts them for as long as they own the car. I guess if one is shallow enough that status matters more than quality, then sale might matter after the purchase.


The PiP is generally cheaper to buy (but maybe not to lease) than a Volt, that does not make it better, unless you use cost as your primary dimension. And if cost is the primary value dimension, then one must note the PiP costs a more than a Prius V for a modest reduction in gas used. So for a PiP to be "better", one needs to heavily weight reducing gas or new Tech (so its better than a Prius) and yet have a different reason to hate the Volt/GM (as the Volt overall uses less gas and has way more technical awards).

 

For both automakers, these cars are experiments. To make a profit on either one, production needs to go up by an order of magnitude to get the economy of scale necessary for a profit.

I am quite keen to see how the sales numbers for both vehicles unfold in the coming months. Since the PHV has only been in production for a few months, it is hard to say anything, that's why I'd like to know where people are getting the sales data, and if it is available monthly and by continent.

 

so your definition of the better car is the more profitable one?

 

Thanks Sxotty. I am just checking around. Maybe the Prius V will get better over time?

 

Seilerts, my very thoughts exactly on the range of vehicles. GM is still pretty good, but nothing compared to Toyota or Honda. Good to know on the PHV. I guess so many people have their preferences As for the replacement on the V for the Matrix, that's what I thought. I am just wondering if Prius will be made into a minivan? No? However, I will just stick with the Prius V for now unless my wife really pushes for our Seinna. Thanks again for your help!

 

There was a rumor on here at one point about a possible V plug-in which would really be ground breaking taking the plug in tech to a new size class of vehicles.