Plug-In Supply DIY

This is something I would think is a bit newsworthy, and actually I was tipped off by somebody in Europe (if he wants to take credit he is welcome to post). But in the California Trade Registry, the business Plug In Supply at 302 Fawn Ct. Petaluma CA 94954, is listed as SUSPENDED.

Maybe somebody from California can supply further information about the Suspended status. Maybe it is as simple as not filing a form on time, or as big as being shut down by the state?

It is also interesting that Mr. Protheroe has allegedly threatened to sue one poster, but has never bothered to attempt to respond in this forum, where a large portion of his customers would logically come from.

 

sub3, Thanks for the post. Very interesting info.

Kruz, Thanks for the post. I am happy for you. I hope your situation continues to go well. I only wish I would have had the same experience.

Chonnyton, It looks like Kruz got his components very quickly. I know you stated you ordered your kit on 6 Feb and hadn't received all the components as of 21 Apr. Can you provide us with an update to your status?

It looks like Chonnyton's original post was deleted except for the letter "A". I'm not sure why that is.

All,
I'm to the point where I'm afraid to post too much info. I'm currently trying to reconcile with PIS as recommended by Mr. Bigh and Seilerts (whom I respect). I'm also taking into account what Lopez said (whom I also respect) about trying to be patient and not expecting everything to just fall into place. By the same token, that's seems to be the exact experience Kruz had. His experience is kind of what I expected although I didn't expect to get the kit that quick and I expected some problems. I just didn't expect the experience I had, that's all. Now I'm just to the point where I want to put it behind me but without a refund or a kit, I'm not able to do that.

It should be mentioned that every word I posted was meant to inform and not slander. In the Navy we watch out for our shipmates. I consider all of you my shipmates. I'm certain (by reading posts) that some think I jumped the gun and wasn't patient enough (and, maybe that has some merit) but, I did what I thought was right after waiting 10 weeks.

I appreciate all the support from NortTexSalv04Prius, stripedrex, miscrms and others.

Right now, I'm hoping for reconciliation and wishing my next post will be, "I got the kit" or "I got the refund" and "I guess PIS isn't so bad after all". I will continue to keep you posted on my experience.

 

It is possible that Robb got his customers mixed up and Navy was unfairly treated. This is not out of the question. I remember getting a email from an Enginer user who got a quote from Robb for a ECM assembly for his 4kwh Enginer kit so it could do EV up to 70MPH. he was quoted about US$1600. It would be utterly useless for a Enginer kit.

It is a sad state of affairs that DIY PIS kit customers have to live in fear of retribution if they make a negative post and have to restrain themselves from making any posts at all whilst they wait for parts to arrive. This is not communist China.

Good luck Navy.

 

no matter how difficult a business one may be in, they have a duty to be completely honest with their customers. and honesty means not ommitting any pertinent information. it seems to me that all these companies should tell interested parties about the possibilities of any delays and technical problems that may occur if they are aware of them. i also think it is unethical to charge before shipping unless there is an agreement between parties. all the best navy, i hope you get your kit or refund soon.

 

As best I can tell they are the same. However, looking at the Headway site, the cells seem to be identical but they have different part numbers than what was on my invoice. There were at least three cell types that looked identical except for part numbers. One was an 8AH cell that has a high charge/discharge rate, another was a 10AH cell that had higher capacity, but lower charge/discharge rate. A third type is the H-40152S cell which is slightly larger and 15AH.

Yes, the bus connectors are steel, not copper...don't really appear to be stainless steel: just steel. The only complaints I have about that shipment are the steel (not copper) bus bars and the fact that the battery holders were not included with it.

As far as the screws are concerned, I would not characterize them as smallish machine screws. Yes, they are fairly small, but they're still pretty robust and come with a washer and lock washer as well.

I received the battery charger this afternoon...an elcon PFC 1500 unit. Robb stated in an email this morning that he would send 38 battery holders (apparently all he has) with the rest of the kit parts, and the rest as soon as he could get them.

Addendum: I just found a bar code almost hidden by the blue plastic cover. The number is E40152SE. On the Headway site they list a H-40152S cell as being a 15AH cell, with 3C continuous discharge to 10C peak. The bus bars measure ~48mm long with ~40mm from each hole center to the other. The holes are slightly oblong to allow room for 'fit'.

 

Re: Happy Plug-in Supply Customer

Do you have a link for that? I can't find any reference in THIS thread by him to the Ripoff Report.

 

That is from Post #74 on this thread. Looking up Ripoffreport.com and entering Plug In Supply will get you to the referenced report. That report was filed on 4/26/2012 at 7:50 a.m.

As far as the California Trade Registry site, Business Search - Business Entities - Business Programs just takes you to the home page. You've got to type in Plug In Supply in the search box. On the left side, for the FAQ, you can research the Suspended status meaning.

 

Re: Happy Plug-in Supply Customer

Thanks for the photos. Just wanted to know whether your 10KWH PIS kit can do EV mode only up to 70MPH and whether the ICE can still kick in?

I thought that maybe you have one of the older PIS kits which only did outofgas mode up to 84kph.

 

I live in California but know nothing about the trade registry. That said Business Search - Business Entities - Business Programs, which you supplied arlier has a FAQ on the left. The entry at Frequently Asked Questions - Business Entities - California Secretary of State is useful, re: suspension.

Whoops! I should've read the rest of the thread before replying. You've already stated pretty much what I just posted. :embarassed::redface:

 

The bus connectors (I assume you mean connecting plates) are probably silver plated copper or some other sort of plating. The silver plating is used to stop the copper from oxidising which could add resistance to the battery pack due to oxidation. The silver plating will not oxidize and has a higher temperature rating. You can use a magnet to see if they are stainless steel, if the magnet does not stick it is probably SS which has a darker shade than normal steel. Normal steel will probably rust in time. It would make sense to use plated copper. You could try to scratch off some of the plating on the connecting plate edge with a file to see if there is copper underneath.

The following link states that the headway connecting plates are made of plated copper.

http://wookware.org/pics/moped/lithbatts/index.html

 

Well, you could be right. I did not consider that they may be plated copper. I will check that out. BTW, Headway calls them a bus bar.

[edit]From the Headway webpage:

[/edit]

I got an email from Robb overnight stating that the batteries shipped were indeed supposed to be 40152S. I was somewhat concerned because the Headway website indicates 40152S cells needed a larger holder than the smaller 38120S cells, but he assured me they fit.

 

How many of those cells will your system use please?

 

Should be 76 cells x 3.2V cell nominal voltage = 243.2 Volts


EDITED - 16 May 2012

My BMSplus uses 70 A123 pouch cells x 3.3V = 231v

Somehow the PIS system uses a higher voltage.

Funny, the A123 20AH pouch cells have a nominal voltage of 3.3v.

Be carefull as this voltage 243.2 volts can kill you. Wear high voltage gloves if you have any when handling the battery pack.

The battery pack is split into two seperate packs so each pack is about 120Vdc each. Nevertheless you cannot be too carefull.

 

I was thinking he had ordered the 10kw system and was wondering about the configuration. I see now where it was the 4kw that he ordered.

 

Re: Happy Plug-in Supply Customer

Keep in mind I am still learning about this system but it looks to be evolved from earlier versions to be easier to use. It is simplified in that it has one rocker switch to enable EV mode (via the "Try EV" connector in the dash).

When driving down the highway with cruise set at 70 MPH the ICE will kick in if I am going up a hill. Otherwise it is either off or "spinning" with the MPG on the MDF readout displaying 99.9MPG.

I assume we want this type of spinning to keep things lubricated. However, there will be several times when ICE kicks on simply due to the terrain or the desire for fast acceleration. But for the most part it is all EV. I filled it up after the installation. I have driven 285 miles so far on this tank of gas (mostly trips < 50 miles between charges). The gas gauge still says full. I guess when I finally do have to fill up I will be able to compute actual MPG then.

 

lopezjm is correct--76 cells.

 

Re: Happy Plug-in Supply Customer

That is correct. I currently have the ICE spin while in high speed EV mode in order to lubricate the planetary gearbox as well as preventing MG1 from over speeding.

 

The fact that PIS does not sell their kit on EBay is a big question mark for me. If Jack Chen can sell his Enginer kit on EBay then why can't Robb do the same. Many honest sellers use EBay.

 

I can't speak for Robb of course but Ebay fees can be pretty hefty. Implying something about a vendor's honesty because they choose not to use certain sales/marketing tools doesn't seem fair to me.

Robb has always answered my questions promptly and courteously. I'm still considering a kit if/when I get some money together.

 

I have never heard of any Enginer customer who lost their refund to Jack and be threatened with legal action. Just pointing out a difference in character. It Is not so much about honesty but about having good judgement. I am glad you are still considering getting a PIS kit. Navy's experience may just be an isolated incident.