Power Mode gas mileage?

When suggesting how manufacturers could improve MPG, I hope people remember that the EPA labels are already heavily discounted from the actual EPA test results. For example, Insight-II produced 57.4 mpg in the test cycle in order to get is 41 mpg label. Prius produced 70.8 mpg before adjustments.

I don't have better than average reflexes. My household simply has a different selection of vehicles.

 

Having owned the same cars (C5 Vette and Prius) at the same time I would have to agree with you. I've never once thought I was going to get into an accident jumping into the Vette after driving the Prius. I find it a ridiculous assumption.

 

Some people makes their selves part of a closed loop PID system with the car and adjust on the fly to get the output desired.

On the other end of the spectrum, some people operate cars like appliances, or on-off servo systems.

 

Although I got the gist, I had to look that up! lol Very appropriate analysis though.

 

Well I gave up on worrying too much about The Prius's image when Toyota launched it's let's sway to folk music while the local theatre troop dressed as plants and trees wave. That kind of killed any real hope of breaking free from the "whimpy" stereotype some people attach to Prius. So blame Toyota.

Really to the outside observer? They have no idea what mode you are in as you drive. If a sweat drenched James Sikes with smoking brakes and/or Steve Wozniak's "Christine" like adventures in high speed Cruise Control haven't convinced someone that The Prius is capable of adrenaline producing excitement then I don't know what will? Give me a long enough cord and I'll try jumping a canyon with a PHEV if anyone thinks that will help. (I want a cut if this is ever used as an advertising idea)

I think the image of Hybrids WAS whimpy. But it's changing with more and more mainstream acceptance. What button someone may or may not have pressed on their dash has little to do with this process.

 

If you think the Prius is a wimpy car, don't buy it. Go get a mustang/jetta/corvette and add to the existing debt you have. Spend, spend, spend!

I bet collection agencies are becoming millionaires overnight.

 

Thank you very much, sir, for making your viewpoint crystal clear to us. I now totally understand that you think while you are driving the Prius wimpily, you, and you alone, are already enough to save the world. The rest of the world can go to hell and leave you alone (literally) in your exclusive Prius club heaven.

I happen to think the Prius is NOT a whimpy car. It's just that in the persuit for the extra last 0.1 mpg, some Prius drivers are presenting to the rest of the world that the Prius is a whimpy car, thus turning off their interests in buying the Prius.

I bet "soul collectors" are rubbing their hands too.

 

Pointing the finger to somebody does not solve issues; Doing the appropriate actions solves issues. If Toyota made a mistake in presenting the Prius as whimpy, are we going to just accept it? Are we going to add to the whimpy image by driving whimpily because now you can think, "It's not my fault, it's Toyota's."

Totally agreed. You can "really" drive the Prius in ECO mode, or you can still drive whimpily in PWR mode. However, the term "ECO mode" misleads the 1st time uninformed Prius driver to think it's the best and only way to increase FE, thus induces them to drive their Prii whimpily.

If anything, these two "adrenaline producing" episodes only presented to the world that Prius drivers are just a bunch of "best-nerds". I'm not sure that will enhance the image of the Prius to any extend, if not negatively.

 

That extra 0.1mpg?!?!? Try more like 20-30mpg. You get 400miles per tank, I get 700 miles per tank. That's significant cost-savings and we both arrive at the destination about the same time.

 

I (reversely) exaggerated "that extra 0.1 mpg" while you out-of-the -blue determined that my 500 miles / tank (9 US gallon) is really 400 miles /tank. Let's call it a draw.

Your significant cost savings might be built on significant loses to other drivers because their ICE burn a lot more gas than normal following you at a speed that forces their ICE in an inefficient speed range; and also their next car purchase will definitely exclude the Prius thanks to you.

Oh, it's just their lost and it's all your gain. Screw 'em, screw the rest of the world, right?

 

If they are following me, they are traveling about the same speed as me. Therefore, if I'm getting 700miles per tank at my current speed....the ICE must be working VERY efficiently. Therefore, all the followers ICEs must ALSO be working VERY efficiently (while matching my speed).

At your speed, you're only getting 500 miles per tank...that must mean your ICE is working inefficiently and everyone in front of you who are forced to travel faster because you are tailgating them.....their ICEs are also working inefficiently.

 

You obviously do not understand the engineering concepts of automobile so I may be wasting my breath here but, for the sake of other interested members, here go: Yes, you are right, if the whole bunch of cars forced to follow you are all Priuses. But they're not, for one, the way you drive makes sure they won't be driving Prii, ever, cause you turned them into Prius haters. For most other ICE only vehicles, they are most efficient at the the most common cruising speed on the city roads which they can switch to the highest gear. Any slower speeds the ICE rpm would be too low at highest gear so they have to down shift, making it very inefficient.

first you "determined" that I only have 400 miles per tank and now you "decided" I'm tailgating everybody else all the time. I have never tailgated anybody and I have never posted here to encourage anybody to do so. In fact I have stated clearly to the opposite. You are forcing your own imaginational scenerios here to justify your arguments and it appears quite childish. This makes me question the validity of your own declaration of 700 miles per tank. Do you fill up your tank every time the fuel low signal flashes which is about 9 gallons, or do you drive your car untill all the fumes are used up, and that is 11 gallons. 700 miles per 11 gallons is impressive, but not earth shattering. Or was it 651 miles so you rounded it up?

Anyway, I'll leave you to argue with your imaginary friends using your imaginery numbers. Good bye and good luck!

 

I did not answer your post earlier because, frankly, I did not know how to answer you, untill now. I guess I was intimidated by your expert like knowledge about EPA test and stuff.

After a few days, I thought, "wait a minute, I did not post to suggest Toyota to use my techniques to get better EPA test results; I posted to suggest Toyota to implement my techniques as user configurable defaults to allow everyday drivers like myself to get REAL LIFE mpg improvements."

Toyota can do whatever tricky magic they have in their sleeves to get their EPA test results. Who ever can get those EPA test results in real life WITHOUT incorporating any hypermiling techniques?

A lot of people, especially new Prius drivers, are posting here complaining that they're only getting 40-45....ish mpg, not 50 mpg as EPA stated. A lot of seasoned hypermilers here post that they're getting 60-70 mpg, but whenever their spouse/children/friends drive the Prius, it went down to 40...ish.

Imagine if anyone who knows nothing about hypermiling, bought a GenIII Prius, jump right in and start driving getting sporty, ok, maybe just lively responses from the car, and getting 56-57 mpg right off the bat. What would that do to the image, reputation and sales of Prius?

You can still do your hypermiling and get your 60-70 mpg if you want. I just want EVERYBODY else to get at least 55 mpg without even trying. Fair?

 

I mostly drive in power mode and average about 43 mpg. I average 45 in regular mode so not too bad. Better then the 13 mpg my Jeep Grand Cherokee (with a Hemi) averaged.

 

I joined this forum today just so I could thank everyone for this post and add my perspective as a non-Prius owner who is in the market for a new car. I've quoted two posts that I will refer to below.

First, let me give you a little background. I currently own an '05 Odyssey, an '02 WRX, and a '95 LandCruiser. The LandCruiser is a toy (rarely gets any use), and the Ody is a necessity given the size of my extended family. The WRX is my daily commuter, but it has begun a death rattle so I need to replace it. Given the high probability that gas is only going to get more expensive over the next decade, I'm looking for a fuel efficient alternative to the WRX.

I've been looking mostly at compacts that have combined EPA ratings of around 30-31mpg. When compared to the Prius, they all fall short. The Prius costs roughly the same as the other cars I am considering, but the combined EPA rating is almost 20mpg better. My calculations translated that into a savings of between $60-$70/month over the entire 10 years I typically own a vehicle. In the interest of full discloser, I am not a Prius fan. My parents own an '05 and love it, but at the time they bought it I thought they were wasting their money because gas was $2.50/gallon and therefore the savings didn't justify the price premium. Also, Prius drivers seem to have a habit of pulling out in front of me and making me jam on the brakes because they are driving like they are towing a trailer full of chandeliers. However, if a car can save me $65 a month for a decade, I'm willing to eat a little crow.

Today I test drove a Prius III, and I was initially horrified by the driving experience. I had driven a GenI car years ago, and it drove just fine. But this Gen III required 4 inches of pedal travel before it would do anything except crawl away from a stoplight. I suddenly understood why I have been standing on the brake pedal every time a Prius gets in front of me. After a couple of miles I commented on this to the sales guy sitting next to me, and he hit the power button. Suddenly, it was like a normal car. Throttle response was linear, as you would expect from any conventional powerplant.

When I got home my parents happened to be at the house for dinner, so afterwards I took a spin in their GenII car, and it drives normally too. I wanted to give teeasal props for his point above. He is absolutely correct about the first impressions during a test drive. Had the sales guy not hit that button, I would have crossed the Prius right off my list and happily paid $65/month for a decade for the privilege of never getting behind the wheel of a Prius again. By the same token, I'd like to take issue with mwok86 for labeling me as "an idiot who must blast to 50mph in ten seconds" and that I must have "a high insurance rate and lots of debt". It so happens that I have low insurance rates, I am in a position to buy a new Prius with cash (although I will not because rates are so low), and I graduated with honors with a BS in Engineering and have held down the same job for almost 15 years (knock on wood), so I like to think I am not an idiot. I also would like to point out that 50mph in 10 seconds is not blasting; it's normal. 50mph in 5 seconds is blasting, and I do it every day because my commute includes a 100 foot entrance ramp onto a highway that is packed at rush hour with people doing 75mph. I don't have much of a choice if I want to get home before 9pm.

So I wound up here tonight to find out what kind of mileage I could expect if I used only the Power calibration, and my take away is that the different modes exist more to promote behavior modification than anything else. Regardless of the setting, if you drive like a tortoise you will be rewarded with 60mpg, and if you drive like a hare and you will be punished with 40mpg. That is good to know, and I will factor that in to my calculations. Thanks to everyone for the information, and if I do end up with a Prius, I’ll be back to learn more.

 

You got it 100% correct, Enginerd. Welcome to the forum.

 

First off .... Enginerd .... LoL, never heard that one before. I'm sure you're not a nerd, engineers are cool.

About the test drive: Most likely the car was in Eco mode before that gentleman hit the Power Mode. If the car is powered off in Eco mode, it will power back up in Eco mode. Eco mode makes the pedal response reeaallly soft. I actually use normal mode (not Eco, power or EV) all the time, and it's fine.

I have rented Prius and driven in Power Mode many times while getting 55 MPG on gage. All Power Mode does is make the pedal and car feel more responsive. Whether of not the driver buries the HSI gage thru the Power zone is up to them, and if one does and brakes too hard repeatedly, the MPGs will suffer a bit. HSI is the 'sldiing' horizontal bar, press display button to get it.

 

I took a trip a couple of years ago in September, nice weather, up to the Poulsbo Washington area and back. I used power mode all the time and I received a true 58 mpg. This is with 10% ethanol gas as well.

 

meanwhile back on the ranch...

Doesn't ECO mode also alter accessory efficiency usage (a/c. etc) as well as engine coolant temp for engine shut off? I stay in ECO all the time, but when accelerating...I push into the power bar from about 15mph to 40mph. This gets the car moving at an acceptable rate in about all situations and then allows quick switch to glide mode. This is much more enjoyable and less stressful then trying to stay out of the power bar and out of the way from the cars in back of me. Only time I have to push for more is getting on the interstate.

When I test drove my first Pri...my response was "what is wrong with the gas pedal?". Unfortunately the sales guys are not inclined (or not smart enough) to spend the time to explain all of the different modes and what they do. I found the information here on the forum...but many folks will never step foot into this site. This is a mistake on their part and Toyota's.

I have not seen many Pri haters on the road, but then again I have modded my Pri and I actualy get more props than middle fingers. Most folks that ask about my car do not even know it is a Pri...because of the mods. I even got a big thumbs up from a guy on a backhoe one day...that was too damn funny. They like what they see. Slowly the hybrid car is becoming a "normal" looking car from a design point of view...the earlier hybrid designs (all makes) were anything but looking like a normal car. And learning to drive the car to get good mpg's while not being at golf cart speeds would curb a lot of would-be Pri haters.

Just my thoughts...

 

Sigh... I don't think I'm going to jump in on the Prius. The most surprising thing to me is that a lot of the posts I read here speak about all these different techniques everyone uses to get better mileage. It seems this car is very dependent on driving technique. For example, there is a recent post about how a member got from 39mpg to 49mpg. I based all of my calculations on the advertised combined EPA figures. I have found that my driving style yields those numbers in both of my cars within 1mpg. However, the Prius EPA combined mileage is listed as 50mpg. The poster from the other thread talks about he needed to slow down, glide, etc. in order to get from 39 to 49 in the winter. To me a car is an appliance. I use it to get to work and back. I don't want to be concentrating on switching modes, gliding, covering parts of my grill, etc. I want to get into my car and go to work. Everything I read makes it seem like I will probably get in the high 30's / low 40's based on my driving style. While that is impressive, it's not impressive enough to overcome the aspects of the car I don't like. First, I'd be giving up the power to merge into the crazy traffic I have to deal with every day. Second, the car does not stay in power mode. I can tell from the test drive I would use nothing else. This means I have to remember to hit the power button every time I get in the car. I know it's not a huge deal, but it's annoying. And lastly, I don't really like the driving position. I can't see the front of the car as it disappears below the windshield, and the bottom edge of the windshield feels like it is in the next county. I remember thinking during my test drive that I felt like I was in the '74 Firebird I drove in college. The front of the car feels miles away, which is a neat trick in a car so small.

So in the end, it looks like it will be a Ford Focus for me. I may live to regret this decision, since the Ford is probably going to be half as reliable. If gas goes to $8/gallon, I'll be kicking myself. But for now, I'm going to pass. Thanks for this great forum with such a wealth of knowledge. I wish you all well, and I'll be back to reevaluate at my next purchase (probably in 2022).