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Wavy rear tires... second set.

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Care, Maintenance and Troubleshooting' started by B. Roberts, Jan 22, 2010.

  1. greenmanJon

    greenmanJon New Member

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    As an auto technician (a previous carreer) I can tell you that:
    A) the problem you describe IS caused by misalignment (camber/toe problem) and/or bad shock absorbers, and
    B) just because the alignment is "within specs" it doesn't necessarily mean that it is optimal.
    A good alignment tech who has aligned many Prii will know what the best alignment parameters are.
    I would see if I couldn't speak to him and pick his brain about it.
    Yes, the engineers set the specs on paper to be optimal however, experience has shown me that what is on paper is not always the best in the field.
    If sticking or loose wheel hubs were your problem, you'd feel that a long time before tire wear were a problem.
    Same thing with brake issues being the cause.
    It's much more likely that a bushing somewhere in the suspension has "flattened" or is soft causing misalignment.
    Sometimes it is a real pain in the butt to get an alignment corrected so as to not wear tires as in your situation.
    Good luck.


     
  2. B. Roberts

    B. Roberts Hypah Milah! Ayuh.

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    One Year later report: Nothing has changed. Still have scuppered up rear tires that now shake the car so much that the front tires have developed feathering and joined in the noise making. Noise protection while riding our Prius is highly recommended! We are now more than ready to purchase another new set of round tires. That will be set # 5.5, not counting the snow tires that I don't want to put on the car, so they can stay round.

    Toyota custormer service had to be brought into the picture back in November of 2011, but we are still waiting to see a promised 'regional tech'. Our 05 Prius now has around 114,600 miles on the clock. Running like a champ otherwise. Still planning to get a new 12V battery, if the tire reshaping problem can be fixed. If we get a battery, it will probably will be an Optima, now that they actually produce one for the Prius that doesn't need the old adaptor kit.

    We will be looking over all suspension bits, the two rear hubs, alignment and of course, balance. I just hope this 'regional tech' person appears at some point and can come up with some kind of resonable solution. We still haven't been informed about his schedule.

    Is the c out yet?!
     
  3. Yogi56

    Yogi56 New Member

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    We went through this years ago with a Taurus wagon. Had a bent axle by the hub. If your put the car in the air and ran the rear wheels you could see the wobble. With new tires it was quiet for awhile then the noise came back as the tread wore down. The car ran straight so alignment didn't effect the issue either way. You may have a bad wheel or axle.
     
  4. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    thanks for the update, this is a sad saga.
     
  5. rwyckoff

    rwyckoff Phev's Plus Home Solar power1

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    I had exactly the same problem only at 190K miles. Ruined two pairs of tires. Replacing the rear shocks cured the problem. There was not that much difference between the new shocks and old. I would replace the rear shocks just in case, they aren't that expensive compared to ruining tires. There could be some kind of resonance setting up causing the up and down hoping, and changing the shocks will change that dynamic.
     
  6. B. Roberts

    B. Roberts Hypah Milah! Ayuh.

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    I would have 2 bad rear wheels or axle. The thing I noticed with the first 2 sets of tires, that after I rotated them, the rears would always start to deform, so 4 bad wheels and only when they go on the back.

    If I didn't rotate, the front tires would stay round while the rears deformed.
     
  7. B. Roberts

    B. Roberts Hypah Milah! Ayuh.

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    I will add checking and changing shocks to the list and maybe even installing all new bushings as well. At this point I'd like to change out the entire rear suspension if I could.

    The only thing is, this Prius has been messing up rear tires since it was new! Shocks seemed to be ok, with no leaks. But your suggestion will be taken. Thanks.
     
  8. B. Roberts

    B. Roberts Hypah Milah! Ayuh.

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    As added background... I feel I have been very lucky so far vehicle wise. This is the first issue I have ever had on a car that has not been sorted out right away. We still like our Prius, but I'm starting to wonder if I will be able to buy another Toyota. Most of my cars since the mid 1970s have been Hondas, so my experience dealing with a company to correct problems has been nonexistent.

    We did own a 1984 or 85 Jeep Cherokee for a few months, and it's 4 banger engine developed the annoying habit of not restarting after you shut the engine off, unless you waited an hour or two. No one could straighten that out, so I traded it in for another Honda. Reliability and good overall design has its advantages.

    This is the first Toyota product we have ever purchased. I knew that the Prius would be a risk of sorts, since it involved different technology. But the hybrid system has been flawless and the car still allows 50 plus MPG when I drive it, even if it chops
    up the rear tires to the point I can't hear the sound sytem.

    Of course I haven't really made out economy wise, since we've had to buy so many sets tires for this car. I think I would have been ahead monetarily, if I had bought a 40 MPG non hybrid car that could evenly wear a 60,000 mile set of tires. I would be 3.5 sets of tires to the good. Actually 4.5 sets to the good, when I replace the ruined tires that are on the car now.

    I've always gotten great mileage out of tires and brakes. I have an old '99 Saturn wagon that I use mostly in Winter. It has traveled 150,000 miles and has only gone through one set of Summer tires and is now just on its second set of snow tires.
     
  9. Yogi56

    Yogi56 New Member

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    Did you buy the car new? Any chance it was wrecked and not repaired correctly. If you drive through water onto dry pavement and the tracks don't line up the unibody/subframe may be off.
     
  10. B. Roberts

    B. Roberts Hypah Milah! Ayuh.

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    Bought new. No accidents, gently driven for max MPG.
     
  11. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    I read your first post and then glanced over at where your from and said shocks.

    Never even heard of brake issues causing this problem. And most used brakes with shoes don't contact the hub real good as you turn the wheel. There may be a free spot and then it catches a little which is meaningless when the weight of the car is on the wheel. If that effect is real bad one of the shoes is not free. But your from Maine and I bet there's substantial rust in the brakes. The star adjuster is probably a block of rust and all the springs and shoe mount tabs and base is solid rust.
    Snap a picture of the back of the wheel area so we can see how bad its corroded.
    But anyway replace the rear shocks. They were really only good for about 75,000 tops on good surface. Cut that in half in Maine. And the front struts are toast to. The car must handle very poorly.
     
  12. B. Roberts

    B. Roberts Hypah Milah! Ayuh.

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    That's why I have that old Saturn out on my driveway. I call it the 'Sacrificial Anode'. We don't use the Prius when salt is spread on the roads. The stuff they put down to melt snow in Maine is extremely damaging. No rampaging corrosion going on under the Prius, but I will try to snap a photo for you anyway.
     
  13. googrx

    googrx New Member

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    Dude, not all tires are made the same. The stock tires are always better than the retail one. Take care of the stock tires and it will save you money on performance as well as time.
    Keep checking tire pressure, keep it clean, etc. should exceed warranty expectation.
     
  14. googrx

    googrx New Member

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    But it galvanized steel! unless your car is so old and the coating have scratch off, or you spray extreme harsh chemical on it daily!

    I just found out that cleaning your car belly is unnecessary and only wash away the protect ant chemical. The more you clean it the more vulnerable it is to chemical harms.
    I found filtered drinking water is better than tap water and rag is better than hose.
     
  15. bisco

    bisco cookie crumbler

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    and a day at the beach is better than a sharp stick in the eye!
     
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  16. mmcdonal

    mmcdonal Active Member

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    It sounds like the belts are delaminating in a circular pattern. This can be caused by improper thrust alignment. Have you had that done by a specialty shop? (align both front and rear tires and make sure they are also on the same track, not off-set, or "dog tracking" as we used to say in the sevendees) I had that happen on a solid rear axle front drive car years ago, and the thrust alignment cured it.
     
  17. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    I was referring more to the roads in Maine being harsh on shocks.
    But as a side note corrosion must be really bad under there too.
    I love Maine. My wife's from there & lots of family near Portland.

    Try this. Have someone drive down the road in the Prius on a highway and you follow along behind and watch the rear wheels how they handle small bumps. I bet the rear tires are jittering around pretty good. I see this all the time on cars. Smooth road and the tire is doing a micro dance on the road= very bad shocks.
     
  18. B. Roberts

    B. Roberts Hypah Milah! Ayuh.

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    Guys, our Prius has done the same thing to the OEM tires, 2 and a half sets of Goodyear TripleTred tires, a set of RS-As and the set on the car right now... Kumho Ecsta Platinum LX tires. The car tracked and handled a lot better after we got rid of the OEM tires. All the aftermarket tires were balanced with the heaviest part of the tire on the opposite side of the heaviest part of the wheel. I think this is called "road force" balancing(?) and always yielded few weights to balance then. We never noted a vibration of any sort, when each set of tires were new.

    I have followed this car to see if it "dog tracked". The car's track is not offset to either side. It follows itself well.

    My wife got a call from Toyota today, and they gave us another Toyota phone number to call. I'll do that tomorrow. This whole thing is a good puzzle. I will write down the suggestions you all offer, and then have each one checked out.

    I need a good day at the beach.
     
  19. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    Dude, stock tires usually suck and especially suck on a Prius. Goodyear Integrities are the worst tire ever made, maybe as bad as Goodyear Wrangler
    RT/S. Which is a stock tire on millions of Ford trucks & SUV's.
    Both tires deserve a class action lawsuit imho.
     
  20. edthefox5

    edthefox5 Senior Member

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    Hmm..not sure what that means as there is no heavier part of the tire. Some tires are directional though but it sounds like they were all balanced good as no vibration. So not a tire problem. I'm running Kumho Ecstea's too. Love them.

    But try what I suggested and look closely at the rear tire and see if they are planted real good on the road with no jitter.