PGE billing for Plug Ins?

i don't think there are any discounts. there is an experimental rate, E9A/E9B, for electric vehicles, but i don't know if the PIP qualifies. this is a tiered TOU rate, and E6 is much more favorable. my understanding is that people with PV solar and leafs are better served by staying on E6. the same is probably true for you.

edit: having said that, i see on the mynissanleaf forums that some people like E9 better because of the times defined as peak. i have not followed this closely but i think PGE keeps changing E9 and it may no longer be more favorable. unfortunately you'd just have to download the latest E9 tariff document and figure it out for yourself... it looks like they just updated it again last month.

www.pge.com/tariffs/tm2/pdf/ELEC_SCHEDS_E-9.pdf

 

I had E9A and I hated it. It cost more because of TOU. I find myself always have to plug in during the day because of the capacity is only 4KW and I always run it down by mid day. Unlike a Volt or Leaf, you'll probably use 200KW a month for PIP.

 

yeah, it does not work for me either. no PV solar and my analysis showed that we have too much load during the day to make the cheaper EV charging work. as it stands the leaf is costing about as much as a prius when gas is $4/gallon, so it's okay for me to stay on E1.

 

MyNissanLeaf is definitely a good place to discuss PG&E rates, tiers, usage, etc. since so many folks there have ripoff PG&E as their utility.

I kinda posted about this at My Nissan Leaf Forum • View topic - "typical" Miles/KWh figures for a couple scenarios?. Take a look at these rates for those in WA, depending on where you live:
http://pse.com/aboutpse/Rates/Documents/elec_sch_007.pdf
Seattle City Light: Electric Rates & Provisions

I lived in WA state for a bit over 9 years and small part of it was while being served by Seattle City & Light. The rest was PSE...

 

You should do what I did years ago. I have Solar Panels that heat the pool water, I run my pump for 1 hour a day, and the panels heat the water to a 90'ish range, I like a warm pool! The panels are 10 ft X 4 ft wide. They have a 3" piece of PVC at the bottom and top of the panel. connecting these two pipes is a sheet of 1/4" black extruded tubing. You force the water to run uphill, it takes longer, and will completely fills the tubes that way, and it will produce hotter water. I have 10 panels on my roof, next to the 60 Electrical Solar Panels.
In the winter it is less efficient, but manages to stay above 80. If you run it when it is colder outside than the pool temp is, it will act like a radiator and bleed off heat! I am in SoCal so it works great year around here. I run my pump at High noon when the sun is above the house! I got rid of the gas heater 25 years ago! Saved a ton of money, the system has already paid for itself!

 

Hmmm, couldn't open it...

 

www.pge.com/tariffs/tm2/pdf/ELEC_SCHEDS_E-9.pdf

 

whoops, something got screwed up when i posted the link and it points back to priuschat. cwerdna fixed it.

 

OP: You can get another meter just for your EV. Check with PG&E.

The effect of PG&E's time-of-use tariffs is pretty complicated. It varies greatly with overall use (usage tier), and the differences between peak and off-peak rates are huge, especially in summer.

The average customer uses 6800 kWh. The PIP will increase consumption by somewhere under 1300 kWh per year (assuming one charge per day). My guess is that for most people the PIP won't change usage enough to make up for the penalty of peak usage, unless there is very little usage during weekdays - i.e., everyone working or at school.

OTOH if the PIP bumps you from Tier 2 into Tier 3, the cost of a charge could more than double on E-6. (E-9 - the special plug-in rate - doesn't have that problem.)

Best thing is to get a few months' bills in hand after your car is in use, and then look at alternatives. Without data for your usage pattern, it'll just drive you nuts. If you want something to do in the meantime, write down your meter reading for each time-of-use period for a few typical weekdays and weekend days now, and then next summer. (Note that E-6 and E-9 tariffs have different TOU periods.)

PG&E's rates are all on this page, in spreadsheet form. Look at the latest one under Residential, Residential Time-of-Use, and Residential Baseline.

 

I'm glad I live in Texas where I have 3-year contract for 9.5 cents/kWh. Others here have found better, cheaper deals.

 

PGE = Pacific Gas and Electric

(Just in case anybody like me didn't know what this meant - I had to look it up)

 

For a Volt you can also get away with 200KW a month. Believe me I know. I think with the PiP you guys will get away with less than 100kw a month. Especially if the battery is only 3kw in size. My average drive is 10 miles 1 way @ 2.8kwh consumption leaving me with 5.6kwh for my drive. So my base usage for the month is just over 120kwh for the Volt for my drive to work. With errands and all that it probably puts me somewhere around 180kwh a month.. Obviously the more you drive the more you use, but with the PiP you have a smaller battery. So obviously your electric usage will be less. I would expect it to have a minimal impact on your electric bill. Depending on how much I drive the Volt its portion of my bill is around $20-$35 a month @ $0.145 a kwh. Which isn't to bad given I drive a minimum of 480 miles a month for work.

As a side note I cannot recommend enough that you do not disclose to your electric company you have an EV, and sign up for any EV rate plan until you see the writting dry on the wall. See the thread I post to below. I have resisted signing up with Dominion for this reason even though they send me pamplets/emails about it all the time. It is most definately cheaper to remain on your current plan. Especially if you want/need to charge during the day. Just by my own guesstimation for myself it would dramatically increase my electric bill to go TOU, and other EV owners have been hosed by their electric companies who raised their TOU rates without warning. So a just a word of caution in that area.

PG&E TRIPPLES OFF PEAK EV ELECTRICITY RATES from 4 cents to 11 cents a Kwh

 

For PG&E customers: "Effective December 2 [2010], the E-9 rate schedule is no longer mandatory for Plug-in Electric Vehicle owners." So you don't have to throw a tarp over your PIP on meter-reading day.^_^

See PG&E's Electric Vehicles FAQ under "Rates and Cost."

That page also discusses how to set up a second meter for your EV. (But it probably won't pay for a PIP.)

 

LOL!! oh ya BUT!!!

having lived in CA and having watch Erin Brockovich its actually

PG&E

PGE is more commonly known as Portland General Electric the largest utility in the state of OR.

but its just unneeded semantics since we all know who we are talking about here

[ame="http://vimeo.com/13314763"]Driving Oregon's Future on Vimeo[/ame]

 

Yeah, the OP should've titled this thread correctly...

 

12.9 kWh per charge 28 times per month would be 361.2 kWh.

How many miles?
.

 

Come to think of it, the 200KW that I mentioned earlier was for the electricity used on 1 tank of gas, about 12 gallons. That took me a month and a half to drive. As i recall, I used about 140-150kw a month. Sometimes I have to charge twice a day if I'm running errands.

 

I don't drive a full charge everyday.. Usually Mon-Fri I drive approx 22 miles using 5.6kwh (probably about 6-6.3kwh when you figure in charging loses and such). Everyone always assumes you will use the max battery everyday, but that is just not the case. If it is a really cold day and I wind up using the heater you can add 1-1.5kwh onto my usage. A guy up the street from me has a Volt amd drives it even less distance than I do (I work on NS Norfolk across the bay, and he works at Langley on this side).. Is why I say for work purposes I drive my car 22 times a month for work which would be 128-140kwh depending on just small day to day variations. Usually one day on the weekends we will deplete full charge, with one of those times charging it twice. So worst case scenario for me is 217kwh a month give or take some.

It seems to me that a lot of people look at it like a waste if you buy an electric car with Y miles, but only drive X distance.. We never fully deplete our gas tanks in our day to day driving, so why is this the logic we use with electrics? Granted with the PiP and a smaller battery it will be more common to run full cycles on the battery. I am sure however there will be a lot of cases with folks running errands, or not needing the gas engine much at all. My primary reason for buying the Volt is in EV mode it met all of my day to day needs, and it had the engine just in case I needed it. My next car however will more than likely be a Leaf. Especially since we will have the Prius as a backup car, and I now know this electric stuff is legit.