No waiting lists in California, no choice allowed!

First time posting.

Here is my experience in NorCal at the moment.

San Jose (Capitol Toyota): $500 refundable deposit, exact config, MSRP, free San Jose metered parking permit

San Jose (Piercey Toyota): no deposit, call to place exact config, $100 under MSRP, , free San Jose metered parking permit

Sunnyvale: $500 refundable deposit, call to place exact config, $350 under MSRP using Costco discount

Daly City: no deposit, call to place exact config, MSRP


If you are in the "need it now" mode, you can always check craigslist.org > LA or OC > Prius. Some dealers list leftovers/declines.

hope this helps!

 

Hi Huh!... Its always fun to see new posters.. I'm always intrigued to hear what they have to say... what interested then to finally post

Welcome and it looks like you offered some valuable info.. keep up the good work!

 

Auto sales are heavily regulated, but your comment regarding the illegality of taking a deposit without a VIN number got me thinking. I suspect there is some consumer law on the issue. The only thing I could find on it was a warning on Car.com (quoted below) that warns a deposit may not hold a car unless you haver a specific VIN number ... because the dealer is allowed to sell the car to the highest bidder at any time. (Emphasis is mine in the quoted paragraph).

 

yea..if someone walks on the lot the day your car shows up.. he could sell it and not call you till the next one shows up or maybe even without the options you want saying thats all that is availiable.
hate to get you worrying for what may be nothing... but watch out!

 

Anyway.. back to this business is business,
It appears they are taking the "its better to have one in the hand than 15 in the bush" approach! These are dealers who usually have mass amounts of people pouring through thier gates because they are positioned in a very high populous area and they know they will only see most folks once!

In reality, anyone is a fool if they don't shop around.. both physically and on the internet!

Most of the time the "fools" and the people who fall the hardest are the honest ones... they don't even see it coming! They are not looking for it because they trust! Maybe they came from a small town where they "had" to treat customers well and now they are a lost fish in the ocean full of sharks and barracudas!

Dealers are only a Middleman that can be avoided with a broker!

Because of thier treatment so poorly to so many, they are only cutting thier own throats and driving customers to dealers who do better.

Never feel sorry for them, When they give you thier sob story about how they have to feed thier kids, because they are the ones that have to become very high pressure salesman to not loose a customer?

Its very easy to sell when you have a good product and you treat fairly!

What ever happened to win - win? Where the seller AND the buyer feels like they get a fair deal?

Sure I know the sucker buyer feels like he's getting a win at the time, or he wouldn't be buying, but 2 weeks later when he finds how many more thousands he paid when he didn't have to... he will not only not be back.. the will go out of his way to be negative advertising for that dealer!

Stores used to do that too!.. but now in order to build trust, they now have to do "price guarantees"
"If you find it any lower anywhere else within 30 days or whatever, they will pay you the difference" with interest or a bonus!

They would rather have your buisness than have you shop around.

Anyway.. buyer beware!

 

That is EXACTLY what is going on. Earlier this month I was shopping for a used Prius, but the dealers I stopped into didn't know that until I told them. During October 25-27, and November 1-3 EVERY single Toyota dealer I walked into had at least two new Prius cars to sell me immediately on the spot. Had I been in the market for a new 2005, or anxious to take advantage of someone in the used market I could have easily done so.

I visited Long Beach Toyota on PCH, Cabe Toyota, Carson Toyota, and Marina Toyota, all in Southern CA. They "bragged" about their potential markup and how much less their markup was from any other dealer, and they all ultimately offered to sell me the cars at MSRP, (under $27,000 for a level 6 equipped car).

I feel bad for anyone duped into paying a $6,000 markup!

Buyer beware! The dealers are playing games.

 

I think the sales critter you talked to was confusing laws on taking a deposit on a new car with laws on advertising cars.

At least here in California, dealers must place the vin number in the advertisement if they are advertising specific car deals. It helps prevent bait and switch tactics.

“Oh, I’m sorry Mr. and Mrs. Sucker, that was a great deal, but that car was just sold a half hour ago and drove off the lot as you drove in . . . but, you are in luck, they didn’t take the best one which is over here . . .†Of course, the advertised car never existed!

 

So there's no law against a dealer taking a deposit without giving a VIN number. But if you don't get a VIN number you have no promise of a specific car.

I bought mine in Fargo, where folks are honest. The $500 deposit was earnest money, to show that I was sincere about wanting to buy a car. It was also completely refundable if I changed my mind at any time. Since the dealer cannot request specific options from the region, he has no way of knowing for certain when your preference will come in, so getting to the top of the list gives you right of first refusal, until a car comes in that you are willing to take. Of course, that works when folks are honest.

Windstrings: what you are griping about is not really car dealers, its capitalism. That's how capitalism works: if you've got something someone else wants, you squeeze him as hard as you can. If he's got something you want, he squeezes you. The alternative is an economic model based on cooperation rather than competition. Advocate that, and they'll call you a communist. The first guy that advocated that, they nailed him to a cross. Then they took his name and made it a banner to beat down everything he stood for. The guy had some pretty good ideas, though. The folks who claim to believe he was god oppose everything he stood for. I don't believe that he or anyone else is god, but I agree with all those communistic ideas of his.

Workers of the world, unite!

 

I got mine in Helena MT, again an honest dealer asked for a deposit and I gave a credit card number and they never used it! Small town America there are still folks that make deals with a hand shake, old time capitalism, with a conscience. There is hope. I think about the owner of the main polar tech manufacture who when the plant burned down kept everyone on the payroll till he rebuilt. Costco vrs Walmart.

 

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: Gee, I've NEVER heard that story before!... are you sure that anyone would be so decietful, and lowlife?.....why.. isn't that just smart business?

Hey what the sucker doesn't know won't hurt him right!... wrong!... the dealer will be the sucker later as everyone in the buyers family, workplace, friends, and church aquaintances or bar buddies are made aware to avoid that place!

Thats why I won't use the dealer anymore and I encourage anybody else to do the same....
I am living proof that dealers everywhere suffer when one dealer screws somebody!....
There are still some good ones out there, but I don't have the time to risk my resources finding them!

You've heard buyers beware..... well I say... Dealers beware! "beware of who your screwing!".. because some people have tremendous exposure!.....

Between my job and my off duty activities, a tremendous number of people "several thousand", have contact with me by word of mouth on a regular basis... as the beach boys would say.. " I get around!"
There are tons of other people with the same or more exposure than me!

Word of mouth can work for you, or against you... no one is so mighty that they are immune to a bad reputation!

 

Just a note from Upstate NY, the three local Toyota dealers sell all Prius at MSRP no additional markup except the lousy taxes. The prices I see quoted on the west coast are 5 to 7k above our cost. I special ordered for a color and had car within six weeks. Packages available were: basic, with keyless enty or all options. I took middle of the road and very pleased.

 

Well, that may be true, but I got my last car from a broker (Select A Car, no longer in business) and had a bad experience there.

1) The car was dirty (they were anxious to make sure I had it that day, but since it had just arrived at the broker they didn't have time). When it was washed the paint was covered with little rings that looked like acid was dropped the surface. When I took it to the broker, he looked at it and said, "Hmmm, that looks bad. What are you going to do about it?" I ended up having to trace the actual purchase (fleet dealer in LA, car came from Escondido) and then talk to a company rep before they repainted the car for free.

2) Paid $680 for "extended warrany" which consisted of a piece of paper. The bastard was out of business and the insurance company that was on the paper had nothing that said I was covered at all (they were very nice and did a thorough search).

YMMV, but brokers aren't perfect either.

 

Wow!... your right... no one out there is to be trusted blindly..... It really helps to find someone with a track record.... the problem with dealers are unless you can deal with someone in very high authority, and then pray they will be there in that same power or higher the next time you go to buy, you have too many other variables and peoples to watch out for that can stab you in the back. From the Finance manager, to the Salesman, to the sales manager, to the warranty guy.

Man.. if you get out of there with your skin, you fare well!

At least with a broker, you are dealing with one person and its very easy to not have to deal with having 15 eyes in the back of your head... "you only need two" :lol:

I see it a bit like having a mechanic you trust... Its much less complicated to deal with him... even if he uses different mechanics under him, you know he has the final word on quality assurance concerning your car, and all of his mechanics will be forced to operate according to his principles, verses taking it to a big shop....even If you make out ok.... its like throwing dice as to whether that will happen the next time!

In like manner a dealer can be pretty dicey... I've done business and done well with dealers, but I usually have to haggle for 3 days to get what they finally realize I won't buy without!.. A broker is very simple.. Heres the deal.... you like it or you don't!

I just prefer the one on one relationship you build in business.... if they know you know them, they will act more acountable and responsible because they know you will use them the next time and will refer others.... the big guys at the big dealers tell you what you want to hear and then do whatever they can get away with!

But I'm sorry for your experience.... we are always vulnerable out there in the business world. Ask around and use someone else that has a good track record. Usually the track record of a broker will be more consistent than that of a dealer.

 

Please excuse the ignorance of this happy rural resident, however I'm really, really confused. :blink: Why does it seem like urban dwealers have a hard time believeing that if you travel into the boonies to a rural dealer that you won't do better than with the schiesters in the big city. Big city dealers don't need to be competitive because there are plenty of people and demand that they can get away with their questionable practices. Some folks have more money than brains and as such they choose to pay over MSRP or just take whatever the dealer says they have available when the phone call comes in. Under no circumstances should anyone pay more than MSRP for any vehicle and no matter what package they are getting or the price of that vehicle, the expense is such that every person should get exactly what they want, without question

The advice I give, which is the path of least resistance that I took is as follows: Take some time and call, fax, e-mail dealers that are in rural areas, agregarian cities and out of the way places. They don't have limitless demand, nor do they have draconian sales policies or as many blithering idiots on the sales floor. For some reason there is a huge difference in the attitude a dealer has for you, the customer, when he is seilling in an area with 50k people rathern than an area with millions of people.

 

This is what I did to get mine:
o hit up all the Toyota dealerships I see regularly on my work commute or on the new car plaques
This means North Hollywood, and Hollywood Toyota
o hit up all the famous/well-known Toyota dealerships I know of
Longo in El Monte, and Toyota of Orange (DON'T GO HERE)
o search Toyota.com for the listing of dealerships local to where I work or live
o go through AAA car buyer's program for dealership recommendations
they recommended South Coast Toyota
o go through Edmunds.com car buyer's program for dealership recommendations
o go through carsdirect.com for dealership recommendations
this was Power Toyota of Irvine
o call up rural dealerships listed from Toyota's dealership listing like Claremont
o troll PriusOnline.com's dealer forum for out-of-area dealerships with cars-at-hand such as Fremont Toyota and Ricky Hirose
this is how I found Rancho Santa Margarita

All of these dealerships fall into one of the 4 categories (the official one being they take your name and queue you into the factory), but at least you have a choice this way and you are a smart shopper that's not going to happily bend over and hand over more than $29K out-the-door (including all taxes) for one.

Remember, even if you're driving around with expired plates and a transmission that's shredding itself, you still don't need a new Prius that badly.

 

What a breath of fresh air! :huh: .. I couldn't have said it better myself!
Its nice when someone is on the same page with you.... kinda makes you feel like your really "not" going crazy!!!

Its human nature to test our boundaries and do anything and everything we can get away with.

In the boonies, it don't take long at all to loose your reputation if your bad... in the big city, no one knows you, nor do they care! There is so much competition, the dealer feels that if he treats someone well at a financial loss, that it won't pay off because the customer will be lured into another dealer the next time he wants to buy anyway.

Its very similiar in personal life too.... The big city is the jungle with many forces and variables at play....if you shop there, you better know your stuff.... cause they do!

And your right... I just get fumed, when I walk onto a lot and some half-wit lot-monkey with no education comes out who doesn't know where his butt hole is, let alone answer any technical questions I have. Then he tries to throw in a guilt trip about how many kids he needs to feed. Did I walk on the lot to feed the poor, or buy a car? Is it my fault he chose not to get an education?

They tend to be a worthless middleman that only raises the price and distorts the transaction!

Although it is quite a pleasure to deal with a salesman that actually knows his product and has manners and respect for the customer..... but they are rare.

My attitude is Ill do all my own homework, then I want to go and buy it!...

For me, a broker is the way to go... and dealer tends to just be a slowdown and a nusiance!

 

You're right, one thing about a broker is that they'll be looking for the exact one you want. It's not like you first have to see if the dealer can even get your car. I would've never thought to look in Escondido (a mere 26 miles from San Diego) to find the car I got via the broker.

I'll keep that in mind next time I'll be looking for a car 10-15 years from now. :lol: