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Programming a New Non-SKS Key for a 2007 SKS Prius

Discussion in 'Gen 2 Prius Accessories & Modifications' started by froboy67, Jan 12, 2011.

  1. froboy67

    froboy67 New Member

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    Hello,

    I've read several threads about DIY replacement key programming, and there's a lot of information out there. I've come to the following conclusions:

    1) It's not too hard to program a non-SKS key (black emblem) to work for your non-SKS car.

    2) It's also possible to program an SKS key (silver emblem) to work with a non-SKS car, although the actual SKS functions still obviously wouldn't work. This seems to be more difficult, or at least less common.

    3) Programming an SKS key for your SKS car is either very very difficult or impossible.

    However, there isn't much information out there considering programming a non-SKS key for an SKS car. I've found these two mentions:

    "Make sure you have on your original key and have looked on the back for a black toyota logo. This WILL NOT work for the smart keys with the SILVER toyota logo."

    "I have a 2007 SKS Prius. My experience with black non-SKS key fob from EBays has been exactly the same. I got the fob programmed to start the car, but not to unlock the doors."

    Does anyone else have experience with this specific instance? I've noticed that there are a few slightly different sets of instructions for programming other keys, and that DIY programming can be glitchy, so I'm not sure how much to buy into these quotes. I'm also wondering, if you can't program it yourself, what the likelihood is of a dealer being able to make the two fit. If that's a good possibility, I'll probably just buy a non-SKS key off ebay and give it a go myself before handing it over to a dealership.

    Thanks
     
  2. froboy67

    froboy67 New Member

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    It appears after spending another half hour looking around the forums that the fourth conclusion is:

    4) You can program a non-SKS key to partially work in an SKS car: The car will turn on/off with the key inserted, but the remote door locking buttons on the fob will not work. This also appears to be true for programming SKS keys for non-SKS cars.

    I'm still curious whether or not anybody knows if a dealership might have better luck programming the door part of the key, or whether that's simply the consequence of trying to mix and match SKS and non-SKS. Some people mentioned that as a possibility but I didn't find any tangible reports of successes or costs.

    I'm also curious whether or not having a spare, mismatched key would make things less complicated if I were to lose my original SKS system. Unless I'm mistaken, it appears that the rumor that you have to pay for a new car computer system if you lose all your keys is false, but it still seemed like a hassle. It doesn't seem likely that I'd be able to have a dealer program a new SKS key from a non-SKS key, even for an SKS car... But I figured I'd ask.
     
  3. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    The black and silver keyfobs have completely different circuit boards in them, and they communicate with different protocols. They do share the same transponder chip, which is why you can use either type plugged into the dash.

    Both SKS and non-SKS vehicles have the "Body" computer, which is documented as handling the non-SKS keyfob button signals. The SKS vehicles have an additional ECU that handles communications with the SKS keyfob for the button and proximity functions.

    Now, the interesting question is whether or not a SKS vehicle could recognize a non-SKS keyfob. One of the setup parameters for the Techstream scantool is which type of key system is in use. If a mechanic selected the non-Smart key system option, even though the car had it, what would happen? First guess is that it wouldn't work. Next guess is that it could really mess up the existing smart key registrations. But the real answer is that nobody has reported what happens. And I doubt that you could convince anyone in a Toyota dealership to even try it.
     
  4. froboy67

    froboy67 New Member

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    Interesting... Good call Rob. You think my chances might be higher if I attempted to program an SKS key for an SKS car? I know SKS functions would not be possible, but it seems like I might have a good shot at at least getting the door lock/unlock buttons to work. The plus to that would be if I were to give up, I could always have the dealer do it... I was operating under the assumption that buying an SKS key online would be significantly more expensive, but the cost difference seems to be minimal.

    I think I'll just go for that, since there doesn't seem to be much to lose. Let you know what I find!
     
  5. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    I have 4 SKS keyfobs plus a non-SKS keyfob for my SKS car. In order to program the 2 used SKS keyfobs, it was necessary to do a "Smart Code Reset" with a Techstream scantool. A reset was required for each used keyfob. Additionally, the transponder in the non-SKS keyfob was registered, but the buttons on that keyfob are useless. Actually, I replaced the transponder in an ordinary key with the one from the keyfob. So I have an ordinary transponder key that gets me in the door with the metal blade, and works to start the car when I put it handle-first into the keyslot.

    One use for the non-SKS keyfob case is as a replacement for a worn-out SKS keyfob case. A SKS keyfob with a damaged button can be fixed by transfering the circuit board and transponder to a non-SKS case. Anyway, hang on to a non-functioning keyfob because it may be useful for the parts sometime in the future.

    The price for programming keyfobs at Luscious Garage | Blog | Full Service Prius Key Programming is listed as $30 for a new keyfob, $100 for a used one. That's a lot better than anything I've seen at dealers.
     
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  6. froboy67

    froboy67 New Member

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    Rob,

    Thanks so much for all of your help. I have just a couple questions left...

    1) So you were able to reset a used SKS keyfob? I've read a lot about people having problems with used keyfobs. Some people have mentioned that the key seems to lock itself in to a car after being used a certain number of times (128 I think?)... Does this mean you were able to get around that? I have no idea what a Techstream scantool is, but I'm assuming a dealer would and I've heard that they don't believe you can reset a key once it's been used on another car.

    I forget what my other question was... I'll save that one for later haha.

    Thanks!
     
  7. froboy67

    froboy67 New Member

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    Rob,

    Never mind on that, I just read through some more threads and have learned a little about what you were saying. Thanks!
     
  8. redcoral

    redcoral Junior Member

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    Rob,

    Could you describe exactly what you mean by putting the transponder in "an ordinary key" that works in the keyslot? Does the handle fit in the keyslot well, or do you have to hold it there while you start?

    By the way, what does your "ordinary key" look like? Do you have pictures, an item number, or a link to somewhere that the same "ordinary key" could be purchased? I'm sure there are many of us who would like the function of your modified key, but don't want to have to resort to using separate keys for the door and ignition or some sort of duct tape and crazy glue home-made device that looks like it belongs in an episode of MacGyver.:eek:
     
  9. redcoral

    redcoral Junior Member

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    Rob,

    Did you use a regular Toyota transponder key? I saw some on ebay for about $10 listed as "Toyota Transponder Key - 4C Chip". Would it be correct to assume that you just opened up an old non-SKS keyfob and put its transponder inside the "ordinary transponder key" to replace its original chip, then programmed it to start the car with the instructions posted elsewhere on PriusChat?

    If this is what you did, then it is exactly what I had in mind for my own emergency spare key!

     
  10. RobH

    RobH Senior Member

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    You got it. I tried a variety of transponder keys, including a Gen1 Prius key, a Camry (4C?) key, and a 4D-67 transponder that I ordered from China. No luck. Then I got a black logo keyfob cheap ($20?), registered it in the ordinary way (key in dash only). Next I broke open the keyfob and took out the transponder chip.

    The transponder chip is all you really need for the ignition. At one point I just taped it to a pencil, pressed it into the keyslot, and it all worked just like it was the keyfob. The only hitch is that the keyslot normally locks the keyfob into it, and you have to release the keyslot by pressing it after you turn the car off.

    So I butchered one of the transponder keys that didn't work, and put the transponder from the keyfob in the plastic holder that was left. I destroyed the rubber molding figuring out where the transponder was. I could probably do a better job with another key blank, but it's adequate for my purposes.

    Note that the transponder doesn't work if it's just taped to a metal key head. Apparently it has to be away from too much metal. The sensor in the keyslot is on the bottom of the slot at the back.

    Note also that this applies to Gen2 only. The Gen3 doesn't have a transponder in the keyfob. The Gen3 seems to use the ordinary signaling, with enough power picked up inductively from the Power button. I've tried just a bare Gen3 circuit board (removed from the case & battery removed), and it works next to the Power button.
     
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