VW vs Toyota for reliability?

I can't comment personally; but I do recommend you take a look at the Consumer Reports reliability charts for VWs. While I have mixed feelings about other aspects of C.R.'s car reviews, I've found their data on car reliability (Taken from their membership over the years) extremely useful.

Actually, I looked at the CR reliability data on a couple of VW models (particularly those that had diesel engines); it was not generally very good. The Golf showed a large number of problems even after 2 years; I think the Jetta was similar.

On the other hand, I have a friend who bought a diesel Golf this year; he felt the poor C.R. data reflected problems with much earlier Golf models, and that the newer models (which have been significantly redesigned) do not have these problems. He also felt that using the older data for older models in C.R.'s "reliability calculation" didn't really reflect the new model's reliability.

I can see where he's coming from, but for myself, I'd rather have both long-term and short-term data, and figure it out for myself.

 

I don't own a VW but my father-in-law does. It too is a Jetta TDI, though I think that it is 1-2 years older that your partner's. Hasn't had any problems the last couple of years but it did have a rocky start: including an engine fire due to a loose wire and a total engine failure in the 1st 2 years. All covered under warranty and no problems since but a pain in the neck at the time.

We actually looked at the Jetta TDI ourselves but after discussing the above problems and not knowing about the tailpipe emissions including particulates (a problem with many diesels) we opted for the Prius instead. Availibility was about equal for both in our area. I seem to recall that Consumers Report also does not have much nice to say about VW reliability.

Jon

 

My mother-in-law had a new bug. It was horrible with reliability. She sold it a few years after she bought it after the repairs were more expensive than the cost of the car. That is the only experience I have with VW.

 

Well, I guess I'll try to answer this one, as I own both a '04 and an '02 Prius and a '01 VW Jetta TDI. The short answer is that to date, the Toyota's have been more reliable then the Jetta. Nothing bad enough to make me not want to own a Jetta, but just a few problems. The TDI's have been suffering from carbon build-up in the intake manifolds due to the EGR system and the PCV system design. There is a mixture of oil-laden air entering upstream of the EGR valve. When the air hits the exhaust gas in the intake, a oily sludge forms that almost plugs the intake around the 50k mile mark. There is an easy workaround to fix this problem. Mass airflow sensors have been another problem area (short service life). VW is now warranting them for 70K miles. Also, short timing belt life (50K miles on automatics, 60K miles on manuals). A timing belt failure can destroy a lot of parts in the engine. The timing belt change is difficult and expensive but the replacement belts have a longer service life. The worst thing about owning a VW is having to deal with a dealer for service. I think, as a group, they have to be the worst in the business. When the Jetta is running right, it's great---I'll bet your partner is getting similar fuel economy to your Prius---probably a little better then you on the highway and a little worse then you in the city if he has a 5-speed. Everything you want to know (and some things you might not want to know) about Jetta TDI's are on www.tdiclub.com or for non-diesel VW's at www.vwvortex.com.

 

Volkswagen has had it's share of issues. It's been my understanding that the lion share of the massive problems have been related to power window regulators, and the coil packs used on the VR6 and 1.8T engines. Timing belts are now up to a 100k service interval on new vehicles.

VW has apparently been working on the problems, and has been warranting the repairs with redesigned parts. New power window regluators were issued last summer, and redesigned coil packs were issued via recall shortly thereafter. The MAF sensor is an updated part as well.

A friend of mine has a Golf TDI, and has had very good luck with it. As for VW products, I look at them the same as I do a domestic one - buy the most basic model you possibly can. Doing so will eliminate the majority if issues that effect their products.

 

A coworker wanted to buy a new Passat (last year). After extensive research into the car and problems that owners were experiencing, he changed his mind and bought a Honda Accord.

The coil problems were the killer for him. It seems that the manufacturer of the coil was implementing VW's design and told them that the coils would fail prematurely. VW didn't listen to them and went ahead with production. Owners were experiencing failures repeatedly. Some coils failed even before the car's repair was completed. Dealers were installing replacements at such a high rate, the supply of coils dried up and cars were sitting waiting for parts.

If VW hasn't replaced every coil in those cars, which cover several years, they're going to have a generation of buyers that won't be back.

 

I traded a 2002 GTI 1.8T for my 2004 Prius. The GTI is a very nice car; handles great, acceletares great, interior materials quality is much better than the Prius' and the car has a number of standard features that are optional or unavailable in the Prius. Overall it is a "better" car.

However, in 23,000 miles the regulators of both windows failed (five trips to the dealer), the radio stopped working once (one trip), the battery failed (one trip), and the gasoline pump failed (two trips). I was supposed to change the coil pack but I traded the car in after the dealer (and service shop) closest to our house went out of business.

Toyota reliability is better, much better.

 

No more Vw's

First of all. I love VW's. I have had several, including two Rabbits of yesteryear. My last VW was a 2002 Jetta wagon. I initially loved the car but tired of it soon after having to make repeated trips to the dealer to have various issues dealt with - inoperable sunroof 2X, broken console, dead battery, inoperable fuel filler door, clogged fuel injectors. All of those things were fixed under warranty, but in a car with less than 20,000 miles, it did not feel like I was driving a new car at all. I have since switched to a new Prius which has been amazing. I really feel as if I'm driving a reliable, well thought-out new vehicle. Therefore, I do not recommend that you spend your hard earned money on a VW. For a similar amount of money, you can have a Prius!

 

Disregard this posting please.

 

I have both a 07 Prius and 06 Jetta TDI. The Prius has 15,000 miles and the Jetta has 21,000 miles. No problems maintenance wise with either one.

 

NO more VW's for me

I don't think I'd buy another VW these days. My wife has a 99 Passat and, like a typical German car, it is over-engineered. We are always afraid something will go wrong with it, and when it does, be ready to take out a second mortgage on the house. I also had a 99 323 BMW Cabrio that I sold for the Prius, and while I loved the car and it was huge fun to drive, I was never 100% comfortable driving it for fear something would go wrong. Now my Prius is another story. I have had it 4 months, put over 8k on the odometer, no problems, and I don't worry about it. I am, however, looking for an independent mechanic in the SF east bay area (Contra Costa County).

 

Art's Automotive is located in Berkeley

http://artsautomotive.com/

I haven't been there, but they have some good info on their website.

 

I know this post is old; however I came across it today and I thought I would add my own input. I do not own a Prius so I can not speak directly for their reliability. But I do/have own/ed VW's. A 1980 Rabbit, 1989 Fox, 1996 Jetta and now a 2011 Jetta TDI wagon. All previous vehicles were retired with well over 200K miles. They've all been 4cyl/ 5spd cars. The '80 and '89 had no power accessories. The '96 is well optioned, with some of the electronic components beginning to fail (The car has 230K miles on it now) The build and interior quality of all the cars is /was excellent. The exterior finishes were never any good. (They've all be gray, and the '96 has been repainted once). When I went to replace the '96 I looked and a hybrid Lexus and Nissan Altima, among others.The Nissan was larger than the Lexus and cheaper so I rented one for 3 weeks to get a feel for it. I was rather disappointed with the performance and fuel economy. The Nissan averaged 29 mpg over 2200 miles, with 1/2 of that coming from a long trip, the other day to day driving. As a comparison my '96 averages 34mpg I also have a '60 Rambler station wagon with a 6cyl, 3spd and overdrive that averages 30 mpg on long trips.
My TDI has averaged 42 MPG with mostly around town driving. (I've only had it for a few weeks). Given my experience with VW's and the relative conventional nature of the drive train, I bought another VW. I hope this information proves useful.

Steve

 

I don't think these are fair comparisons. What engine and transmission were in the 96 Jetta? What was its curb weight and amount of power vs. the Altima?

Recent Altimas are a minimum of 170-175 hp are are classified as midsized cars per Side-by-Side Comparison. The 96 Jetta is classified as a compact car and has FAR less passenger volume.

There has been a trend of car size, weight and power bloat over time since per http://www.epa.gov/oms/cert/mpg/fetrends/420s10002.pdf and Minicars? I don't See No Stinking Minicars - Column - Auto Reviews - Car and Driver.

 

I've heard many anecdotes, but those aside the numbers from consumer reports and others like it indicate that VW quality is quite bad, in fact in CR VW is about as bad as it can get, I think it's similar to Chrysler (maybe not that bad).

They used to have a history of quality, though.

 

i love these 'through the years' posts. i had a 1980 vw rabbit and spent most of my weekends repairing it. i'm sure it's no different 30 years later. german cars are over engineered and complicated.

 

Being a mechanic and owning both vehicles, think I'll bite on this one. I have a 2006 TDI New Beetle and a 2010 Prius II. Both cars are outstanding and I have no regrets. All vehicles have to be maintained and repaired.

The only problems with the VW were Brake light, one window regulator, headliner peeling off and glove box latch. First three were under warranty or recall, the last was misuse. It has +70,000 miles, life time 42 mpg actual and is a very reliable car. This is now my Son's first.

Have had no problems with the Prius, so far. It now has 9500 miles, life time 53.1 mpg actual (after the winter hit) and is also a very reliable car. Going in this week for second oil change/tire RB and first alignment check.

Because it will be asked, the TDI was chosen because diesel was $0.80 less than gas then, the '06 Prius EPA figures were over estimated and I was still put off about the HV battery replacement cost. Additionally, the 16 Toyota Dealers within my 100 mile radius were no stock, there was a 2 month wait with limited choices, $3000 over MSRP and I was made to feel they were doing me a favor at that.

FWIW, think I was better off waiting for the Gen III and fortunate to have purchased when supply was high and price was low. Thanks again to everyone helping with this decision.

 

The '96 Jetta is a 2.0l /5sp car the Fox and Rabbit had similar sized engines 1.8-2.0L all were fuel injected. The Fox was the lightest and the Jetta the heaviest. The Jetta is a well optioned GLS model and the Rabbit was a convertible which necessitated additional metal to maintain a rigid structure.
All pieces of machinery need maintenance and occasionally they need more than that. Simple maintenance (oil changes, belts, brakes, out of warranty) was/is generally done myself using factory parts. More complex procedures were left to the dealer. I've never once been stranded by any of my cars and dealer repairs were generally about 1K to 1.5K for the life of the car (timing belt $650, clutch ($800) and window regulator ($250) for the '96. The cruise control stopped working in '02 and I never had it fixed, a few months ago the passenger rear window stopped working too, but I planned on replacing the car in a few months so I neglected to repair it as well.

Your right a Nissan Altima is larger than a Jetta and a Lexus IS 250h. In fact it is about the same size as my Rambler. It was also an automatic. If I can routinely obtain fuel consumption between 34 and 36 mpg from my compact I expect 28-32 from conventional mid-size car, only to be improved by technology that consumes no fuel at idle or low speed, when a gas engine is least efficient.

I've never paid much attention to CW, I have friends that do and they end up with a beige Honda year after year (compared to my gray Volkswagen's).

I also own a diesel truck ('05 Dodge) and before that I had a '98. Both trucks were rated poorly by CW. The reviews said they were loud and rode poorly. I hate to break to CW, but they were/are diesel powered pickups, generally meant for work, not for commuting. The '98 had a 187K miles when it was traded in for the '05.

Finally I realize this is a forum for Prius owners and advocates. I have no agenda nor do I wish erode someones positive convictions in a particular manufacturer. I'm saying my experience ,not yours regarding VW's has been positive and if I were alone in my experience I would not have been able to buy 3 cars from the same VW dealer in 25 years, as they would have folded sometime during the Reagan administration.

Thanks,
Steve

 

Did you mean Lexus HS 250h? I misread your post and am now unsure if you rented an Altima Hybrid or a non-hybrid Altima w/unknown engine (2.5L I4 or 3.5L V6).

From looking at 1996 Volkswagen Jetta GLS Sedan 2.0L 4-cyl. 5-speed Manual Features and Specs, your Jetta had 115 hp and weighed only 2723 lbs.

Altima 2.5 is 3180 lbs. with 170 or 175 hp and the NAH is 3470 lbs. w/198 net hp. The Altima is >17 inches longer and 4 inches wider besides being in a larger size class. So, I'd again assert it's still not a fair comparison.